How do we ACTUALLY solve the rift between dog people and non-dog people?

[Talkingtomyhouseplants]

Inspired by yet another dog thread where all the SAME arguments are trotted out again and again:

The Pro Dog People say:

• The dog is my family, you need to treat it like family
• Why would I get a dog just to leave it at home?
• It’s just a dog, it’s not bothering anyone
• My dog is less annoying than your child
• I love my dog more than I love people
• The dogs are ALLOWED to be there so it’s okay that I bring them places
• If my dog isn’t invited, I would probably choose to stay home as I prefer most dogs to people anyway
• My house is my dog’s home too, I won’t be shutting it away for anyone
• My dog isn’t dangerous - he’s a bit softy.

The Anti Dog People Say

• I’m allergic/scared/don’t like being around them - please keep them away from me
• It’s a pet, not your family
• A dog is not a child
• I won’t have dogs in my house
• Dogs are dirty and unhygienic - they shouldn’t be in shops or places where you eat
• I’m sick of dogs barking and jumping up at me in public and I keep stepping in dog poo
• There are too many places that either actively allow dogs, or more often don’t challenge people who bring them anyway so dogs eventually become allowed
• Dog owners are entitled and pushy and this is why they are now suddenly everywhere
• It’s dangerous to have dogs around children
• Dogs can bite/kill people
• There are too many untrained dogs who are treated like people

Same arguments on both sides, every time.

In my personal life I can think of at least two situations where these opposing views are creating real rifts in families because the dog person wants to bring a dog, and the non-dog person doesn’t want to be around said dog. I can feel it becoming more polarising in society generally, anti dog people are more vocal about being anti dog and pro dog people are more pushy about full inclusion of dogs in human spaces.

So what is the actual solution?

Wonder what it is that makes dog owners more reasonable 🤔

@YeOldeGreyhound you are doing what so often happens and is a main cause of the problem and equating children playing - which they have the right and need to do developmentally in order to learn how to become people - with dogs barking. Do you see how this perpetuates the issue? You are suggesting a dog has as much right to bark as a child does to play

Should cows not moo? Kids can play, dogs can bark, cows can moo, birds can tweet. It’d be preferable, to many, if kids didn’t screech when playing but as long as parents think their kids are beyond reproach we all have to just live with it.

It’s not the same at all though - cows moo in fields, not on residential areas. It’s also a much less grating noise!

I know it was said in jest. As much as I love dogs I too get frustrated at people who let them off the lead to come up to your dog who is on a lead ! And don’t get me started on people who don’t pick up after them.

You do not like dogs. We get it.
Dogs bark as their main method of communication. How entitled do you have to be to insist another species is silenced to make you happy?

Your shrieking kids are not music to other people's ears, no matter how many times you tell that to yourself. No kid needs to scream.
You say barking dogs can frighten kids. Well, kids need to learn about everyday sounds that happen, and barking dogs is just that. Same as planes flying over, or loud motorbikes gong past.
It is different when there are sensory issues involved, and I get that. Because your shrieking kids upset me. Teach them to shut up so they don't freak other people out. No? Well, don't insist dogs should remain silent either.

It's not really about whether kids have more right to make noise than dogs or not. It's more about being considerate of others.

In a cafe - a kid screaming or a dog barking are both unacceptable.

In a garden in a built up area, a kid screaming or a dog barking a little bit is fine; a lot of at unsociable hours - neither is acceptable.

You started this thread to look for ideas of how to heal the rift. I'd say that people like you are the problem.

I totally agree with you!
You should not have to have a dog jumping up at you, especially if you are being kind enough to take the owner's kids out! Of course the dog should be kept away under those circumstances. I do the same with mine, who, for some reason, gets over-excited when the online shopping man comes!
But...if someone is coming for a long visit, I'm not going to keep him shut away for hours/days. The visitor has the choice not to come under those circumstances. I won't allow him to bother the visitor because I do understand not everyone likes dogs. He soon settles.
I was scared of dogs myself until I got mine. So I do get it. It's difficult to understand how much a part of the family they are if you are not a pet person. But as a dog owner I do have a responsibility to ensure he doesn't bother other people.

It’s not. You’ve just tuned out the sound that’s easiest for you to ignore. I get it, telling kids to play nicely is probably difficult.

Made perfect sense thanks

I’m not seeing the problem in just accepting a vast majority of dogs smell

DS can't go to our local cinema anymore as he has a dog allergy and they have a dog session there - why the fuck does a dog need to go to the cinema?
I love dogs and had them growing up but seeing them sat at tables in restaurants eating off plates, in shopping trolleys in supermarkets (Aldi last week, they sat it on a piece of cardboard and were furious when asked to remove it), shopping centres ... yes to pubs in the country where dogs are being walked and cafes
etc. but it really has got too much.

@Talkingtomyhouseplants, the rift in your family after 30 years of peaceful relationships,
is because a family member has a dog and
you object to them exercising their right to have a family pet. A pet that they are unreasonably imposing on you and doing all of the horrible things that dog people do and that you list in your opening post.

You say “I can feel it becoming more polarising in society generally, anti dog people are more vocal about being anti dog and pro dog people are more pushy about full inclusion of dogs in human spaces.”

I have not experienced this polarisation in society because of dogs. Yes because of other reasons like war, immigration, politics. But not because of dogs. 1st world problems! So much to worry about.

Yes, a kid playing noisily in a park. That is fine. A dog barking in a park. Fine too.
Either in a cafe. No, not acceptable.
But it seems OP thinks a dog barking anywhere should not be allowed, and a screaming kid should be allowed in a cafe.

Agree. I don't think they started this thread to genuinely try to figure out how to heal a rift. I think they wanted to be told they are right that dog owners are all irresponsible, dogs are annoying and their beloved child is more important than anything else 🙄

I have never once said a screaming child should be allowed in a cafe. I agree that is irritating. Another poster decided that’s what I thought and posted it

I do not object to them having a pet. I object to them constantly trying to bring it to my house or asking if it “would be okay” to bring the dog along to gatherings at other family members houses who do not have dogs, knowing my DH has a severe allergy and we have a young baby and repeatedly putting us in the position of having to be the bad guy and say no, or that we shan’t attend if they do

Dog people just need to respect the fact that not everyone wants dogs at family friendly events or restaurants and to make sure their dog doesn't interfere with others unless it is wanted.

I took my dog to places she was allowed.

Just because you can, doesn’t mean you should.

I think most dog people know all of this!

According to whom?
Because if my dog was welcome somewhere, then I was not doing anything wrong by taking her there. The cafe we used to frequent encouraged dogs. If you had a dog with you, would get 10% off of your order.

Well they don’t, because mutts are everywhere.

The business might “welcome” your dog 🤣🤣🤣 But not everyone loves your mutt and I can guarantee you most people are too polite to say it is an unwanted animal.

The dog haters going to a dog friendly cafe and expecting a dog free space are the problem.

Oh you don't want dogs to exist at all?! I thought you just didn't want them approaching you.
Yeah that's not going to happen, sorry