Does anyone still support this Labour government?

[PutTheCakeDOWN]

I know NO ONE in real life who still sticks up for them (apart from my mother, and she would support Labour even if KS owned up to creating Covid). Apart from that, all quiet on the western front.

I haven’t seen any support on here, or SM for weeks now.

Is it my algorithm bubble, or are people genuinely disappointed with them? I don’t think it can be the algorithms though, as until a few weeks ago there were still words of support popping up.

For full disclosure I think this government is a total shitshow intent on dismantling British culture, and taxing the private sector to death in order to pay for the public sector. With no long term plan once the private sector is squeezed totally dry. I am BEYOND disappointed with them.

I don’t think the stupid accusation helps. Most people are looking for the same outcome, whether it’s jobs (hopefully people want those) or stopping crossings.

Some believe Labour can do what they say they want with one in one out. Whether that happens we’ll see.

I wouldn’t call someone stupid in conversation, so I’m not accusing individuals. I just think believing a proven liar and grifter like Farage is some sort of straight talker with the answers to complex problems is a bit stupid. How would you categorise it?
One-in-one-out isn’t supposed to solve anything on its own is it? Anyway I don’t think any country can solve the asylum crisis alone. It needs international agreements. It’s not the sole means on which I would judge any government.

If people just believe what comes out of Farage's mouth and repeat it without having checked its accuracy, then yes, they are thick and lazy. I would say the same of anyone who did the same with left wing politics.

Farage is a shit stirrer and he just loves to cause division.

Why should we consult Ireland?

If asylum seekers want to go to Ireland that’s their choice. It’s up to Ireland to set its own regime for irregular immigration.

In any case, dinghy arrivals are a small part of our problems. I can’t get too excited about the issue - although I can see that localised issues will arise with housing.

What really matters is that we encourage economic growth. That is where Labour has failed, will continue to fail and will cause them disaster at the ballot box. Labour’s hypocrisy and dishonesty are just accelerants for the electoral bin fire they are facing. Ultimately, it’s Starmer’s and Reeves’s incompetence that is dooming Labour.

If Labour’s policies don’t do as said, whether it’s one on one out or smash the gangs then it’s likely they’ll struggle at the next GE.

Starmer was very confident pre GE on being able to tackle it, he’ll find it hard if not.

Why are you focusing on just this policy though? It’s really a minor deal financially. Why haven’t you responded to any of the many, many positives several posters have given as examples of where their policies are working?

Electorally he’ll struggle to get back in. It’s a point about how the public will perceive that.

We are. And we are complicit in our own demise. Only too happy to throw our own industries under the bus in our insatiable desire to have more for less in the form of cheap (largely Chinese) imports. And now we're moving on to the next step - the dismantling of what makes Britain/Europe strong and successful. The dismantling of the EU and the destruction of our national institutions - the NHS, the BBC, etc.

Our mismanagement of immigration, our mismanagement of our tax-funded institutions, and our failure to articulate to the masses why they are so great, have allowed self-interested chancers to step into the vacuum. So now we are told by the likes of Farage, Tice, Truss, etc., ably abetted by the right-of-centre billionaire controlled media (Murdoch, Zuckerberg, Musk), that the very things that make our country strong are unpatriotic. People whose main driving force is to make a personal fortune out of the dismantling of our institutions have persuaded a large portion of the population that they care about them. They don't.

Look at how privatisation in the water industry has panned out and then consider how that might look for health services.

I think people would be very unwise to vote for Reform and pretty unwise to vote Conservative but it is what it is. You don't know what you have until it's gone but I suspect we'll find out soon enough.

With the polls as they stand now, yes. Though polls dont account for tactical voting. There’s a long time yet and lots of policies are being effective. As I said, i don’t think he, or anyone else, can solve the asylum issue without international agreements which probably won’t happen until it gets a lot worse (which it will). I’m just wondering why an intelligent person such as yourself is focusing solely on one policy and not the entirety of the legislative agenda?

No need for the PA dig but anyone can see what it means to the electorate. If some can’t then fine up to them but it’s one way Starmer could be out.

The migration numbers are trending down fast, thanks to the rules put in place in Sunak's last few months in office, and I am happy for Starmer to take credit. Shabana Mahmoud is also talking some sense.

The small boat arrivals are blown out of all proportion but are an affront because it's blatant people trafficking. But again, maritime law doesn't allow any respectable mariner to ignore people who need rescuing. Agreed, this is an international concern.

Far more damaging is the sense that nothing works properly anymore: that a rapist sent for trial is unlikely to reach court before 2028. Trivial issues like banning live boiling of crustaceans and the accidental or incidental slaughter of a few hundred foxes by hounds each year are pursued vigorously, while a blind eye is turned to the abhorrent practice of ritual slaughter for the c100,000 lambs that go into the halal and kosher meat trades each year.

More cross party efforts on the universal concerns, like jobs, health, housing and education are urgently required.

You are a floating voter as you are not wedded to one political party but will vote differently at different elections depending on the issues of the day and how you feel each party is responding to them.

I am just the same and am also a floating voter. I have voted Labour, Conservative and Lib Dem in my time.

Currently have no idea who I will vote for in the next election but will make a choice nearer the time or I may even abstain from voting at all.

What PA dig?
The electorate think it’s important because it’s all the press bang on about. It makes zero difference to most people. In 3 years when people can see improvements elsewhere (and even there as they are dealing with processing more quickly at least) I don’t think it’ll be quite so all consuming.

The one in your post. As for the rest we’ll see. They’re very unpopular now in any case.

I didn’t make one.
Reading it back I am wondering if you mean saying you are intelligent after we talked about stupidity? Not meant that way. We’ve argued before on here and, while I disagree with much of what you say, I have considered you to be intelligent and pretty well informed. Which is why I’m so surprised you keep ignoring the good stuff completely and harping on about one issue.

