How would you read this email from the swimming teacher?

[Overwhelmedandout]

DD (just turned 7, starting Y2) has moved into a new group at swimming and has a new teacher. DD’s not terrible - can swim a couple of lengths, etc.

She has always had issues with concentration. I have suspected for some time that she might have ADHD but her teachers, while commenting on her lack of concentration, seem to think that she’s too young to be able to draw an accurate conclusion.

This evening, completely out of the blue, I’ve had an email from the head of the swimming school, stating that:

“[Teacher] says that [DD] is very capable but because she lacks focus, and doesn’t always listen, she isn’t refining her technique, and her stroke can be quite messy.”

They want me to “speak to her to make sure she gets the most out of her swimming lessons” and moves into the next group after Christmas. I did, and she cried for an hour, and we have all gone to bed upset.

I figured that she must have been pretty naughty for them to send this kind of email. I’ve definitely never had one before, in years of lessons for the DC. Would you read this as “she’s causing chaos in the lesson / setting fire to the other kids” or “she’s daydreaming and isn’t improving her technique”? If it’s the former then fair enough, and she deserves a telling off. If it’s the latter… well, to be honest, I can’t get all upset about a Y2 child having a messy swimming stroke/ if she doesn’t move up a group in four months. But it must have been quite bad, surely - it would be insane to send me a random email telling me that a 7 year old’s swimming stroke is messy and I must tell her off for it?!

I kindof agree but actually there comes a point when you have a kid like this that you have to point out that yes it is rude and inconsiderate actually. Whether they're ND or not they have to realise that their behaviour is bloody disrespectful to their teacher and the other kids who actually want to learn and they have to be very blunty told how annoying it is.

It's great that kids are diagnosed with ND more now and there's more awareness but we can't deny that what has come with it is a massive dip in the general behaviour standards of children. Society just won't function any more if the next generation keep being raised to be so egocentric

This. What on earth did you say to your daughter op?

I’m not sure I saw where op ssud a two year old would stand a better chance? Wasn’t it that dd can swim two lengths ( not “ like a two year old.” )

I think this is a bad example of the current focus on being kind. We tell kids that it's very important and now the kid feels that she is not a kind person. It's a bit guilt trippy. The message I'd have given is that it's the teacher's job to teach and it's the child's to listen and try her best. Both for her own progression and to let the teacher do their job. Kids not listening is a pain, but I wouldn't call it unkind.

Very probably this. We've just had the Olympics. Some parent will have decided their child is the next Adam Peatty and is pushing the swim teacher. She can't win really; you don't want your daughter to be pushed and to feel pressured,others with 7 year olds will absolutely want their child to be pushed ( they can show off to friends/ feel they're getting better value for money/ dream of never-going -to -happen Olympic glory. ). I was a teacher for 20 years. There isn't enough money in the entire world that would persuade me to teach a Saturday swimming class.

I'm not going to comment on how you should or shouldn't have reacted to the email as you have already had so many replies.

But - keep that email. If she does go forward to ADHD assessment this is the sort of evidence which will be helpful in the assessment. Keep any school reports etc where behaviour is mentioned just in case. You might never need them, but they can be invaluable.

OP, why don't you just ask the swimming teacher what you're asking here?
The teacher will have a much better understanding of what they meant by the text than randoms on MN do!

I think you should consider too that teachers take different approaches to dealing with parents, ie getting a message out of the blue may simply mean a new teacher or management style, rather than extreme behaviour on the part of DD.

From the text as written I wouldn't have jumped to the conclusion that you had to have words with DD to the extent that she cried for an hour!

Yes, all of this op.

I think you may need to change swimming school, to one where you can watch. Possibly a smaller group and only one set of lessons running at a time. Your daughter could simply be overwhelmed by noise and stop start nature of the lesson.
My son has just turned 7 and can be a bit distracted/messy with strokes during his swimming lessons. However he is in a class of 3 only, so the teacher can support each child's own development. They also stay with the same teacher and just gently work through each level of achievement. I also watch every lesson, so can access what is happening. The teacher is very firm if any misbehaving or I will speak to my son.
I read the email you received as not being about an individual child, but their organisation. Children learn at different rates and your daughter may not be ready to move classes after Christmas. There shouldn't be any pressure to do so. Presumably the swim school just want a group of children to learn xyz in the autumn term, tick a box and move them on. Rather than understanding some children may progress and some might not.

I was referring to my own dd. She can probably also swim about 2 lengths but just loses it when she's out of her depth

I do get the importance of swimming correctly but it should also be fun shouldn't it?

I never learnt crawl, it takes me 40mins to swim a km, my backstroke is more floating than anything else & I love swimming!

I can't help thinking that too much focus on technique would have knocked that out of me.

I never wanted to compete!

The email was just to let you know if she's not very good it's not our fault as she's not engaged.

If she can't concentrate because she's ADHD then shouting at her, lecturing her or whatever happened to make her cry is not going to help. Just put her off totally.

I was a dreamer at school. Because I was clever and bored in lessons. Your child is probably just bored too.

