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Farage inciting division, thread #2

246 replies

LiterallyOnFire · 05/08/2024 15:30

Continuation

OP posts:
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8
MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 06/08/2024 08:17

LiterallyOnFire · 06/08/2024 08:00

Has it really been that bad? So much that it bursts through the silos?

I haven't had a Twitter account for years so I haven't seen it.

Honestly, it has been absolutely horrific. Never seen anything like it.

LiterallyOnFire · 06/08/2024 08:43

Honestly, it has been absolutely horrific. Never seen anything like it.

I wonder what the rest of the world is making of us?

OP posts:
BIossomtoes · 06/08/2024 08:48

LiterallyOnFire · 06/08/2024 08:43

Honestly, it has been absolutely horrific. Never seen anything like it.

I wonder what the rest of the world is making of us?

Probably very much what we all thought about the US when Capitol Hill was stormed.

LiterallyOnFire · 06/08/2024 08:49

Yeah. I guess so

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Kendodd · 06/08/2024 09:05

LiterallyOnFire · 06/08/2024 08:43

Honestly, it has been absolutely horrific. Never seen anything like it.

I wonder what the rest of the world is making of us?

They're advising their citizens not to travel here.

CassieMaddox · 06/08/2024 09:16

Kendodd · 06/08/2024 09:05

They're advising their citizens not to travel here.

If I were Muslim from outside the UK I'd not be wanting to travel here either. The number of posters cancelling trips away seems high too.
Well done rioters, just what our shaky economy needed

MistressoftheDarkSide · 06/08/2024 09:23

Well I think I saw that Malaysia had put a warning up to its citizens to avoid travelling here. And of course Elin Musk is suggesting we're on the brink of civil war.

Given what's going on in the rest of the world I would imagine it's hardly registering in some quarters, while others are probably scratching their heads and going 🤔.

I wonder if the rioters are being used AS an immigration deterrent? I mean, it's far fetched and vaguely tin foil hat but if the end result is people being too fearful to come here they will have won won't they?

And extrapolating from that, I wonder how they'll feel when the economy doesn't improve, in fact it worsens because a fair few people are going to want to leave I imagine, and they've ended up living in a police state because suddenly dissent of any sort is regarded as domestic terrorism.

We're going to be living in a permanent state of mistrust and tension between communities, and the lack of integration they complain about will just get worse - not that I think lack of integration is as big an issue as is often claimed by the thug contingent.

I worry most about teenagers at school. While many are of course inclusive and tolerant and will have little truck with all this, some will be loyal to their family's views and politics and it will give teachers already struggling another headache, especially if the diktat is to jump on any signs of radicalisation like a ton of bricks.

I know things weren't perfect before these riots and I may be catastrophising, but honestly, achieving cohesion and harmony of any sort might be a bloody uphill battle.

All of these things are why it worries me when people are dismissive of the potential impact of what's happening. Previous riots have been basically about one incident and usually reflect localised specific issues and are contained.

This is different. The event that sparked it was the most tenuous motivation. The speed of the misinformation was extremely suspicion. The riots are orchestrated and if there is any funding going on that's a huge concern. People like Farage et al are not going to look this gift horse in the mouth for their own personal and political gains, regardless of what they say in public. The "US and Them" army have already been encouraged and will possibly become emboldened. History has taught us a few lessons about this which we can't talk about openly for fear of being accused of hyperbole.

The plans to target immigration lawyers and centres means they are willing to target anyone they perceive as "guilty by association", which could end up with wider conflicts, because I sure as hell will go down fighting racism if I have to.

And there it is - I, a middle aged, unfit woman, "poor" by practical definition, am opposed to violence, but backed into a corner I'll come out swinging to defend myself and others. Which makes me just as bad?

I really hope I'm way off the mark and I read this back in 6 months and feel pretty silly. I really do.

CassieMaddox · 06/08/2024 09:29

MistressoftheDarkSide · 06/08/2024 09:23

Well I think I saw that Malaysia had put a warning up to its citizens to avoid travelling here. And of course Elin Musk is suggesting we're on the brink of civil war.

Given what's going on in the rest of the world I would imagine it's hardly registering in some quarters, while others are probably scratching their heads and going 🤔.

I wonder if the rioters are being used AS an immigration deterrent? I mean, it's far fetched and vaguely tin foil hat but if the end result is people being too fearful to come here they will have won won't they?

And extrapolating from that, I wonder how they'll feel when the economy doesn't improve, in fact it worsens because a fair few people are going to want to leave I imagine, and they've ended up living in a police state because suddenly dissent of any sort is regarded as domestic terrorism.

We're going to be living in a permanent state of mistrust and tension between communities, and the lack of integration they complain about will just get worse - not that I think lack of integration is as big an issue as is often claimed by the thug contingent.

I worry most about teenagers at school. While many are of course inclusive and tolerant and will have little truck with all this, some will be loyal to their family's views and politics and it will give teachers already struggling another headache, especially if the diktat is to jump on any signs of radicalisation like a ton of bricks.

