How do you ‘punish’ a child who just doesn’t get it?

[OhShutUpThomas]

I am trying my best, I really am.

3 kids. H works away and has checked out of parenting. Not the issue of this thread so please let’s not dissect it, just to highlight that although not a single mother, I am parenting alone to 3 tweens and by God I am TRYING my absolute best.

BACKGROUND:

DD8 is lovely but tricky. Currently awaiting assessment as I am sure she has learning difficulties.

She sulks and gets cross a lot. She has always been a sulker but it has massively ramped up. She is currently being kept back a year at school due to many valid issues, which she was fine with but now with transition day (season, it seems to be now) upon us, she’s quite emotional.

All of this means that I tend to excuse/not see the milder bits of bad behaviour. I don’t ignore them, but I don’t come down like a ton of bricks.

But the really bad, sulky, petulant, cross and nasty behaviour, I cannot overlook. Whatever the cause.

THE CURRENT ISSUE:

She and her sister and their friends are really into a sport. They train every week together and go to competitions about 2-3 times a month.

Last week at training, DD8 completely lost her shit at a perceived slight from DD10 (she can’t cope with any criticism, even ‘hurry up’) which ended in her hitting DD10 hard with a large stick. There was a big telling off for this, and I said any more bad behaviour and she would not be doing this weekends competition.

She semi-behaved for a day or so, then last night kicked off again massively, ending with her shouting at me in Tesco. On the way in I’d said her brother could push the trolley, and was about to say that she could swap at the end of the aisle, but before I got there she had a massive tantrum because she wanted to push the trolley. I
explained about the swap, but that now that couldn’t happen due to the tantrum. She shouted ‘FINE, I’M LEAVING’ and went to run from the shop. I grabbed her, because she’s 8 and can’t run out into the world at 9pm (we’d been to the cinema). People are now looking.

I bring her back in and she sees the people looking and smirks because she thinks she won’t get told off. I proceed to tell her off anyway. She has already been warned very clearly several times in the last 5 mins that if this carries on she will not be competing this weekend.

She answered the telling off with ‘It’s not fair, I’m not walking with you, I wanted to push the trolley’ and went to run off inside. So I told her that that’s it, she is not competing at the weekend.

She was then furious and kept asking why I was being so mean to her. She stomped around the shop giving me nasty looks.

This has carried on. Last night putting her to bed after all this she asked why I wasn’t her friend. Why I was being so mean. I don’t think she even remembered what she’d done.

I explained it all again and asked whose fault it is that she isn’t competing - mine or hers. She said mine, because I’m the one that said it. She just doesn’t get it, and I really could not have made it clearer.

I am at my wits end. I really wanted her to compete this weekend, and would have let her ‘earn it back’ but that ship had sailed I think. Her sister will have to ride her pony as I’ve already paid the entries. DD8 will have to still come and watch as there’s no one else to have her.

I am just exhausted. I’m sorry it’s long but please, and help will be SO much appreciated.

Ah yes, the Leo’s that have the birthday week :-)

My two have no learning disabilities but I would have been very reluctant to take them to a supermarket at 9pm after the cinema when they were 8 and 10. That is the perfect bad behaviour recipe. They would at least have been very strongly warned before going in that there were no trolleys, we were just getting the bare minimum and any acting up would be dealt with.

You are doing just fine and doing your best. Don't let sanctimonious people make you feel bad. None of us are perfect.

Oh my life.

This is clearly the most important point is it?

I got out of the car.
Went into shop.
Children followed.
DS had, thinking he was being helpful, got a pound of the car and got a trolley.
He comes in pushing it.
DD sees trolley and starts to shout about pushing it.
Before I can answer anything (would have been ‘you can swap at the end of this aisle’) DD has massive tantrum over trolley.

How much more detail do you want? It was a smaller trolley. I can describe our outfits?

I agree the OP is doing her best, but at the same time I don't think she's necessarily helping herself as well as she could. It sounds like the children have far too much control. If I couldn't get milk I'd just say 'oh dear no milk' and get on with it. It really is no big deal, but the OP talks about it as though it's a disaster, presumably because she expects her children to kick off?

It's not about the milk is it, but if top up shops are an issue, delivery or freezer?

We really have had to put a lot of effort into minimising avoidable issues so we don't go bonkers dealing with the unavoidable ones.

You don't have to keep justifying yourself. You done nothing wrong!

Thinking about it, I delegated food shopping to DH ages ago. Could you? If he's doing no parenting, he could do an online shop right?

WRT the trolley, of course the OP did nothing wrong, but as soon as I saw my DS with the trolley, I'd have said 'we don't need that put it back please,' and if there was any messing around, we would have turned around and gone back to the car. It's hard to be that firm when you're exhausted though, so I can see why the OP might struggle with a situation like this.

