How to manage grandchild situation

[Blueflipflops]

My son is doing very well for himself, he is married and has lived abroad with his wife for the last 5 years earning good money. He has a son who is 2 , let’s call him Jack. As they lived abroad, Jack doesn't really know us.

My son, his wife and Jack have recently returned to the Uk and he lives close by. I was so happy that they were returning and I was now able to get to know Jack.

Jack has had one main care giver, his mum. From my observations, Jack hasn’t had many interactions with any other humans. He hasn’t been socialised at all and is always by his mums side or on her hip. He will always choose his mum over his dad in getting his needs met.

Now, getting to the point….
Jack is absolutely terrified of us. He cries, physically trembles, clings onto his mum petrified that she is going to put him down. He is hyper alert watching our every move. He won’t come any where near us. I would go to say that he presents as being traumatised when in our company.
It’s absolutely heart breaking that Jack is so fearful of us.

I don’t believe these behaviours are due to an undiagnosed condition, I think it’s because he has been isolated and lack of socialisation.

Yesterday, I had to drop an item off at my sons, I knocked and let myself in as they were expecting me. Jack took one look at me, ran to his mum and started to tremble and cry.

In 2 years, I have never held him, picked him up, fed him, played with him, sang to him, rocked him to sleep, pushed his pram. It’s heartbreaking, I don’t know the best way forward. It has now come to the point where I dread seeing him as it’s so awful for everyone involved. No one knows what to do to make things better.

Do I keep my distance so he is not further traumatised by my visiting or do I persevere in trying to build a relationship?

I disagree. Not all adults notice it but different countries feel different, smell different, the food is different, the ambient noise is different.

It's huge for an adult, who understands why everything is different.

It's even harder for a 2 year old who doesn't understand why everything and everyone he knows is gone and now all his surroundings are different, food is different, people are different, etc.

Think about it properly.

My 2yo is like this. We live round the corner from my mum and she sees my kids fairly regularly, but it still took a long long time for my youngest to accept her. He is very clingy with me, more so than any of my others ever were at this age. I don’t know why, my other two went through varying degrees of clinginess but nowhere near as intense as my youngest. He is very much socialised, he goes to nursery, we get out and about, big group of friends with varying age kids, 2 big brothers, he’s not lacking socialisation in his life.

it’s taken a very long time but My youngest is usually excited to see my mum now, cuddles and kisses her, plays with her, whereas even six to eight months ago he cried in her presence more often than not. There was a point where he completely refused to look at strangers and would cover his face when someone he didn’t know looked at him (which made for a very fun dentist appointment last year!). he’s even got a bit braver with this as well and actually looks back at people, sometimes throws in a hello. Huge steps forward from where he was. This is in contrast to my eldest who at 2 would happily chat away to strangers and tell them our exact address and would happily chat and play with family members he didn’t even see often.

Take note of what other users have suggested. Small steps, he’ll get there. Some kids are just very shy and take a while to break out of their shell. He’s also had a big upheaval in his life which undoubtedly won’t help any anxiety he has.

yup, interesting article here. https://courses.lumenlearning.com/waymaker-psychology/chapter/stressors/

Also I agree with some of the ops that the best way is to go round but not try to force yourself onto Jack.

You can pop round for a cuppa with your son and dil. Just ignore Jack. Maybe try bringing a small token gift sometimes.

Eventually he will get used to you and come to you.

But trying to instigate hugs, kisses or playing is obviously too soon for Jack,

If you tread carefully and don't take this to heart or blame Jacks mum, you will eventually have a lively relationship.

My daughter is two and this could be describing her (without the move to a new country). There’s no reason to be like this, she’s the youngest of five and has been socialised more than any of her siblings as my work is far more flexible now so we can do all the baby groups and activities etc. She’s just shy to the point of being terrified of other people. If someone other than me, her dad or siblings try to interact with her she just freezes and completely shuts down. At home she won’t even go to her dad and he’s been a loving and attentive parent her whole life.
Honestly it’s exhausting, I’m utterly depleted, I can’t remember the last time I was able to even make a meal without either having her in my arms or crying at my feet. Jack’s mum probably feels very similar, I imagine like me she’s hanging on tightly to the thought that it HAS to be a phase and that things will get better. I’m sure she’d love for you to be able to have a relationship with your grandson but knows that forcing it won’t work.
To offer a little bit of hope, we’ve just got back from the grandparents, they’re wonderful humans who have been really patient dealing with my daughter’s terror at the sight of them and finally this visit she sat on her grandma’s lap and read a book for around five minutes (ok she was back to her usual state of terror an hour later but this was HUGE). Hang tight and keep the pressure off, it’ll happen for you too I’m sure.

You just need to give it time to build a relationship with him. At 2 years old it's a fairly common reaction to someone you haven't seen weekly since you were born. Little and often. Build up to interacting with him but try to start spending more time with them as a family.
For context my currently 2.5 year old doesn't like my grandparents. We see them monthly at the most, they are always at family celebrations etc. She refused to be put down in their house which she has visited I'd say 30 times over the last 2.5 years, runs away if they enter our house. It's slowly getting better now and she will go to them and interact towards the end of visits but its been a long process.
She has been at nursery since 10 months and regularly has days out with my parents so its not a fact she isn't use to being away from me.

