People who drop out of life

[Dappy777]

Over the last week or so I've had two separate conversations about people who've 'dropped out' of life – no job, no friends, no interest in anything.

Last night, for example, I went for a meal with a family friend who was telling us about his youngest brother. He is 30, lives with their mum, and has no life at all. He has no job, no relationship, no hobbies and very few friends. He spends all day in the flat eating takeaways and drinking, then sleeps most of the afternoon, wakes up around 8pm and sits up all night playing video games. He's never been abroad, and never even been to London (he lives in north Essex).

I had a similar chat on Christmas Day. A neighbour told me about his brother and how he's "given up on life" (as my neighbour put it). Doesn't work, date, socialize, pursue hobbies, nothing.

It isn't so much the not dating or not working that puzzles me. Plenty of people don't want a serious relationship, or kids, or even a job. I can even understand not socialising (I'm a bit of an introvert myself). What I find so puzzling is the lack of interest in life/being alive – you know, just going for a walk on a spring morning, or swimming in the sea, or looking at the stars. Is it depression do you think? I know of quite a few people like this – young people who play video games, smoke weed, and seem to have opted out of the world. I don't know if it's my imagination, but it seems to be more common. Is it just me?

@ForeverDelayedEpiphany you would have signed on for unemployment benefit.

I agree with you about lodgers and I too dread what would happen. Back then we didn't have to fight for resources, there was an abundance of everything. People wanted less and a little money went a long way. I've never seen so many adverts advising people to seek help for MH or social problems only to find they're just a number in a long queue. A lot in the window but nothing in the shop.

When was this magic time when people didn’t have to fight for resources and there was an abundance of everything?

I'm talking about 1950. I could change jobs every month if I wanted, rent was cheap and young people could get a council house. If you needed the police they would be there in minutes and you didn't need an appointment to see the doctor, you just went and sat in the surgery. Lots of services visited at home and women didn't work once married so neighbours were always on hand to help out.

I'm not saying it was a magic time because I could write another paragraph on the downsides. I just feel sorry for young people and families who are struggling to afford even the basics now.

@missdeamenor There was a massive shortage of housing on 1950. So much property was destroyed or damaged by the war, and lots of what was still used was actual slums.
Council house building was so high during the 1950s as there was an urgent need to sort this. Slums were knocked down that had no bathrooms or running water, and were replaced by council houses. These were given largely to families although smaller units were built for elderly couples. 1950 was a time when young people still largely lived at home until they married. You did not have single people leaving home and seeking a house amongst working class people.

In the 1950s, about 50% of women of working age worked. There was no help with childcare and with cloth nappies, no convenience food shopping needing to be done daily, etc housework took far more time than today.

People did not visit the GP unless they really needed to. The NHS was created in 1948, so in the 1850s you had people who were still used to self treating more minor ailments. They certainly did not take a child to the GP for every cough and earache. Many more chronic illnesses were managed by hospital clinics rather than the GP.

The police would be there quickly. And would give your kids a clip around the ear if they were misbehaving.

I would, but i was too unwell to even try to actually go anywhere or do anything. My post concussion syndrome symptoms gave me a dreadful mental breakdown, and i lost the ability to read and write (not good as an editor and copywriter!)😳😐😢

I had awful sensory overload ad a result of the head injury, among other awful symptoms, so going anywhere or to sign on would have probably made me worse. It was the worst time of my life, and it's just incredibly fortunate that I had a wonderful family supporting me

@ForeverDelayedEpiphany just popped back on to say my DD21 who I talked about earlier in the thread also had a head injury but when she was 8, and she lost the ability to read and write - apparently its called Alexia. She was learning cursive handwriting in school at the time, and her handwriting has never been as good again! We will never know how badly the head injury affected her or changed the outcome of her young life - it may be the reason for her mental illness now but apparently it can't be pinned down to that injury it might just be coincidence. Anyway, just wanted to say ooo yes I know of that.

Bless you, and your DD too. I'm so sorry she had a head injury at such a young age, it must have been very hard for you both.

Yes, I've heard it was called alexia - it's probably quite a common thing, but it seems to be not something many people mention they have. You're the first person who's said they know of someone who has had it.