I’m pretty clear on what I’m saying. It’s a comment on the electorate and what makes Starmer vulnerable.

It’s not hard to see even Labour know this hence bringing in Mahmood and some changes they’d never have contemplated.

They know it’s a factor for them, I’m not saying anything unknown by most.

And I’m not disagreeing it’s a factor. The thread is asking a more general question, though, despite the fact that this part of it has narrowed down (as ever) to immigration and in particular asylum seekers. What do you think of the rest of the legislative agenda, especially the things PPs have identified as positive? Can you support any of that? Do you consider that they might do well in more general terms?
I know you aren’t a Labour supporter and don’t expect that to change, but back in the day I used to be able to have some faith the Tories wouldn’t screw us all over even though I wouldn’t agree with most of what they did (or why they did it). Do you feel like that about this govenrment? Like they aren’t doing what you would like but it might still have positive outcomes? Or do you feel about them like I feel about modern Tories - that their basic ideology is too alien to me and too divisive and would lead to disaster all round?

There’s two main issues for them the other is the economy so I guess we’ll see on that. I don’t think any gov has tried this hard to lower growth for the private sector. Blair was nowhere near doing that, he loved the FS sector and didn’t want higher taxes, has said similarly now.

So my reticence was based on some of the rhetoric which has led to policies such as NI, you can see some of the outcomes such as graduate placements and jobs lost.

Instinctively I think it’s better to promote people taking a risk, setting up a business and employing people so this feels wrong footed, it also leads to lower public spending as it’s just not available.

I don’t think they expected what is happening, borrowing so high and growth pretty much flat. So far that is, maybe it’ll change.

Short version - basic ideology isn’t even Labour / not Labour because it was easier to vote for Blair who imo understood the private sector. Although of course there were other faults too. Starmer I don’t think so.

I get you. I was a Labour voter in the Blair and Brown days. I was younger, I don’t think they had it all right. They were more central for me. They understood that we needed a functioning welfare state and public sector. To me, they understood that you needed a private sector to pay for it. They encouraged big state but also big aspiration to pay for it.

This government have killed the private sector and made things absolutely dismal for the youth and graduates. All backed up by data. Whilst a never ending minimum wage rise looks good, it’s having catastrophic impacts in the jobs market. Why employ inexperience for the same cost as an experienced worker? Other salaries haven’t kept up. Then you have the employer NI. All the other additions to employment which look good on paper but are actually crippling in the real world and make hiring unattractive. Hence the employment freezes (happened right after the first budget) and unemployment rises. It then turns out that pay isn’t rising due to increased costs, the public sector is covering that up.

Reeves and Starmer and the current Labour Party don’t understand business. They don’t understand actions and consequence. The employment market is dire and the youth have minimal prospects. Blair and Brown wanted and encouraged people to do well.

IMO it’s gone past redistribution and it’s just spiteful. I’ve seen children that are impacted by VAT on school fees. Taxing education is unforgivable. The rich haven’t suffered. It’s children with SEND whose parents were just affording it. It is the children who had outreach. Ofsted and curriculum reforms are a bad joke. Child poverty has not been fixed by soggy toast and lifting the cap. The only thing I do agree on is FSM for all on UC. I know the children are getting fed.

I could go on. This government are just spiteful and the good decisions aren’t all that good when you see the consequences. Not sure who will be picking up the tab for all the public sector and welfare with the private sector jobs market going down the tubes.

What this government are doing to the prospects of the younger generations is unforgivable. A free meal at lunch doesn’t fix that. Oh let’s not forget now, cutting corners and costs with SEND. No good getting children recognised with SEND by teachers when Labour won’t fund places, schools and want to take away EHCPs from a high percentage.

Yeah, I’m finding it hard to get the positives.

They are t taxing education. They are taxing private school fees which are a choice.

Also this policy was supported by the majority of voters.

I'm not sure that a majority of voters wanted to tax private education though; they definitely wanted a quick cheap shot at the public schools. Doubt many people thought about the SEND aspects of smaller local independents for which quite a few families forewent such luxuries as holidays overseas and new cars.

We are the only country in the world to tax education, which is shaming.

They aren’t taxing education. They are taxing private education. Which people choose. So it’s a luxury option.

I think the majority of voters did want this. It was a popular policy.

Yep this. It’s a pity as it it’s not automatically the case that Labour has to do these things, see previous party. If they don’t turn it around and the Mahmood stuff doesn’t work I think they’ll struggle to stay in.

It was popular because people were spiteful. People didn’t have the critical thinking skills to realise that a 20% increase means nothing to the wealthy. What is does do is stop children from deprived/working class/middle classes accessing private education through bursaries, outreach and parents who have given up things to try and support their children. I’ve seen the state of SEND in state. I don’t think punishing those parents and children was a good idea. I’ve seen children benefit hugely from outreach who now don’t. I think people were daft enough to think this would be the end of private schooling. I think it’s shameful actually. It’s just made private schooling more elitist than ever and kept working class children down where “they belong” even less chance of levelling up. Absolutely disgraceful.

That’s fair and reasoned (apart from ‘tried hard to lower growth’ that’s a bit silly - you disagree with what they’ve tried and it doesn’t seem to be working particularly well, but to say that’s the aim is nonsense. Plus of course nobody in Europe is having much growth just now and we are further hampered by the effects of Brexit). I still disagree that asylum is actually a major issue - though I accept it is perceived as one currently).
im disappointed in them because I’d like them to be more radical with the huge majority they have. Instead they are sticking to the most un-boat-rocking manifesto of all time, which I get but think is the wrong decision.
We’ll just have to see what happens.