Continuing support group for those affected by someone else's drinking

[pointythings]

Our current thread is nearly full, and it's too valuable to lose in the mists of time, so this is thread 2. Come here if you are struggling with a loved one's drinking - partner, parent, child, friend, there's support for you here no matter which person in your life is struggling with the drink and having an adverse impact on you. The women on here have all been there or are still going through it. We support and advise each other, we don't judge, we listen.

Original thread here to refer back to: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/alcohol_support/4581221-support-group-for-those-affected-by-someone-elses-drinking

Oh @pleasecomment that's hard. It's hideous to watch people you love (or want to/used to love) choose destruction and oblivion. And you just can't get through to them.

Here, you're in the company of people who have seen the very worst of addiction, yet still get up every day and choose life, as you do. You can sit down and listen, or stand up and talk, pour it out or ask for advice. As pointythings mentioned, everything can be said here. I hope that feeling less alone helps you.

@pleasecomment Hello, it must be so hard when it is family, I've made the choice to walk away from my husband, and can make it 'legal' by divorce. I feel so much for my sister in law who is housing him at the moment, she said to me that she could not see him on the streets without anyone. I think she is better at detaching, and maybe he's hit his rock bottom.

Talk and rant here, I have learnt so much, and personally the support of an anonymous community has held me accountable when I've been struggling with the head over heart dilemma.

@pleasecomment I think the envy you describe is perfectly normal. I lost my mum (to cancer) when I was 29 and feel forever "cheated" in some way that she's not been there to see my kids and be part of their life, never mind mine!

I also feel a kind of envy when I'm at work or out surrounded by what seem to be great husbands /dads. Meanwhile my own DH has been comatose on the sofa for coming up to 5 weeks and even when sober is not the man he used to be.

I think a lot of others feel that pain too but tend not to speak about it but just give a bland smile while friends are describing these events with wider family.

It’s hard but you’re strong.

Absolutely I feel the envy. I’ve just been away with a group of old friends, all in long established relationships, and it made me sad that I did not have that. But on the flip side, these friends have whole heartedly been there for me over the last few months after I made the decision to push him out of my life. So hold on to the family and friends you have X

I feel sad when I remember the man I married and know that we won't be growing old together in the way I envisioned before the alcohol took hold.

I would say that if you are struggling with your feelings, don't bottle it up. There is support out there, it doesn't have to be Al-Anon - other groups exist too and might be more suitable.

My best mate. He's 44 and I now can't see him making it to his next birthday. He needs a stick as his balance is so poor, and the nerve pain in his feet is almost unbearable.

He started the process to detox 11 months ago. He's really gone downhill in that time. He been offered a place in rehab, but has to go before a panel to try to get funding. He's up against 5 other people.

If earlier help had been available, he'd be dry and a lot healthier. He's stayed absolutely committed to the rehab process, despite how slowly the cogs turn. I'm starting to think it's going to all happen too late now.

@pleasecomment It's garden centres that gets me. Or used to. I wanted to have a mum to go to the garden centre with. Talk about plants, tell me what should go where.

I don't know what it's like to have a mum. In the same way that I don't know what it's like to have sisters. Sure, I know other people have sisters, but I personally don't know what that's like.

I am so glad to hear you have an amazing DH. Pleased to say my partner is amazing too.

You have done so much for your family, you couldn't have done any more than you have. I am genuinely relieved to hear you say you are at total peace with the responsibility being out of your hands. That is a really graceful and beautiful thing.

Can I join in please?
I’ve been lurking and reading since the previous thread, and have been so impresssed by the compassion and fabulous advice given here by posters with personal experience. With iI full disclosure, I’m also active on the “Married to someone with Asperger’s/ASC” threads, and reading the Dementia/Alzheimer’s threads, because I’m not sure how they all intermingle. I was also a psychiatric nurse in the late 70’s- 90’s, so I have some, probably out of date, understanding.

There’s so much to say

My 68 year old husband is drinking at least 75 units a week, sometimes more. Mostly red wine at home, with the occasional pint of cider or bitter at the pub. He tells any medical professionals who ask that he drinks 15 units a week.

He’s always been a big drinker, and I think he uses it to self medicate. His drinking has increased hugely since he retired 6 years ago, and also increased hugely again over covid lockdowns.
We’ve now reached the stage where he sleeps for at least 2 hours during the morning/ early afternoon, starts drinking at 2.30pm, has a couple of short sleeps in the late afternoon, then sleeps from 7 til 9pm after his tea and then goes to bed.
He gets up very early (usually 5am but it has sometimes been 3am, and makes enough noise to wake the dead - and me, despite separate rooms, me upstairs and him downstairs.)

