Why is one child so different when we have parented them alike?

[differentchildterribletwos]

How can one child be so different when we did everything the same??

3 girls: 11,9 and 7. All had the same formula milk, all had the same vaccines, all weaned at the same stage on the same food. All went to the same nursery at the same age. Baby and toddler classes etc. The same routines at bedtime etc.

Dd1 and 2 had their moments (terrible twos !) dd3 started early with the tantrums and they haven’t stopped. She is absolutely the hardest work and I don’t know what to do. Every day is screaming.

She has screamed every bathtime every time we brush her teeth or wash her hair. She screams if we are going out or staying in. She barely eats. Says most meals are disgusting and refuses 90% of all food offered.

Takes 2-3 hours to go to sleep (shouts from her room or repeatedly gets up)

We did everything the same yet she’s so different.

School say she is disruptive and she is behind in a lot of areas but they say she is capable. We asked if they thought she had SEN and they said no it’s a choice she’s making.

Im exhausted. Is this just a prolonged phase ? Has anyone had similar ? I feel bad for my older two as the behavior ruins any days out holidays or anything at home.

Paeds hcp here; lots of sensory needs being unmet. This is not a choice i can assure you. If you can, have an sensory intergrated occupational therapist to assess alongside another hcp referal for asd/adhd. Some NHS's have commissioned si ot's ours hasnt so would be a private one. The asd/adhd would be a specially trained provider.

Lots of mainstream schools just dont have the set up for nd children, and if she has difficulties at school that will compound the behaviours you are experiencing at home.

I have ADHD and so does my son (and possibly my daughter...)
I sometimes think people are quick on here to say "neurodiversity" but this time I 100% agree...sleep issues, loud, fussy with food, sensitive to clothing, clever but disruptive, fighting for autonomy all scream ADHD.
If the teacher won't refer, I would bypass them and go directly to senco or GP.
D
In the meantime look at resources for parenting ADHD kids. There is a great presentation by Russell Barkley on YouTube specifically for parents of ADHD kids (it's long, but you don't have to watch all in one go) he spent his whole career studying adhd.
One thing...he does talk "worst case scenario" for the 7 areas of "disfunction" because has has spent a long time trying to get ADHD taken more seriously...don't get too caught up in the negatives, very few people would be classed as "severe" in all 7 areas (if any) but the advice on how to parent the traits is fabulous. (I don't know if Mumsnet allows YouTube links, but will try and post in seperate comment)

Here's the link...

I’m guessing autism. She sounds exactly like my niece. It presents very differently in girls.

The thing is you can't and shouldn't parent them the same as different personalities require a different approach, and sensory issues, ADHD, PDA and autism certainly do.

In a weird way, she sounds as if she has a particular type of intelligence and a particular goal in life. Most 7 year olds haven't realised that parents and teachers can't, when push comes to shove, actually MAKE them do anything at all. DD has realised this, and her goal is to keep demonstrating that she knows. 'PDA' might be the diagnosis, but it doesn't matter that much what you call it, the thing is to recognise it and work with it somehow.

She sounds distressed and the school sounds shit.
I know it is exhausting, but...
try to stop seeing her as a problem to be solved/needing trained into the correct behaviour, and start reading about sensory sensitivity, PDA, ADHD and Autism. You don't need to diagnose her, and no-one here can, but you do need to empathise with her and advocate for her to get assessed and supported appropriately around whatever is making her so uncomfortable in the world.

My eldest was like this. Three sons now aged 40, 38 and 36. Eldest was difficult from birth - even the midwives were at one time convinced I’d gone home from the postnatal ward without him when he was 5 days old.
Every day was a struggle with him as he became a toddler - 7 tantrums a day, wouldn’t wear certain clothes, eat certain foods - and all the other things you describe! Neurodiversity was not recognised or discussed nearly so much in the 1980s and 90s of course but I realise now that some people who knew him saw it in him. I wonder if nowadays he would have been referred by the school for diagnosis but no one ever mentioned it directly. Academically he is quite bright so that probably masked some of his odd and difficult behaviour. DH and I are both teachers but not keen to get a ‘label’ for him. Fast forward to today and he’s married with a child but still exhibits classic ND signs. I always just say that his brain works differently from other people. He has a good job and is a lovely caring dad but I’m afraid he still has his moments!

Definitely worth exploring the possibility of a PDA profile alongside ASD or ADHD. As a parent of an ND child with PDA traits, Eliza Fricker’s books really helped me adapt my parenting strategies to make our home feel less like a conflict zone. The Family Experience of PDA is a good place to start.

The reality in our family is that we have to take different parenting approaches for each of our children (one diagnosed ND and one most likely NT). The underlying principles and values are the same but how we deliver the ‘message’ needs to flex. What resonates with one child might completely antagonise the other.