I remember when I was trying to read, it was like all the letters became almost hieroglyphics, and just meaningless "symbols" on the page. I thought at the time that it was probably how dyslexics feel when trying to read, and i could then understand how frustrated they must feel. I found it especially upsetting as I'd always loved reading and writing, and had a natural aptitude for English, so to suddenly be almost illiterate was frightening.

Lots of good wishes to your DD, I hope she is living a happy good life after her head injury so young.😘🥰

Sadly she isn't @ForeverDelayedEpiphany hence my contribution to the thread, but we will never know why - she developed a very severe form of OCD, became obvious at 15 but I think she'd had it for years and we didn't realise. She was housebound for nearly 5 years, I don't know what the future holds. Still, after reading some of the arsehole comments on this thread at least I know what other people will think about her ...

Oh I'm so sorry she isn't well 😔 It's definitely such a hard thing to adapt to a life after a head injury especially if you were susceptible to mental health problems before. I've always been quite an anxious person, but the post concussion syndrome ramped it up to maximum levels, and gave me a breakdown (hence the horrid off label antipsychotic prescribed for severe insomnia and anxiety that also gave me a movement disorder called tardive dyskinesia).

I've got every sympathy and empathy for your DD, and you. You sound a wonderful supportive mum, and I hope your DD will be ok. ❤️ And yes, i agree, people who think that perhaps those of us who have chronic illness because of unpredictable health problems should be avoided/contribute more etc/should work more etc aren't very kind or understanding.😢

Plenty of people will go on to understand later in life, if they don't now. Disability and illness doesn't always discriminate. As the saying goes, there but for the grace of god go I. Of course, it will probably be 'different' if it's them.

I have known a few people like this... always men, and always cannabis involved.

@Seaitoverthere

He thinks he's a failure. He isn't and he has to understand that . I would say cutting off from his old Uni and Uni pals for now would help. Comparison is the theif of joy .

Thanks @NewNovaNivarna . I was a bit misleading in my original post I think in that he only managed a couple of weeks before he clearly couldn’t cope so thankfully he does have the option to try somewhere new in the future if that is what he wants but that would be some way off .

He has picked up a bug and is feeling rubbish from that but hoping when that goes he is still feeling a bit better as he has been the last few weeks and is able to start gradually building his life back up. Fingers firmly crossed. First thing will be some voluntary work, something low pressure and then step it up slowly.

Only some people will think that way. Lots of us have enough life experience and empathy that we don't cast judgement. But that's probably not much consolation to you and I hope the thread hasn't upset you too much.

Thank you for checking in @Taytocrisps - I was initially a bit like woah at how far people were willing to go in their contempt, even for an anonymous forum, been a lot of Daily Mail readers on here! However, I do like to know, I want to know what she's facing. In our last house (middle class type area) we were ostracised by a group of about 10 other neighbours, mostly mums whose kids had been at school with mine, saying that the head injury was made up. One confronted me "So what really IS wrong with your DD?" I've actually had neighbours stood at the end of my drive pointing into my windows (that was at the time the accident happened and she was off school for 3 weeks). As time went on, turned into years, and DD developed what we now know to be severe OCD, she became very fearful of the neighbours and believed they were a representative sample of society (that just happened to live next door to us). That's the sort of people posting nasty comments on here. Interestingly, one neighbour's DD developed anorexia but that was ok as their attitude was hey, we all need to lose a bit of weight right? That was an "acceptable" mental illness (and she did recover thank god).

Also waving @Seaitoverthere - last year DD seemed to be making some progress and so started going out (not alone I hasten to add), and as a result she applied for uni and was accepted. She's done the Autumn term and has literally had a breakdown over Christmas so I've no idea if she will go back. I'm on a great Facebook group for parents of neurodiverse students (even though DD isn't strictly classed as ND the effects are pretty much the same) and its been a godsend esp as I can post anonymously there: google Parents of Autistic/Neurodivergent UK Uni students:

www.facebook.com/groups/264205858490793

Absolutely 💯 agree with how people gaslight others, essentially the doctors all gaslighted me when I was injured by the antipsychotic that gave me tardive dyskinesia. I self diagnosed it, and saw 5 different neurologists before one confirmed that I had it. My GP told me that I couldn't get TD from such a low dose after just a week, yet my neurologist said some people get it after a single pill.