He’s often confused, memory is appalling, but I’m never sure whether that’s the drink or general cognitive decline. Or a heady mixture of both. And he most definitely confabulates, making up a story to fill the gaps in his memory, and has real problems finding the right words.

A couple of months ago, after I’d gone to bed, he was pissed and fell, cutting his head, banging his arm and being incontinent of urine. I couldn’t move him and had to call 111 who sent an ambulance. The paramedics were great and carted him off to A&E, where, apparently, his bloods were fine. There’s been no follow up from his GP as far as I know. There was a similar incident 3 years ago when he fractured his collarbone.

Obviously he says he wasn’t drunk, he tripped over the rug, the dog, his slippers.

I could write reams, but I’ll stop now. Sorry it’s long and thank you if you’ve read this. Any advice welcome, also just support and understanding.

I’m not glad to be here, but I am, if you know what I mean,

@Bluebellforest1 It might be early onset Alzheimers or even Korsakoff Syndrome or it might just be that he is permanently drunk. You can keep on looking for reasons and for answers but to be honest it is unlikely you'll find them. If he is self-medicating he won't be treated for depression until he stops drinking and if he is lying to the doctors he's clearly in too much denial to be anywhere near that. You might want to consider giving up on searching for reasons for his behaviour and start focussing on what you want from life going forward. It doesn't seem as if he is adding any value to your life at all and walking away for your own health and sanity is a reasonable option.

Has anyone heard of/had any experience with naltrexone? Keep seeing it mentioned as a sort of 'ozempic for alcohol'. I'm naturally suspicious of anything touted as a wonder drug but it's causing me some anxiety – could it really have been so simple? One pill could have saved us years of heartache and stress? Should I have known about this? Why didn't I? It's playing on my mind.

The idea seems to be it takes away the buzz of alcohol, making it feel less rewarding. Maybe the hardcore addict then finds another way to get their buzz, I don't know. When my mother didn't drink/drank less, she was compulsively spending, or addicted to television. And she seemed to have first become suicidal after three months off drink anyway, so I don't really know if it would have changed anything. Maybe if she had had it years ago, it could have prevented some of the alcohol-caused brain damage/changes I think she had.

Couple of Times/Telegraph links for anyone interested:
https://archive.ph/aCKgN
https://archive.ph/8i6U6

Hi I’m new here. I was just going to have a read but I feel compelled to write something having seen this post. My mums an alcoholic and my dad is an enabler, he is also driving himself mad. It drives me mad to see it. Last time we visited, I asked her not to drink around my kids. At some point she asked him to go and get her a Coke from the shop. I knew what was happening. He didn’t even waver, just got up then half an hour later she heard him come home, leapt up and they were round the back of the house and I could here glass chinking. I just felt so upset and let down particularly by him. I’ve long since accepted that she’ll let me down. The reason I felt compelled to write is because I’ve not come across people talking of an enabling father before, I always feel alone in this situation. I suppose because men are historically less likely to stick around in a caring role perhaps, not sure. But anyway thank you for posting

Hello @PruBerry I'm so sorry. I know you feel alone, but you're not alone here. There are a fair few of us with alcoholic mothers.

That was really shitty of your dad, but yes, he is thoroughly caught up in the madness. Do you see him as having a drink problem too, or does it seem to be more about keeping the peace, and creating some sort of charade that if he's having a drink with her, then it's all ok?

My dad never drank with my mum, that would have really upset me. But he did buy her wine. You know what, I occasionally bought her wine too, like after she came out of hospital for cancer surgery. I wish I hadn't, but I couldn't deal with the hassle if I refused. It sends you mad.

Personally I struggle with the concept of stopping enabling. It seems... impractical. And extremely difficult to achieve, when two lives are intertwined. It's meant well but seems to place blame on the people around the alcoholic. Yes, my dad enabled my mum, he kept the house running, paid all the bills and never allowed her to reach rock bottom. I wanted him to leave her, but by doing so, he would have lost everything that made his life bearable. The house he loved, possibly the dogs too. And in today's world, it's not possible to cut off another adult's access to credit cards and taxis to buy more drink. I had minimal contact with my mum but I love my dad, I couldn't not see him. I couldn't lose my other parent. So I was still on the fucking rollercoaster too. Maybe I still am. It's only been two months.

Maybe I have it wrong, and 'stopping enabling' isn't some perfect standard, and it's more about drawing the boundaries that you can live with, both practically and morally. I don't know.

My post isn't advice, because I have no answers. But there are other people here with more wisdom and insight who can help you. Sending love and understanding.