You are talking about a 2yo who's recently been uprooted from their home country to live somewhere entirely new. I think your attitude stinks.

It's totally normal for 2yo to dislike strangers. You sound like you are managing to twist it into your dil being a bad parent (somehow you don't blame your ds though).

If you want a relationship, then you need to put in the effort. Lots of short contact. Foster a warm relationship with his parents. Don't do things like letting yourself in if you know it might surprise him. Accept him as he is.

If you become an ally to his parents they can work with you. Could you read a familiar story to him while he sits on mum's lap? Could you sit on the floor with him and mum and join a game?

He's a tiny child, focus on his feelings rather than your own.

I think it’s huge. He’s old enough to realise but too young to understand. He may be terrified he’ll go to sleep and mum will disappear too.
Depending where he has come from it might be totally alien - temperature, food, smell, sounds.

“AdultChildQuestion · Today 08:10
Children are like cats. Ignore them, don't get in their face, and eventually they will realise you're not a threat and relax around you.

Good advice above to get down on the floor and start playing with something.”

This with bells on. I used to say our toddlers were like cats - you have to let them come to you. Just being naturally around him, chatting to his parents etc will help him get used to you.

Stop blaming his mother OP, the one who clearly does the vast majority of parenting. It’s perfectly normal for a two year old to pick his mother over his father. You’re only going to make things worse if you start painting her as a bad guy for no reason whatsoever.

This. The little guy is probably just overwhelmed. Moving to a new place with lots of new faces at 2 must be very scary. Over time he will learn you’re nothing to fear and will get more comfortable. Try not to go overboard giving him attention as he clearly doesn’t want attention right now. If you keep visiting in short sessions, I would bet you’ll start to see him come out his shell a bit. Soon he’ll start moving away from his mums knee and playing with his toys, then maybe even showing you some of his toys and after that when your just normal boring granny, like the PP says you’ll be pushing him on the swings.

Its just gradual exposure. Let him come to you. Staying away won't help. He's still little he'll get used.

Have you tried going to visit with some fun looking toys, and then not making a big deal.of it, but just sit down on the floor and quietly okay with them yourself. Don't make a big deal of trying to include him. Just have a casual chat to his parent whilst playing? Being sat on the floor is key, don't try to make eye contact with the child, keep it super low pressure. And repeat.

My DD2 was like this. She saw my PiL and SiL every weekend from a few weeks old. She didn't smile at her auntie until she was 18 months old. Even at 2, she would cry when my sister visited every couple of months. She didnt like people coming into the safe space of her own, even if i prepared her. We home educate, and it took her over a year after covid restrictions were lifted to play away from me and make friends at a group we visited every week. She saw some of these children 3 or 4 times a week at different activities. Now, at 7yo, she's confident and happy to play with others, but still prefers her own company.

My DD1 by contrast, has been happy to be social and go to any family from very young. She has lots of friends and is quick to welcome in new children to our home ed groups.

They have had the same opportunities for socialisation, but my youngest has just needed more support to access that on her own level over the years.

All of this is many words to say that Jack has just gone through a big change. You are a new person in his life. Be consistent and unjudgemental, his mum will be supporting him, and just give him the time he needs.

Just to add to the arguments that is isn’t necessarily nurture and can be nature; when I had my first I didn’t drive and we lived very rurally with no public transport. DH worked very long hours so barely saw her during the week and we had no family nearby. I breastfed and she didn’t see many people at all; my in-laws fortnightly and my parents about every 6 weeks. She was pretty happy to go to anybody! I occasionally felt jealous of more Velcro babies although I’m sure the novelty would have palled soon had she turned into one.

Sorry @Blueflipflops but is this the first time that you have actually met Jack? Were you not able to visit him and his parents at all in the first two years? I am asking this because I think you said you have never even held him or cuddled him? Did they live in New Zealand or Australia (you said it was an English speaking country, and I presume it wasn't America or Canada, as I expect you would have made the journey over there to see them?

You haven't mentioned whether he has grandparents on his Mum's side of the family, and if so has he met them, did he live near them, was he close to them but has now left in another country? I think that you do really need to slow right down, you can't get those 2 years back, but you might have the rest of your life to bond with your darling little Grandson if you don't frighten their whole little family away by being so judgemental, and by feeling so entitled.

Once I left home, 50 odd years ago, I always had a key to my parents front door, even though they moved a few times before they sadly died. I never let myself into their house, I knocked and waited for them to either answer the door, or to call out to me to let myself in - even if they were expecting me! I certainly would never knock and then just walk into their home.

