How would you read this email from the swimming teacher?

[Overwhelmedandout]

DD (just turned 7, starting Y2) has moved into a new group at swimming and has a new teacher. DD’s not terrible - can swim a couple of lengths, etc.

She has always had issues with concentration. I have suspected for some time that she might have ADHD but her teachers, while commenting on her lack of concentration, seem to think that she’s too young to be able to draw an accurate conclusion.

This evening, completely out of the blue, I’ve had an email from the head of the swimming school, stating that:

“[Teacher] says that [DD] is very capable but because she lacks focus, and doesn’t always listen, she isn’t refining her technique, and her stroke can be quite messy.”

They want me to “speak to her to make sure she gets the most out of her swimming lessons” and moves into the next group after Christmas. I did, and she cried for an hour, and we have all gone to bed upset.

I figured that she must have been pretty naughty for them to send this kind of email. I’ve definitely never had one before, in years of lessons for the DC. Would you read this as “she’s causing chaos in the lesson / setting fire to the other kids” or “she’s daydreaming and isn’t improving her technique”? If it’s the former then fair enough, and she deserves a telling off. If it’s the latter… well, to be honest, I can’t get all upset about a Y2 child having a messy swimming stroke/ if she doesn’t move up a group in four months. But it must have been quite bad, surely - it would be insane to send me a random email telling me that a 7 year old’s swimming stroke is messy and I must tell her off for it?!

We get personal swimming feedback each term for all my kids - a written ‘report’ though it’s usually 2 sentences or so. Comments are mostly that they aren’t concentrating enough 😂 maybe your swim school have had complaints about lack of feedback and starting to give out more? I certainly wouldn’t make a child cry over it though, is she particularly sensitive or have you gone a bit OTT?

It doesn't sound like either. Mine used to dance and would get told if they could do X by a certain date they could move up a class. Tell her she's not doing anything wrong - it's that they think if she focused more she'll be able to move up after Christmas because she's doing so well.

In my experience, as a parent of a child with ASD and ADHD, you will regularly have people tell you to tell your child to not displsy any of the behaviours of ASD and ADHD.

I actually found swimming teachers generally very very poor on SEN knowledge or acceptance. I'd suggest some 1 to 1 lessons might be the way to go and an acceptance that your child's swimming style might always be somewhat "messy". However, as we mostly teach children to swim so they don't drown the actual look of the stroke isn't important, regardless of what the swim teacher thinks

I'm afraid if your child does have SEN this is something you might have to get used to. I found replying along the lines of, "of course, I'll tell DD to stop being so autistic. That should sort it. I'll also let her team of medical specialists kniw that we just need to tell her to stop being autistic and it won't be a problem any more." I wish I'd started using that reply a lot earlier than I did. You need to be the voice to advocate for your child.

My daughter who is also in Year 2 and neurotypical, spent a whole year not following instructions and pretty much treading water for half an hour every week at swimming. We could not get to the bottom of it. The teachers didn't know what was going on, she was enjoying herself, and on occasion showed that she was a fantastic swimmer who was very capable.

I am happy to report that after a whole year of continuing swimming (because she still wanted to go, and for no other reason), things have finally clicked. She is swimming lengths and lengths with strokes that look recognisable, and is diving in like a pro.

I think that once they reach a certain standard, the lessons become about learning strokes, and that is hard. And for some it is so hard that they mess about and tread water, no matter what you say.

My advice based on experience is to ride it out for as long as they enjoy going and you can afford it. It will eventually click.

It seems a perfectly reasonable email to send in the circumstances.

Ex swimming teacher here 🙋‍♀️That does not read like she’s being especially disruptive and in need of a stern telling off. If I was teaching her, I would flag to a parent if I felt they were falling a little short of what they were capable of - clearly they see a level of confidence in the water that means she should be moving towards a more refined technique but isn’t. Perhaps could have been worded clearer, but this isnt far off feedback I’d give to a child I felt could be doing better if they had a bit more focus. I don’t know how this pool manages lessons, but I certainly knew the kids, was keeping a close eye on progress and was expected to feedback to parents.

The thing is you say she’s only daydreaming and not disturbing the other children, but my son used to swim with a boy who sounds like your daughter and every time the boy ducked under the water (multiple times a lesson) or wasn’t listening, the coach had to stop what they were teaching, get his attention / tell him off etc and so it was disturbing the lesson numerous times in 45 mins. I imagine the coach emailed you because they are finding it frustrating, and have maybe even had complaints from other parents. They are also probably thinking her ability is such that she should be moving up groups but is staying in the same one wasting her time and your money just because she’s not listening.

My boys both swim competitively and train 3-4 times a week, and I still remind the younger one (8) to remember respect for his coach means focussing, ears switched on, best possible effort in everything and no chatting to his pals until they are out of the pool.

Absolutely agree. If swimming becomes stressful she won’t want to go anymore and will not improve. Keep it fun and she’ll fly (or should that be swim🤣)

Instead of second guessing and asking here, go and speak to the teacher and find out what’s happening, if it’s the latter of you’re choices, tell her your happy for dc to have messy strokes at this level!

Late reply but I’ve so been here! A few years ago now with my son (now 13 then about 6/7) and it was the end of term swim report. I was mortified reading that “he messed about and didn’t listen/wouldn’t be moving up” He too was a fair swimmer. Ultimately group, noisy swim lesssons were not for him. Pulled him out immediately, found a fit for him in smaller group/pool. I think group swim lessons amplify the mildest of ADHD.

"“[Teacher] says that [DD] is very capable but because she lacks focus, and doesn’t always listen, she isn’t refining her technique, and her stroke can be quite messy.”"

