Why do so many people seem to think porn is OK?

[CurlewKate]

I want to make it clear that I have no problem with masturbation. But there is no way of knowing whether the people involved in making porn are fully consenting and properly paid. Obviously some are. But many are trafficked, exploited and coerced and it’s impossible to tell the difference. So why condone it? I know people will say that there have always been erotic images. Of course there have. But there is a big difference between a cave painting or some 19th century etchings or the erotic writing I enjoy and the online porn which has flooded the internet for the past 50ish years.

Obviously I can only speak for myself- but I know I am not alone. I do everything I can to avoid using products that exploit people in their production. It’s very difficult in the case of many products. But it’s easy with porn. Just stop using it! And I do not object to porn because I am insecure or would think of it as cheating or feel threatened by it. I object to it because it is exploitative and damaging to women. There are very very many people like me. However much the porn apologists try to say otherwise.

It’s not hard to support legitimate business women in the porn industry. If you want to do moral porn, do that. Joanna Angel doesn’t need you clutching pearls for her, she’s a successful business woman.

Well put @BauhausOfEliott

I think porn is an interesting topic but on Mumsnet it’s quite dull. There’s no nuance at all and it’s always the same talking points.

Of course there are those women who are exploited which is wrong on so many levels, however I worked beside someone who worked legitimately as a stripper and lap dancer to fund her way through uni, She said the same as you, no one forced her, she made good money and by her own admission it was the men being exploited.

Well said.

Probably the same way people buy clothes made by modern day slave labour, or cotton that wreaks workers hands picking it, or non-fair trade coffee, tea and chocolate.

They ignore the bad for their own pleasure.

We are all guilty of consumption that involves misery.

As the OP says how will anyone know the difference? Also in general its really bad for women and society however 'ethicaly made' it is. it legitimises the view that women are objects for mens sexual pleasure only I wholly agree with Andrea Dworkin that porn is the theroy, rape is the practice.

I’m not “clutching pearls”. I’m saying that while it may be possible to support legitimate business women in the porn industry, most consumers don’t. And while there is good practice, that does not do anything to negate the undeniable bad practice. I don’t understand why anyone thinks that is any sort of argument .

What do you mean by nuance?

Anybody?

I agree @Raccoonswillonedayrevolt and I also think we are failing our young men by not trying to stop access to it. Or at least limit it to less violent or extreme versions of it. It's not the equivalent of the page 3 tits that used to be considered porn. They are allowed consume something that is known to be damaging to their mental health, their general wellbeing, ability for form relationships etc. I think we have lost our ability to feel protective towards young men and boys in the way we are towards young women and girls. Regardless of sex, these are children that we are talking about, vulnerable, innocent minds.

For the ladies that make money from producing porn videos, do the sites pay you for the amount of views you get, or is it some other way?

Presumably the same nuance as with the “happy hooker “ myth?

My issues with porn , that have nothing to do with how attractive the women in it are :

1. the prevalence and availability of it , which means children (from age 9) are being increasingly exposed to it, which can have serious and long lasting effect.
2. the portrayal of more and more extreme acts , violence , degradation, incest (or just about) etc. which are made to seem mainstream, normal , what everyone does. Particularly when shaping the views of young people
3. the escalation in viewers and exposure to the aforementioned extreme acts.
4. The issues with addiction, death grip etc.
5. the very obvious one that you can’t really tell who is being exploited/abused/coerced and who isn't, particularly in amateur/at home porn.

I don't agree with it and used to be very against DH watching it, however I have a low sex drive so i've relented over time as if it means I don't get pestered for sex i'll turn a blind eye to it.No idea if he watches it still or not I know he stopped when I asked but knows i'm not so fussed now.I don't really get why men can't just get aroused by masturbation though without needing anything like that.

No. That’s not really what I was getting at. I’d be interested to hear about how porn is different to other vices/selfishness (iPhones, eating meat etc.); thoughts about OnlyFans/Reddit type SW and ‘ethical porn’; whether there are personal/relationship reasons people hate it. But this seems like a vent thread, not really much conversation despite it being the Chat topic.

There’s a movement online of young men giving porn up, it’s seen as something which weakens them. Which given the incidences of porn induced sexual dysfunction we hear about on here all the time sounds about right.

I thought I’d touched on most of those points, but obviously not. The main difference between porn and other non ethical practices is that porn really is the only one that can just be stopped. We can, and many of us do, live our lives as ethically as we can-but it’s very difficult. Porn? It’s easy. Just stop. Ethical porn? It exists, but it’s impossible to be sure whether it is or isn’t. And most users won’t pay a fair price for it. Free porn is unlikely to be ethical. Personal/relationship issues? Well, I do have children, and I hate the fact that the society they have grown up in is pervaded on a “pornified” view of women. I hope that they’ve had enough other influences in their lives to broaden their horizons, but I’m not sure, and I know many others don’t. Does that answer your points? Happy to have another go if it doesn’t.

That's one thing me n DH had in common among other views years ago porn is disgusting and quite frankly if you need that then be single lol..watched a program the other day and they say over 50percent of porn is underage, trafficked, forced, women or girls etc...

What was the
programme?

I don't see it as normal to use porn, never have and never will. It's not "the past 50 years" - more like 20 to 30. The only positive thing is that I feel that very recently we are less exposed to sexualised imagery in everyday life than was normalised in the 1980s to 2000s, you have to go and look for it. Not far, admittedly, but it's a long time since I've seen a massive billboard of a model in a Wonderbra or page 3, or a barely dressed woman on the front cover of a magazine, or have had sexualised email spam.

Totally agree

Magazines. Postcards. Photographic prints. Daguerreotypes, cyanotypes, ambrotypes. Paintings, etchings, drawings...

Quite. We have less babies each now so at least it served that purpose too 😁

Yes, is anyone going to discuss? There’s rare/occasional visual stimulation vs being dependent on internet porn to fulfil your own bodily functions.