Yes, to others not believing that the symptoms of a head injury can be truly life changing too. I distinctly remember my DM saying "I hope you get better soon then we can get back to some sort of normality" when I was going through my post concussion syndrome about 3 months after the head injury. It's heartbreaking to hear these things from the people who you turn to for support the most.

My DM and family gave me a lot of support over the years but occasionally things like this were said, and it was quite hurtful 💔

It's so hard. I'm so sorry your DD is struggling too after being at uni, it must be such a huge thing to adapt to. I do hope you're getting good support for you all. Hugs 💕

Thanks so much @IWillAlwaysBeinaClubWithYouin1973 . So sorry about your DD. That is exactly what happened to DS after 2 weeks, it is so incredibly difficult 😥 Thanks for linking the FB group. We are close enough for him to commute to a university in the future if needs be but I don’t know if it will be the right thing for him in the future. Really hope your DD is ok, take care .

@ForeverDelayedEpiphany I could write a book about it, but I dont want to derail the thread, and with that in mind I wanted to address the OP post from @Dappy777

There are going to be many reasons why this happens and it's going to affect men and women of all ages. Some posters have come on and told genuine stories of illness, disabling mental health issues and also of people who are just really content being at home at the time. Also historic stories where isolation of its time took a different form, the spinster at home with mother or sons who never married. There is no one size fits all solution and I am saying for some people, there is no solution anyway and others don't want one.

The OP and some others have mentioned cannabis. When I worked with a drug user support worker in a homeless charity, she told me that cannabis can be the gateway to all sorts of mental health issues and sometimes it only needs to be taken once for shit to happen. So yes, I still work for a homeles charity and when I walk into work I see people who are on the streets for so many reasons. And then I go home and my daughter's life seems so small and sad when it could be glorious and I hope one day it still can be. I think of how easy I had it in the 70s/80s getting work and accommodation compared to young people (or indeed any people) now.

And the common denominator for all of this, on this thread? Compassion and lack of compassion. No apologies I'll repeat it, some real assholes on this 30+ page thread, complete piss takers. And some parents and individuals who are giving help and need help and doing their best.

I do strongly believe that, if they can, parents have a responsibility to encourage their children not to depend on them as adults.

My old neighbours 'Bill and Enid" had a daughter called 'Mary' who had downs syndrome. When Enid was alive she insisted on doing everything for Mary. However when Enid died, Bill, who was then in his late eighties and in poor health himself, started teaching Mary important life skills including basic meal preparation, money management and how to use a washing machine. He told me he didn't want to interfere with the mother and daughter relationship but secretly was desperately worried about how Mary would cope if they were no longer around to care for her. By the time this lovely man died himself, Mary was still living at home but had a part time job at the local shop and knew how to perform most domestic tasks independently so she didn't go under. Enid, as kind as she was, did not do Mary any favours and thank goodness for Bill who recognised this before he passed away.

It makes me wonder how many Enid, Bill's and Mary's are out there where it's the Bill who dies first and the Mary's don't learn the skills they need. And this needs to start young. Mary was in her fifties when her mum died but luckily was willing to learn albeit reluctantly to begin with.

I also agree that cannabis causes a huge amount of mental health difficulties. I have seen this in my own family where the person self medicates with cannabis and then can't seem to function without it.

@IWillAlwaysBeinaClubWithYouin1973 You did not live where I lived then. Unemployment was incredibly high in the eighties, and where I lived youth unemployment was absolutely sky high. Every night some expert on TV was declaring that our generation would be the first where lots of us would never work.

It's a massive worry for society though surely.
It seems like the numbers of ND people are rapidly increasing.
I've just seen a thread where the op, her partner and three of the four kids were ND, it seems like very other poster has at least one child whose ND.
What's going to happen if/ when large numbers potentially just retreat from society. Obviously not every ND person ends up like those being described here but this thread in itself showing how many know people like this is concerning.

Why is it a worry? Maybe society will have to evolve to become an inclusive society, which can only be a good thing?

Society needs people to work and contribute

I’m AuDHD, I’m fairly certain exH is neurodivergent, and all of our dc are. Why is that a worry or a problem? ND people have always been here, it’s just that we weren’t identified in the past.