I know things weren't perfect before these riots and I may be catastrophising, but honestly, achieving cohesion and harmony of any sort might be a bloody uphill battle.

All of these things are why it worries me when people are dismissive of the potential impact of what's happening. Previous riots have been basically about one incident and usually reflect localised specific issues and are contained.

This is different. The event that sparked it was the most tenuous motivation. The speed of the misinformation was extremely suspicion. The riots are orchestrated and if there is any funding going on that's a huge concern. People like Farage et al are not going to look this gift horse in the mouth for their own personal and political gains, regardless of what they say in public. The "US and Them" army have already been encouraged and will possibly become emboldened. History has taught us a few lessons about this which we can't talk about openly for fear of being accused of hyperbole.

The plans to target immigration lawyers and centres means they are willing to target anyone they perceive as "guilty by association", which could end up with wider conflicts, because I sure as hell will go down fighting racism if I have to.

And there it is - I, a middle aged, unfit woman, "poor" by practical definition, am opposed to violence, but backed into a corner I'll come out swinging to defend myself and others. Which makes me just as bad?

I really hope I'm way off the mark and I read this back in 6 months and feel pretty silly. I really do.

It doesn't make you "just as bad"..defence is different to attack

I still think that it's going to calm down once people start getting locked up. Because the vast majority of people 1) aren't racist and 2) recognise TRs "two tier policing" for the inflammatory nonsense it is. The number of rioters has a low ceiling, when they start getting locked up the number of people rioting will fall.

I also hope various people online face charges for inciting violence.

If I'm wrong I'll stand alongside you as will most of the British public. We aren't a country that stands for fascism.

Alwaystired94 · 06/08/2024 09:39

CassieMaddox · 06/08/2024 09:29

It doesn't make you "just as bad"..defence is different to attack

I still think that it's going to calm down once people start getting locked up. Because the vast majority of people 1) aren't racist and 2) recognise TRs "two tier policing" for the inflammatory nonsense it is. The number of rioters has a low ceiling, when they start getting locked up the number of people rioting will fall.

I also hope various people online face charges for inciting violence.

If I'm wrong I'll stand alongside you as will most of the British public. We aren't a country that stands for fascism.

There does need to be tougher restrictions in regards to online activity. Too many hide behind anonymous identities online and use that protection to spread misinformation, say things they wouldn't dare say if their name and face was attached to it and call for the most horrific things. I've read some chilling stuff on X this week.

The rampant misinformation campaign on X in particular is dangerous. Their 'community notes' is a joke. You can post pretty much any slur you want, call for entire groups of people to be culled from society but yet you get flagged for using 'cis' it's insanity.

X is one of, if not the most, toxic social media now since Elon bought it. He's cultivated a disgusting level of hatred on there. People are only too happy to spread misinformation not caring that it puts people at risk of serious harm, because they've dehumanised the 'others'.

I think it will start to 'calm down' to a degree because as you said, the vast majority of the country do not share those views. And even the ones who do believe in some of the Reform etc rhetoric are calling out rioters as being in the wrong.

LiterallyOnFire · 06/08/2024 10:49

The family from the Manchester airport fight are now giving a press conference, which is unfortunate timing.

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TizerorFizz · 07/08/2024 08:48

They don’t see it as unfortunate timing. It’s done for a reason.

Alexandra2001 · 07/08/2024 09:22

I'd like to see X shut down in the UK and for us to encourage the EU to do the same.
Also, an arrest warrant out for Musk and the % global turn over fine applied, he is openly challenging the UK's elected PM, thats unacceptable.

Also, those rioters who have so far been sentenced have received v v light terms, 2 months for affray.... hardly going to deter is it.

By not cracking down hard on the first riots, the UK will now see many more, its basic parenting 101 really.

MistressoftheDarkSide · 07/08/2024 10:16

Trouble is corporations like X are too economically valuable to shut down, regardless of content. Platforms definitely have a responsibility to make sure that information shared is verified, but that's increasingly difficult due to AI and bot farms. That saying about a lie going halfway round the world before the truth has even got its boots on is very apt here.

Then we have the issues of opinion and free speech - it has to be balanced with the likely consequences hence hate speech laws and incitement laws, but then we get the whining about being silenced. Which leads to more platforms being created, more underground division, more sophisticated encryption and more difficulty in monitoring the zeitgeist.

All of this is a problem I absolutely agree but as a bit if a Luddite who really only posts here and has essentially given up Facebook the only other social media site I used to post on when I needed it to promote my now demised business, I'm not in the least bit qualified to form a coherent nursery and bolts theory as to the solution.

I am interested in the psychological impact of all technology and the rather terrifying speed of its development and applications, and how social media is an incredibly fertile testing ground to establish how best to push our buttons. Most of the motivation is pure consumerism / capitalistic but political use is a whole other ball game. And of course given the lockstep between governments and corporations and the global nature of the modern world those two things can't easily be separated out.

