Putney Pusher suspect found dead, according to reports

[Fartughtyred]

Goodness me, wasn't expecting that.

Its interesting that you feel it's ok to denegrate and - what - collectively condemn and punish people on the basis of their sex. Do you also think its OK to do so on the basis of their race, or religion?

Yes you probably do.

I think they wanted it speeded up. People who think he's guilty ought to agree with that, if he were guilty surely the quicker he's convicted the better?

That looks much more like him, the other one looked so different I'd have ruled him out.

However, it's all pixels! If we think that is a good then I guess he's off the hook because there's no tattoo or scarring on his leg.

I think it's not a good shot. It's pixilated enough you can't rule him out but equally pixilated enough that you can't say it's him, either.

I think, personally, the only bit of verifiable evidence to exonerate him would be the tattoo.

The eye colour - people's eyes change colour with light and mood, and I'm not sure I would feel confident in the witnesses report on that, given the situation.

Wasted calf......I'd want to see photos of what that actually meant before I compared to the scene photos.

Email - could have been set up on a timer. Especially if he knew he wanted to go for a run that morning so wouldn't be in until later (later, not late necessarily) but, say, a client was waiting for something? Better evidence would be someone emailed him around that time and he replied, and the email can be shown to come from the office and not his phone (for example). It may be that is the evidence that has been put forward of course. Preferably several emails. And someone else was in the office at the same time as him and saw him (though they might not remember of course), and a swipe entry card record (actually, why haven't they mentioned that, all banks have those!).

But the tattoo - that's pretty definitive. Though, in some of the scene photos it does look like runner has a tattoo. You'd also need to have information on when he got it done of course.

I suspect it was the drug possession that was more likely why the police had not NFA'd him. While we know bankers all indulge, if they get a criminal record for it they are likely to lose their job.

The PP is referring to suicide in a very specific circumstance as cowardly, not casting judgement on everyone who does so.

Abstracting from this case (since his guilt has not been established) and speaking in more general terms, would you allow that someone who suicides to escape justice for heinous crimes is behaving in a 'cowardly' way? Or do you think that descriptor is never appropriate in any circumstances?

i feel for the sisters

I sympathise with the sisters but that doesn't sound like a good idea. Any whiff that a suspect had paid towards obtaining evidence that exonerates them/weakens the case against them is going to make people think it was a bribe.

You’re probably right but it was taking the police a while and the we’ll have it soon but not doing that must have been hard. Especially if they could see his MH deteriorate.

I’m not too familiar with how the case developed, but which photos show that the runner has a visible tattoo, and where eye colour can be determined?

Also, what’s the deal with the emails? Is there an article that goes through all the evidence that has come to light, that you can link to?

None show the runner with a visible tattoo. That is the point. The man's sisters say he had a tattoo that would have been visible.

The eye colour cannot be determined from any of the images, but we are told that the victim said her attacker had brown eyes.

We have not seen the emails, but the dead man's sisters claim that he sent emails that clearly show he was in his office at the time of the incident.

Oh I don't doubt it was very tough on him and his loved ones, whether or not he did it.

Three months really isn't a very long time to essentially restart an investigation from scratch- we'd surely know by now if he'd been questioned back in 2017. There must've been former colleagues who needed to be found and interviewed too. But it's easier to look at these things practically when you're removed from them.

Watch the jury - I think it’s channel 4z. Eye opening and deeply worrying.

A pp has pointed out that if you look at photos of the man, not the CCTV, you can see the tattoo is on the inside of his arm so you wouldn’t necessarily be able to see it from that angle.

This is my point about the lack of a better alternative: we agree as a society to be judged by our peers, bring fellow citizens above a certain age without criminal convictions (and a few other restrictions). There’s no eligibility criteria based on intelligence or critical thinking skills or lack of prejudice or ability to stay awake or ability to concentrate and pay attention or willingness to do their best or ability to be honest etc. There are our co-citizens, they hold the our’ futures in their hands should we find ourselves in the dock. Some people don’t like it. But what else is there - because professional juries (eg on complex tax fraud cases in other jurisdictions) and judge as jury come with their own vast problems.

I don't think its clear that this poster and others are using the word in this context but i do understand what you mean.
Regarding the suicide death of someone guilty of a heinous crime i don't think i could celebrate their choice ,this would still be an act of desperation to me but i am not a 'bleeding heart' and i would just be relieved that they are no longer around.
Because there are so many terrible reasons why someone would take their own life i think i lean to the description never being appropriate.
It is one of the worst types of loss leaving so many questions and conflicting emotions behind ,who are we to describe suicide as cowardly, this ultimate act could be the bravest thing that the person doing it has ever done.

I wonder what the sisters have to say about their brother knocking a female cyclist off her bike with his Harley Davidson and just driving off.

Does look very much like him actually.

I'm baffled why people think they'll be DNA from an incident like that though. We work with the police closely at work and what one officer will say about the investigation is completely then contradicted by another. Just because the family think it was going to be tested or even could yield results Does not make it a fact

The witness said he had brown eyes, NB's are blue.

I can't say "which photo" looks like there's a tattoo, but one still from the video does at least. It may be a shadow and I'm sure the police have better images.

The email - his family say there was an email sent from his work email (importantly - in his office) that morning, around the time of the incident.

The links to various articles where their objections are noted are all in this thread.

That’s interesting.

If you were wrongly accused of such a despicable and reputation-ruining crime, wouldn’t you immediately supply the emails sent from your Mayfair office at the time of the crime, proof that you lived in a completely different neighbourhood, and the fact you got a tattoo before the date of incident?

Something just does not add up.

From what I heard on the radio this morning the family think there's dna because the police told them there's dna. Whether that's true, or a ploy on the part of the police to evoke a confession who knows? Likewise you can conjecture that the suicide was a response to the delay in processing the dna, or to fear of what processing it would show. All we know is that, at the time of his death, the police considered him still to be a suspect but not one they had enough evidence to charge. This being the case it's strange so many on here are convinced of his guilt beyond all reasonable doubt.

Well, that is what his family are saying he did, and the police were being slow and he was under immense pressure.

I don't think the police plot to be honest I think people under investigation genuinely make things up, misunderstand things, take something at face value which is actually more nuanced, any number of things. And of course the police get things wrong too.

This photo of the suspect shows the tattoo on his inner forearm - were any images of the pusher taken from a side that would show his inner right forearm? Those I've seen only show his outer right forearm.

Also, I appreciate that his legs are partially obscured by the bike but neither appears noticeably withered.

(Images under review at the mo)

I'm not saying he is definitely guilty but I don't see how the family's claims are helping to prove his innocence.