All human beings are different. Even when I pregnant with mine their personalities showed. My middle child never stopped moving, the bump violently swaying side to side 24 hours a day.
My middle kid is in super loud and active, screams noises to self soothe. Never shuts up never stops moving. He probably has ADHD but we haven't had him diagnosed because he is incredibly smart and breezing through school.
My other two were a LOT calmer and quieter from conception until this day. Same parents.
Also my parents were REALLY strict and mean and I remember being so flabbergasted that my brother was still naughty even though he knew he was going to get beaten. He couldn't really help it. I was so well behaved I was basically mute. Same parents.

She’s been able to hold good conversations since 3 she will listen to me, pause and then come out with something like ‘you just wasted a lot of time explaining that to me. I know it already, I know what I’m meant to do and why but I just won’t’ other times if I explain calmly why something is not ok she will scream and scream for me to stop as it makes her body hurt ?? It’s like on those occasions she feels guilty ? But it gives her a physical sensation she hates.

I think this is why it’s so hard as she can come across almost like she considers behaving well and then just says ‘no. Won’t do it’

At bedtime she follows the routine, does it perfectly her alarm goes off she goes upstairs, we read for a bit she seems calm then as soon as tooth brushing is mentioned the screaming starts . We tried changing it to earlier and then she just screams from the point of having to go to bed. In the morning she screams as refuses to get up 🤦

my sympathy OP, sounds difficult.

I guess the obvious answer is because she is a different person to your other two.

whether that’s a “choice” as the school say or whether she has SEN is hard to say from the info provided. Don’t take the schools word for it. They aren’t medical professionals able to make a diagnosis. You’ll have to push yourself with the GP.

She sounds to have SEND needs to me, talking as a SEND teacher and the parent of a teen with autism and PDA traits. The toothpaste used to be a huge trigger here too. Now we all use a 50p one from Morrisons as she will tolerate it. Your daughter sounds like she’s in a state of sensory overload.

Apologies if I'm repeating things, I don't have time to read the whole thread.

I'd get her assessed for autism and ADHD. She sounds like there are a lot of sensory issues and like she is demand avoidant.

I'm not saying she has PDA (pathalogical demand avoidance), from what you've said I think ADHD is more likely, but I would read about strategies for managing PDA. I think you'd find them useful while waiting for assessments.

I worked with children like this in school and it can be very challenging because they don't respond as you'd expect to the normal strategies of rewards and consequences. Don't be hard on yourself for struggling.

I love how everyone is screaming ND rather than considering that a 7 year old just needs better parenting 🙄

Consequences.

Thank you for saying this. My sister’s DS is much like your child. My kid is like the OP’s third child. They are so different, and my sister doesn’t understand why my DS doesn’t comply.
Having one child means we’ve been able to parent them in a way that suits us (co-sleeping etc…). My sister is the opposite, in that they are very routine / rules based. Works for them. Works for their child.
So, it’s interesting with OP’s third DD that the same type of parenting / home set up just doesn’t work for her. Can anything be adapted to meet her needs more? It’s hard, I wish my little guy would sit down, but he doesn’t!

She sounds like a very clever, self-directed and determined child. However the screaming sounds extreme. I would find that incredibly wearing.
Overall, whatever the reason for her difference - whether it is just a different, rebellious kind of personality or a ND diagnosis, it seems clear that she needs a completely different kind of parenting approach than your other children. What worked for them will not work for her.

They are born with different brains just like they’re born with different bodies.

She sounds autistic. My daughter is and so am I. Resistance to brushing teeth, hair, and eating is about the sensory experience if those things, which she finds overwhelming because she’s sensory sensitive. Resisting going out or coming home is about struggles with the transition between one thing and the next, which autistic kids find very difficult. She needs to be parented differently. I would get her assessed ASAP

My immediate thought was asd and maybe adhd. My son is similar he gets angry too and shouts he is 5yo and received diagnosis for asd this year. It’s a shame the school aren’t supportive of seeking diagnosis it’s not good enough really our school is great DS has an ehcp now

No, she’s 7

Have you heard of PDA (Pathological Demand Avoidance)?

I'm not a professional or qualified to diagnose. But some of what you say sounds very symptomatic of it. It's a profile of autism. I would go to the GP and maybe mention this and neurodivergence. You don't have to know what it is, just ask for an assessment.

She definitely needs some support and I can't believe school said it was a 'choice'. She might also need to change school if that's their attitude x

Remember: Behaviour is communication. She definitely needs some kind of assessment.Teachers are not psychologists but they do have access to educational psychologists and you can request this even without a diagnosis.

My DS was quite like this, he was eventually diagnosed ADHD, good luck.

Go to your GP and have anything medical ruled out.
Don't focus on the idea she is so different to her sisters- genetics is like that -you could have 10 children and them all profoundly different, also upbringing is never identicle- dd1 was an only child then on sib dd2 had one sib then 2 dd3 has 2 sibs from the beginning-that is 3 very different circumstances.

Don't tell me, you think we all have neurodiverse traits and there's no such thing as ADHD or autism without learning disabilities?

How are you defining "better parenting" because this parent hasn't written anything that suggests she doesn't know how to parent to me, just that she has a child who has some big sensory challenges, which is a key feature of autism.