So, IMO the best thing you can do for now - as well as taking everything really slowly - is to get to know and hopefully love your dear DiL, and to respect both your DiL and your son. I love all of my DiLaws (yes, I am a dreaded MiL), and it was easy for me to love them because they all make my sons' happy! My sons' fell in love with them, so that told me all that I needed to know about my DDiLaws. Then as I got to know them individually - they are all quite different to each other, but they match my son's characters marvellously - I learned that they are all very kind hearted, which shows in different ways, and they all have great senses of humour, again often set off by different situations, one of them has a very wicked sense of humour, which I have too, so we often laugh at the same things.

Please OP, before trying to bond with your DGS, try to find the positives about your DDiL first, try to find things that you can respect about her even if she does things in a different way to you. At least your DiL is devoted to her son, and sadly in my life I have had to meet with some mothers (thankfully not many when put into perspective) who did not take to motherhood at all, most of them were because of some tragic, but understable reasons. So like I suggested, if you can look at the positives about your DDiL, and have faith that your DS would not have fallen for someone who was unsuitable for him (even if you wouldn't have chosen her for your son), you hopefully brought him up to be independent and to trust his own - important - instincts and decisions?

I think that if you put your relationship with your DGS on the back burner for now, and make getting to know and understand your DDiL for now, you might find that your relationship with your DGS will just develop naturally into the one I wish for both of you. Can I just add one more note of caution, please don't force any feelings between you and your DDiL, take that relationship as slowly as necessary too, but if you start 'acting' the devoted MiL it just won't work, any feelings and thoughts you have about her do have to be genuine, and if the desired feelings just don't/can't* *develop then at least try to respect anything about her that you can, and be polite, and don't be pushy. 💐

Try not to take it personal, yes your his grandparent and you love him because he’s genetically part of you but to him your a stranger and he needs to get to know you. It’s no different really to every single 2 year old clinging to their mother when they start nursery, they all get there eventually! it’s just fear of the unknown, take it slow, no pressure, he will get there.

You've had the same (very good!) Advice from just about everyone. Take it slow. He's moved country at a young age and is probably feeling very unsettled and clinging to what makes him feel safe. Just be present without pressure. He'll.come.round.

I have been the child that felt very uncomfortable with grandparents when little. We saw them infrequently because they didn't like to travel (3hour drive) didn't have space for us to stay with them comfortably. I remember being very uncomfortable - I couldn't remember what they looked like but they greeted me like I should know them. I didn't know their rules and basically sat on my mum's lap the whole time. On a later visit (I must have been about 5 by this time) my granny for cross at me being shy. Not very, she was just frustrated that when she opened the door she tried to sweep me up for a cuddle and a kiss (which no doubt she did to my many cousins that she saw very frequently) and I think I must have gone kind of stiff. I felt dreadful for being "difficult" as I wasn't trying to be naughty. I felt even worse when she then snapped at my mum for"not bringing me up properly". I remember feeling really sick. Children pick.up.on your judgement of them and their parent. I never ever felt close to my granny, visits always felt pressured and awkward. My grandad was much easier. He gave me space and was just very relaxed and quiet. He sat next to me and showed me things, or took me for a walk in the garden and toldme about his flowers. I didn't feel like I had to say anything. I loved him very much.

My MIL lived abroad when my eldest was born. It was fine the first time she visited, DD was just a baby. The next time she came DD was 18 months. DD justscreamed everytime MIL came close. Lots of arguments. DD wontremember it, but it really soured my relationship.with MIL which never recovered.

Please OP. The two most impttant things are to relax andguve your grandchild.time, and also don't judge yourDS and DDIL.

Shocker : baby clings to mum and it's mums fault.

You have been given excellent advice on this thread.

DD was well socialised- nursery, dancing lessons, extended family, days out etc, but she was incredibly shy & clingy to me & her dad as a toddler, particularly with adults she didn't know/know well. She wasn't keen on one of her grandads & uncles, despite them both being lovely & seeing them regularly. It was just her personality. Older DS in contrast, would've gone off with anyone who said hello to him.

She's older now and a lot better but still reserved and thinks before she speaks with new adults.

Give it time and do it gently. Just be around and not trying to actively play with him/hug him etc.

I'd say little and often. It's not as unusual as you might think and definitely doesn't mean that his mum has done anything wrong, she's your grandson's safe person, of course he wants to be near her when he's uncomfortable.

My eldest was the same with my MIL until he was around three (and he went to multiple baby groups/activities every week from being a baby). In his case, I think he scared of how excited she was to see him which was a real shame! (He does like spending time with her now he's a bit older.)

The reason isn't always obvious though. My cousin was like it with my grandma and any other older woman, and my friends little boy would sob whenever he saw a man with a beard 🤷‍♀️

It's difficult, but try not to take it personally.

I havn't read all the responses so someone else might have said this. When my sister adopted my nephew we weren't allowed to go to their home until he was settled, i can't remember how long it was. Instead we were told that the best thing was to 'bump' into eachother in the park for 15 minutes at a time as to not overwhelm him. Maybe something like that work, it might be worth suggesting it to his parents.

That is a great idea Wanderinghome.