Henry Nowak second thread, as requested.

[rolloverbeethoven]

www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5536249-henry-nowak?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=share

What is wrong with being kind to other people? Not every immigrant is a danger.

It was the murderer’s brother who called the police. To report Henry for a ‘racial attack’

The perpetrator was British. He didn't come here on a boat. Sikhs came to fight for the British in two wars and contributed hugely to this country. Their crime rate is tiny.

Comparisons to illegal immigrants are deeply distasteful and offensive to those of us from ethnic minorities who are as British as you.

What have boats or illegal immigrants got to do with this? Do you know nothing about Sikhs?

They are here because we invaded them. The anglo-Sikh wars. The British east India company invaded them, and won, dethroned their (14 year old) Maharaja and exiled him back to Britain. Thats what started Sikhs settling here. They fought with us as allies in both world wars. Then in the 50s, we brought loads over to fill labour shortages. And Sikhs integrated, and become solid parts of our communities. They don’t have a history of violence, religious or otherwise, they don’t have gangs running around or cause racial tensions or try to impose their own religious laws. Sikhs have literally never been an issue in Britain - after we attacked them and brought them here.
Sikhs are not illegal immigrants. They don’t “come over here and take over our laws” or whatever you think they are doing. They don’t come in small boats. How is this related to immigration?

The man who committed this crime was born and raised in Britain. He is more British than I am; I wasn’t born here - but I’m white with British family so you’d be ok with me, right?

They are not immigrants. What are you talking about?

Its not about the Sikh man it's about the attitude of the police to minority groups which is different now to their attitude to the non minority group

So fucking offensive. Anybody who is brown or black is now apparently an illegal immigrant. But anyone who looks white is fine! So Albanian criminal gangs: fine. Windrush people; not fine.

That’s not at all what your comment was about. Your comment was about small boats and immigration. Can you explain what that has to do with this man or the wider Sikh community, most of whom came here in the 50s and 60s because we needed the workforce, and the Sikhs we talk about today are their children and grandchildren (with some new migration by visa).

@Corianda
Oh, and those immigrants housed in “really nice hotels” are not housed in really nice hotels. They are housed in former nice hotels which have been converted into dormitories.

But I’d really like to know what immigrants (illegal I assume you mean) have to do with this?

I suspect that maybe they called the police as a cover story, in case someone else had already called an ambulance. So that there was a log of them saying they had been racially abused.

But agree it made no sense to restrain or handcuffs him when he posed no threat and couldnt move or breathe....even if they believed he had attacked them... he could have presumably had medical attention and had a police escort to hospital if they thought he was a risk, or guilty of a crime

Yes. There have been a number of posts today equating Sikhs with small boats.
Vile.

This. The whole thing is devastating & I’m so sad & sorry for Henry & his parents. Heartbreaking.

All the officers involved need to be sacked & prosecuted for dereliction of duty (if that’s possible).

This Sikh man was believed and sympathised with by the police because he was a member of an ethnic minority - this attitude is demanded by the Gov because there was strong criticism of the many immigrants who have been allowed to come here, (often due to the numbers) and the Gov think this criticism must be clamped down on so that has resulted in police being trained to be sympathetic to minority groups and no criticism is allowed. If the immigrants had not arrived and the boats did not cross the channel there would be no training of police to sympathise with ethnic minorities and they might have acted differently towards the dead victim.

I totally agree and mentioned it to DC today. At some point the police were going to realise that Henry Novak had been stabbed multiple times and then the lies would come tumbling down.

You’re so close to getting it.

This is a police training issue and a blind to the problems government issue (the previous one and this one).

It is not the fault of the people who come to the country. The blame lies solely with police training and government mandates, and party with societies behaviour as a whole.

It is not an immigration issue.

You’ve mentioned small boats - nothing to do with Sikhs.
Illegal immigration - nothing to do with Sikhs.
hotel converted into quite uncomfortable dormitories - nothing to do with Sikhs.

But given your comment about luxury hotels, you are clearly extremely ill informed and this is simple, old fashioned racism rather than your opinions being formed by actual fact. Maybe get some of those facts. I’m sure you had no idea that the Sikh community had a different immigration history to the current economic migrants. I hope you’ve at least taken that on board.

I am not dismissing the issues of immigration; there are a lot, especially for those communities with huge numbers being housed for processing. But you really need to actually learn about it, starting with your false narrative that they stay in luxury hotels. Those hotels have been converted into dormitories to fit as many as possible - it is not luxury or comfortable. The meals are not luxury. They do not qualify for benefits or financial support beyond a small payment of £10 a week (this may have changed).

I assume you are an adult with a brain. Start using it. You can start with not mentioning immigrants again when talking about what happened to this boy.

Hi, my very sikh grandparents emigrated here after the war in the 50s to bulk out the workforce. This, as other posters have mentioned, was very encouraged by the uk government. They were incredibly hardworking. My grandad worked 18 hour days in a factory, one day a stupid racist white man hit him on the head and my grandad got sacked after working for less money and for longer. Sikhs are in fact well known for being exceeding generous and kind people. Crime rate very low. Your comment about violence and interrivalry within Sikhs is ignorant racist uneducated uncultured nonsense. What happened to Henry was absolutely disgusting. Do not attempt to taint an entire culture and religion by the action of one man. Did you also used to say 'now...Im sure not not all muslims are terrorists but....'

What? So are the police also being trained to be sympathetic to Polish people? Or Albanians? They are also ethnic minorities.

The murderer’s brother is a piece of shit. At court today, look at him smirking.

That whole family are a stain. Something very very wrong with them, weapon obsessed, conscience free liars.
News yesterday said the erupted with shouting when Digwa was convicted yesterday, and argued with Henry’s family. They’re despicable.

Yet here you are calling me uncultured, ignorant, racist, uneducated. You know nothing about me but I know what I know and I have at no point said Sikhs aren’t hardworking or ungenerous. Additionally I have never said “all Muslims are terrorists” so take a breath and calm down. There is and has historically been violence within the Sikh community which doesn’t spill over into the general population. This is a bigger problem amongst young Sikh men currently.

Agree. They seem to be hardened criminals skilled at manipulation of the police and possibly others.

Absolutely no comparison between a career criminal with a string of convictions who’d held a pregnant woman at gun point and that bewildered child faintly saying he’d been stabbed. None.

Absolutely no comparison with the global
madness of hysterical violence and rioting that was allowed almost unchecked after Floyd and the OTT police provocation and brutality tonight. Where were their knees and compassion?

Absolutely no comparison between that craven hypocrite Starmer taking the knee and the unutterable cowardice of him not being in Southampton tonight to face the consequences of his two-tier favouritism.

I am shaking I am so angry and sad for that boy, his family and this land that was once the home of fairness and decency.

Although this news story for me is about the failure of the police to act with intelligence and empathy, believing racism trumps someone lying on the ground telling them he couldn’t breathe, this murdering and lying family certainly put paid to my previous view that Sikh’s are a peaceful and law abiding people. This lot killed, lied, covered up and stockpiled weapons, smirked outside court, and shouted at the victim’s family after the court case. They have done a disservice to other Sikh’s but that is for that community to navigate. I only care about white people now, because we are second class now. I am done. As are a lot of people.

Digwa was banned from his Gurdwara. The temple did not want him due to his behaviour and aggression. This man is not a representative of the Sikh religion. The leadership at his temple expelled him.

He was also reported for stealing ceremonial weapons two years ago, but the police made the decision not to arrest him.

One Sikh commits a crime and you are done? Did you give up on white people after Wayne Couzens?