Honestly you sound nice. You sound like you'd be surprised at the number of parents who probably expect their kids to go from non-swimmer to Olympic swimmer in a few months. When in reality the poor swimming teach probably spends her life trying to get kids who are either fearful of the water in, and keep those who throw themselves around like drowning isn't a thing, alive! I think the teacher would have said if the lessons weren't working, she just doesn't want you to think she's done a bad job and wasted your money, when your kid isn't a good as you like.

I would have read it factually, not interpreted it as her being naughty or in need of a telling off as you have.

The content was for you and wouldn’t have relayed this email directly to her (as a younger child), but asked her how she was finding the lesson, the teacher says she is finding it hard to concentrate type thing.

Try to digest things yourself first next time and don’t emotionally load it or start a new discussion before bed.

If it’s a huge noisy Sat class, she would likely benefit from a different format - small group or individual lessons.

Do you also take her swimming? I would start taking her as well if not.

I've not read the whole thread but I run a swim school. We have loads of kids who don't listen/bob underwater a lot. Lots of them are too young to be diagnosed with any kind of neurodivergence but it's clear being underwater suits some kids from a sensory perspective. As long as they have a hand on the wall so I can see it I don't mind too much if they're not paying attention when we talk - it's my job to keep the class moving, and find a different way for them to learn. That might be watching the other kids (so you don't make them go first), or gently physically guiding them into some positions so they know what's expected. They'll probably take longer to pick it up, but will get there in the end and hopefully have a good time/burn off some energy.

What is very rarely helpful is a parent before the class telling their child to listen and pay attention?!?! That's my job at the time, in the pool. If they can't pay attention for a 30 second explanation, what's the point in having a parent tell them something 20 minutes earlier? Also as the parent of an autistic child with possible ADHD I know how little impact that's going to have (and I worry about the child being told over and over again to pay attention when they just can't, and what that does to their self esteem).

I'm too busy and have too many swimmers to email a parent with feedback. I'll always respond to any questions, and our online system has criteria that we're working towards, and they can see which criteria their child has achieved.

It sounds like your daughter is being a bit disruptive and they don't know how to handle it. Are the teachers in the water? If not I think that type of class might be better, or possibly 1:1 but that depends a lot on the child (and the teacher).

Perhaps email feedback is a new initiative by the swimming lesson programme - I would ask for context. Agree with everyone who says that this wasn’t a request to tell your child off. And while you might not mind your daughter ducking under the water all the time and not listening it is a real difficulty for a swimming teacher. It takes time and attention away from the other children and is potentially risky behaviour. It sounds like she is old enough and experienced enough in having lessons to have stopped doing that and I think it’s reasonable for the teacher to elevate it to you.

I read this as: she isn’t listening well.
and that is causing her to ….. but the issue they want you to talk to her about (NOT tell her off about) is the listening.
7 is old enough to understand that they need to listen.

I would class that as significantly more in swimming lesson. And of course she's stopping the others progressing; if she's ducking under the water etc whilst the others are swimming, the teacher will be getting distracted worrying has she just ducked under messing about or is she having some sort of issue.
It makes the lessons unsafe for the other children.

However the telling off to the point she's upset is on you - they asked you to talk to her about listening and staying safe!

You’ve blown this way out of proportion tbh.
The tutor sees promise in your child, but your child is not concentrating. Tutor tells you this, as you are intentionally sending your daughter to swimming lessons and paying for them.
A simple ‘thanks for the heads up’ and a gentle chat with your daughter would have sufficed.

you alone have created this situation.

Find a different swim school - one that can meet her needs.
They're covering their arse basically. She can't swim, it's her fault, not theirs and you need to know that before you take her on a summer holiday and wonder why the hell she can't swim when you've spent ££££ on lessons. That's my take on it. She's probably also incredibly disruptive by the sounds of it.

I have a son the same age going through an ADHD referral. At age 6, the swimming teacher told me he wasn't progressing. He is confident and swims happily in the deep end etc but can't focus. I think it was becoming difficult to teach him in a group session and wasn't good for my bank balance or his confidence. We have reverted to a combination of mandatory school swimming lessons, private lessons (ad hoc) and swimming as a family. The advice from the CAHMS team was to stop doing extra curricular activities where he was struggling to keep up etc as the priority at this age before a diagnosis is to keep the child's confidence high and to keep them happy. If she is being told off all the time for not concentrating, it sounds similar and like a break might help. Once I reduced the difficult situations, things at school got easier and our relationship at home was happier. He still does some activities and obviously has to go to school etc. but maybe it's time for a change of tactics!

As a side note, many teachers have very little knowledge about ADHD, especially in girls. It’s frequently diagnosed at that age and if you suspect, refer yourself to CAMHS. It can take years to get an assessment.

If you are paying for the lessons they are wanting you that she isn’t making progress

Warning

My daughter was in a class with a child who found it difficult to concentrate and daydreamed and the swimming instructor often had to stop what she was doing and ask her to pay attention or stop messing around and distracting the other children especially when she was trying to watch the other children swim. I think you also have to remember that if the instructor is distracted by one child especially when the other children are swimming there is a risk that they may miss a child getting into trouble in the water.

Poor teaching and poor communication. There is no such thing as a naughty child. Presumably she is there at swimming voluntarily therefore teacher's job to work with, not against, the concentration span she has and aim to extend it not criticise poor child for it.

I'd read it as they see your child is more than capable however, she is not giving her full attention to the technique being taught therefore may lack the skills to move group at Christmas. I didn't read it as a negative just a request to speak with her to explain she needs to concentrate a bit more to get the most from her lessons & not get left behind. Why was your Daughter so upset? did she feel she was being told off when you mentioned what the teacher had said?