I'd suggest more value would be achieved in individual lessons with you about in the pool to have playtime afterwards if possible.

She's probably trying her best, wee soul.

They are probably planning to keep her in this group after Christmas and are giving you a heads up.

I think you're being really defensive and it isn't needed. Most people go to the effort of taking their child to swimming lessons for them to actually improve on their abilities. If your child isn't making typical progress because they are day dreaming, I don't think it is wrong of them to point out that if you and your child want to improve, then paying attention would help. If you didn't want to have that conversation and won't complain that your child isn't progressing, then I would have just ignored it. Many people would consider it a waste of time to go if their child isn't progressing but if you are happy to just go and your child has fun, that is fine

I have a different take. In the context of you have had (in your words) hundreds of lessons there and this is the first email sent and this is a new swim class .. I would take that as she has potential. The swim teacher thinks that with a bit more focus, your DD can move up a section after Christmas.

That's how I would have approached it. DD, your teacher thinks you can be a super swimmer. This is amazing. She has asked me to remind about x (mention something specific) and y (again something specific). '

I had similar issues with my son until he was about 8 - he seems to be growing out of it now, but he probably has ADHD which affect his focus. The shimmering light on the water and the opportunity to dunk his head underneath seems irresistible and very distracting.

I think you just have a teacher who is genuinely invested in kids learning well and getting the most out of lessons, I’d see it as a plus. Often swimming teachers can be a bit rubbish and don’t get to know the kids at all, I wouldn’t worry about it.

Has anyone asked her why she doesn't seem to be able to focus and if she is enjoying learning to swim?

I would read that as 'we're just covering ourselves because you might complain in the future that your child hasn't moved up a level as quickly as others. This is not because we're not teaching her, but as she finds listening difficult, she obviously won't progress as quickly'

There is an obsession with some parents about their children having ADHD. Poor concentration does not always, or even nearly always, equate to ADHD- occasionally it does. Much more usually it equates to factors like age, maturity, what kind of tasks the child does at home, doing things alone and persevering, levels of noise at home, their level of resilience and self-confidence to have a go at things and fail (parental attitudes important here of course).

Does she have ADHD, dyspraxia? Has the school mentioned anything about inattention, messy handwriting, disorganised?

DD got to Level 4 in swimming and then stayed there for about 2 years. I saw for myself that she was just messing around, twirling, going under the water, and not listening to the teacher. I stopped the lessons as I was wasting my time and money. I should have stopped them a lot earlier. The swim school would have happily carried on taking my money while getting nowhere.

If your DD is not progressing then stop the lessons. She can always have more when she is older.

DD is 16 now, and diagnosed with Dyspraxia, Dyslexia, and has been referred for ADHD and ASD.

I think you completely misunderstood the email and I'm shocked that you thought you could be so harsh with your child and make them cry. If you suspect she has ADHD then you surely also know that she can't help getting distracted and being impulsive and that telling her that that is unkind is just basically telling her that she is a useless person as she is.

If you genuinely think that she has ADHD then I would refer her to cahms yourself and start pursuing a diagnosis as in my area the waiting list is 5 years for assessment so you really need to get on with it. She will not get any help at secondary if she does not have a diagnosis.

It would probably also be a good idea for you to join some Facebook groups for ADHD children so that you can learn better about your child and how best to support them in life because that is your job as a parent to support your child not to support teachers based on an ambiguous email and then be so harsh to your child that you make them cry for an hour. That kind of stuff is core memory and will absolutely destroy your child for the future. I speak as a neurodivergent adult who was not parented properly and has spent most of my life feeling that I was useless and awful. Getting a diagnosis as an adult completely changed how I view myself

One Facebook group I would recommend is called gentle parenting for autistic ADHD PDA children

I know I probably sound harsh but I'm devastated for your poor child and would really urge you to rethink how you parent her. You absolutely have to be her supporter and stand up for her in the system.

I mean I’m just trying to work out how she’s setting fire to other kids 🤔😵‍💫😵‍💫
Then, you’ve labelled her naughty and made her cry for an hour, for no reason at all 😵‍💫😵‍💫

My main take from this is, if you think she has ADHD then get this investigated further, regardless of what school says - they are not equipped to diagnose this condition, simple as that.

You’ve given your poor dd such a hard time over nothing, and that nothing is something which could be completely out of her control and capabilities right now. 😞😡

She's only 7 (and only just 7) ffs. They are talking to her as if she's a young adult. This doesn't sound like a good teacher to me. Kids of 7 are so young, still developing in every way. I think I'd look for another teacher, one who understands child development and knows how to talk to children.

Children are under so much pressure to compete these days. Unless she loves swimming, I'd give her a break from the whole thing. She can swim a couple of lengths and that's great for 7. She can come back to it at any time she wants.

Seven is still very young for swimming - there is too much pressure now and not every child is a natural water baby - my ds stayed in 'lower' classes for ages but he did learn to swim eventually. I changed from the council classes to private ones though and the relationship was much friendlier and he was able to go at his own pace