My mum was an alcoholic too. My dad was actually her anchor; while he was with her and well, she wasn't dysfunctional at all and didn't drink excessively. When he developed Parkinson's and dementia, she was lost. After his death, she drank herself into full blown Korsakoff's. The confabulation and difficulty finding words are sadly strong indications that this could be happening.

All you can do is consider where your limits are and how yoj can best preserve your sanity. It isn't easy. My dsis and I had to take some decisions that looked callous from the outside. We got slated fir it by my mum's neighbours, but not by her carers who knew what was going on. It's a hard road.

@pointythings and @amlie8 thank you for replying.

No he doesn’t drink with her or at all really. She mostly only drinks in secret unless it’s an occasion where everyone is drinking like a wedding in which case she will get paralytic. When I said I heard the chinking I meant it was the bottles being unloaded from a bag I think. He is a very kind person and I agree, there is no way for him to stop the enabling, she’d make his life hell and I don’t think he’ll ever leave. I’ve become more angry recently at how much he’s willing to sacrifice me and my kids to keep her happy but maybe I’m being unkind. Also I can’t cut her out of my life without cutting him out as you said which means I have to ride this rollercoaster. It’s a mess right now though

@PruBerry Ah, I'm sorry, I misunderstood about the clinking. Oh it's an impossible situation. I feel for you, and know it.

You can't help the way you feel. I don't think you're being unkind at all. Trying to get through to an alcoholic is like bashing your head against a brick wall. There's no reasoning with them, there's no real communication. They shut down any attempt to get through. Frustrating is an understatement. And so you want to get through to the person who still has some sanity left (your dad) but that's increasingly difficult too. Because he didn't stick to the boundary. It just adds to the anger.

It might be that you can find some practical ways to see your dad while minimising contact with her. Visit in the morning, even. Get out of the house, to a park or something. And if you can, reiterate to him that there is to be no drinking while your kids are around. I know, even finding these workarounds feels like sort of giving in to it all but you love your dad and you are doing your best with a really shit situation.

Looking for advice, please be gentle, I'm struggling with the entire situation at the moment.....Does anyone have experience of decompensated liver? Alcohol related of course in this thread.

My DM got the Diagnosis about 18months ago. Stable for a while then recent hospitalisation for bleeding varicies and significant blood loss (major haemorrhage activated). Found out due to alcohol consumption which was an unknown until we left in the ambulance ; 2-4 units a day for at least a few months.

My question is 2-fold really:

1. she is due to see the consultant this week and I intend on taking her. What questions should I be asking to get a better idea of her current health and prognosis, life-style changes, current fragility of her health etc so we can help to manage and plan for her and my DF.

2. she is outwardly doing ok, she is older (mid-70's) so there's that, but can get about independently, cook meals etc. my DM & DF occasionally look after my children (2 x primary age) for a weekend. Given my DM's health and potential to have a drink (if she does have a drink doesn't have many), and my DF doesn't when the kids are there, what are the risks of them having the kids for occasional sleepovers? They are asking to have them again and the kids like to go, and also my exH doesn't have them often so I appreciate the break. Am I putting the kids in danger?

Happy to answer questions as needed to help answer, this is all quite new to me and naively, prior to the recent hospitalisation we all believed DM had abstained for the last 18mnths (with 1 lapse about 4months in).

Welcome, to one of the most supportive corners of MN. We are always gentle here, we know what it’s like.I don’t know anything about decompensated liver, though. But I would think you need to learn more about your DM s prognosis, and that will help make decisions about sleepovers. It’s very positive that you trust your df to care fore the children. You need to be aware that simply abstain may no longer be an option for your Dd. Sudden withdrawal can have very serious, possibly fatal consequences, and it may be that she will need a medically supervised detox. It is lovely that your children like to see their grandparents, a real bonus given that alcoholism can so badly affect family relationships. Wishing you well,

Decompensated liver is serious and end stage, and it means your mother cannot drink at all, ever again. Any drink she has is piling damage on damage. 2-4 units a day is very dangerous for her.

However, if your father can be trusted with your DC, and if you can put robust emergency plans in place, I don't see that sleepovers would be a huge problem. You would always have to have backup childcare in place to pick up in case of a health emergency, but if your DC and their grandparents have a close relationship you can probably make it work.

Be prepared though - if your mother keeps drinking at this rate, she will not live for very long with that level of liver disease.

Placemarking, I will come back and read later. Best wishes to all of you.

Does anyone know if raised CRP can be a sign of alcohol related damage please?

Raised CRP alone can have very many causes - inflammation or infection is usually the main one. Inflammation can be caused by alcohol misuse, so if you know someone is drinking very heavily then it's a possibility, but there are many other causes too so it isn't conclusive.

My husband died this afternoon, maybe suicide. I am devastated.