My kids are autistic - (late diagnosed girls) and no they wouldn't cope with a. "pop into get milk" after a cinema trip at all.

We genuinely have changed our lives to work around them as they aren't going to be less autistic (I realise it might not be autism for your child it could be anxiety/trauma) but similar principle.

I think sometimes realising that for us a "just got to do x" can be a final straw for someone else..

Does she have any sensory issues? Sometimes it's hard to realise that someone else experiences the world differently to us - so for your duaghter these things are real and overwhelming..

We have minimised how much we do, how many trips we make, streamlined online shopping and if it was literally "just milk" I'd either leave them both in the car if they're safe to do that or tescos woosh it.

So for example if I was planning a cinema trip I'd make sure the time before and time after was clear. And allows time to reset and decompress.

Id ensure not too many weeknight activities so they have plenty of free time that's theirs.

In an ideal world I'd try to have pleasurable 1-1 time with each child. Especially the duaghter if she's struggling (I do a "get a Starbucks and drive to the sea" treat with one of mine. About 45mins in total, proper treat and she knows it's her time - while husband is with the other child.)

Ultimately she needs to know you're on her side, her advocate and you'll get through tricky things/tricky emotions together. Rather than a battle..

So minimise demands (low demand parenting can be a good move when in a stalemate or period of overwhelm) lots of positive affirmation, reduce the surprise "well just go into x" and be clear about what is happening when.

Youve been through so much - but so have they. It seems money isn't an issue so absolutely streamline life and take any pressure of her (and yourself) that you can. Tesco woosh. Cleaners. Less trips. Less things that need doing and more calm and recovery.

Good luck.

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Thanks for that - I needed a laugh!

Oh dear there's no milk? That's very cruel! Not meant to let your kids go without food just because they've been naughty.

And genuinely the suggestion somewhere about neurodiversity... Many women are late diagnosed when realising their daughters are ND. Especially after breakdowns /other attempts at mental support (I tried anti depressants and all sorts and finally diagnosed this year. In my case autistic and adhd and adhd meds have been lifechanging)

Without food? The OP didn't say there was nothing else in her house.

You don’t take children on a treat when you haven’t got the basics for breakfast. Get some UHT milks and freeze bread for emergencies. Online shop. Take control. You could have got the trolley off DS and said thanks for getting it, DS go one side and DD the other side! 3rd kid gets the bread and milk. Get them working as a team not rivals.

Tell them in advance who is pushing the trolley and when they're swapping over. Don't withdraw trolley privileges if a child is getting pissed off because that guarantees a meltdown in the name of unfairness. I would withdraw trolley privileges if they did something dangerous with the trolley like trying to ram each other.

To be clear I wasn't suggesting doing without milk as a punishment - that would be bizarre. I mean going without milk and just having something else to avoid drama and meltdowns.

I think it is really sad, not funny. Seriously, why are you married to this guy?

How did you get diagnosed? I’d be very open to assessment.

She didn't say there was food in the house either and you can't have cereal without milk. Maybe that is all she had in the house! She's a single mum. And might not want everyone to know and shouldn't have to have that as a reason. Maybe she needs a cup of tea or coffee herself. Sounds like she needs a G & T. And you need to stop ruling with an iron fist 👊

Already stated above.

I have made this mistake with the cinema before (though the film finished at 7pm not 9pm).

Unfortunately because I now know DS is a demon when he is overtired, we just can’t do post-teatime cinema trips, evening meals out, afterschool Christmas shopping, Christmas lights unless we go at 4pm, and can’t book flights that land after 10pm. Or there will be a meltdown that night and all of the following day, predictable as clockwork.

He was fine as a toddler, many of my friends’ kids would be fine, he is not fine now as an 8 year old. Hopefully in a few years’ time it will improve again.

Check out the Right to Choose pathway for both yourself and dd if you're in England. There's a list of providers online, you pick the one you want and go to your gp and said i would like us referred under right to choose for autism and adhd. It cuts the waiting time down by years but it's a well kept secret.

Have a look at "right to choose" online (there's a good adult autism right to choose facebooj group if you do that)

You take/give the screening forms to the GP who refers you to your chosen provider (the "right" bit of right to choose - I chose Dr J and co who were brilliant). It's about 18-20weeks start to finish. I asked to be assessed for both as there's a high cooccurance of adhd and autism and might as well find out.

Or there's private options with adhd360/asd360 and others as I looked into that at one stage for my daughter.

I frequently pop into a shop on the way home from somewhere. This is life.

Nipping into a shop for 5 mins for milk is really not the issue here. This kid can cope with buying milk usually, parenting alone means they often have to go places/do stuff they’d rather not. They are all used to it. I am not going to stop buying milk on the way home if needed. You are concentrating on the wrong bit.