Add in the surveillance aspect, the prospect of CDBC and the quiet admiration of the Social Credit model and we're in a world of pain. It doesn't help when if you mention the WEF for example everyone screams "conspiracy theory". While their sphere of influence may be limited, their own words are that their goal is to "infiltrate every government in the world" strike me as a little bit sinister.

So many people don't realise the implications of the social credit system. Many don't know it exists in China. Some who do think it's a great idea to maintain order but overlook the potential cost to community as a necessary sacrifice.

Ah, sorry I'm banging on again, and probably massively overthinking.

MistressoftheDarkSide · 07/08/2024 10:18

Nuts and bolts theory that should read. Autocorrect is obviously drunk again 😂

LiterallyOnFire · 07/08/2024 16:55

MistressoftheDarkSide · 07/08/2024 08:41

Thanks for that.

OP posts:
LiterallyOnFire · 07/08/2024 16:57

MistressoftheDarkSide · 07/08/2024 10:16

Trouble is corporations like X are too economically valuable to shut down, regardless of content. Platforms definitely have a responsibility to make sure that information shared is verified, but that's increasingly difficult due to AI and bot farms. That saying about a lie going halfway round the world before the truth has even got its boots on is very apt here.

Then we have the issues of opinion and free speech - it has to be balanced with the likely consequences hence hate speech laws and incitement laws, but then we get the whining about being silenced. Which leads to more platforms being created, more underground division, more sophisticated encryption and more difficulty in monitoring the zeitgeist.

All of this is a problem I absolutely agree but as a bit if a Luddite who really only posts here and has essentially given up Facebook the only other social media site I used to post on when I needed it to promote my now demised business, I'm not in the least bit qualified to form a coherent nursery and bolts theory as to the solution.

I am interested in the psychological impact of all technology and the rather terrifying speed of its development and applications, and how social media is an incredibly fertile testing ground to establish how best to push our buttons. Most of the motivation is pure consumerism / capitalistic but political use is a whole other ball game. And of course given the lockstep between governments and corporations and the global nature of the modern world those two things can't easily be separated out.

Add in the surveillance aspect, the prospect of CDBC and the quiet admiration of the Social Credit model and we're in a world of pain. It doesn't help when if you mention the WEF for example everyone screams "conspiracy theory". While their sphere of influence may be limited, their own words are that their goal is to "infiltrate every government in the world" strike me as a little bit sinister.

So many people don't realise the implications of the social credit system. Many don't know it exists in China. Some who do think it's a great idea to maintain order but overlook the potential cost to community as a necessary sacrifice.

Ah, sorry I'm banging on again, and probably massively overthinking.

No I don't think you're overthinking at all. There are definitely many tentacles to this.

Has Farage shut up on TwiX? Or still poking away at the fire?

OP posts:
MistressoftheDarkSide · 07/08/2024 18:01

Haven't seen anything reported but I did see a video on YouTube where he was squirming around and denying he'd spread lies and disinformation.....

What I am finding weird is the media keeping on about up to 100 potential protests tonight. I wonder if only a few happen it'll give them the chance to sort of say "it's not as bad as we thought - stand down everybody" - sort of weird reverse psychology?

I mean with all this hype and preparation if nothing happens - which I absolutely would prefer, obviously - will it call into question the intelligence they're receiving? The whole country is kind of on high alert after all. I'm a bit baffled tbh.

MistressoftheDarkSide · 07/08/2024 18:11

Oh and of course if little or nothing much actually happens tonight, it will be hailed as a massive success because the threat of heavy policing will have seen off the rioters? Which will reassure the public? Just trying to work through all the potential strategies.

LiterallyOnFire · 07/08/2024 19:05

I don't know what to make of it all. There's clearly a lot going on and much of it below the radar.

The announcement from Alder Hey hospital that all the stabbing survivors had been discharged the other day - that felt very unusual. The media response certainly feels very studied and almost artificial.

Strange times, I guess. I just hope the media management helps.

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MistressoftheDarkSide · 07/08/2024 19:34

I've been monitoring my Facebook feed and I'm seeing friends warning of unrest tonight in my town which is not on the list that's been circulated. Apparently there are three riot vans outside the hotel we do know houses refugees, but the local police have issued a statement saying they are unaware of any planned activity but are monitoring the situation. Local licensees are closing up and complaining that they haven't been given any Intel by the council or police. This has all started to circulate in the last couple of hours.

My cynical side is wondering if someone or some organisation is trying to start something....the area under threat is completely multi-cultural and I used to have my business there so I know it's mainly students, eateries, pubs etc with a very strong alternative culture as well. There is no history if tensions between any of the groups that I can recall.

I'll just say it straight - I'm getting strong psy-op vibes and if that makes me a tin foil hatter so be it because sod all is making any sense to me right now.

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