I just can’t fucking get on board with this one

[Streamorwatchlive]

From The Guardian today.

Never swear in front of your kids. Sandahl says swearing encourages a reduction in vocabulary. “‘Fuck’ is a catch-all word: but we’ve got a beautiful language, and we have so many words to express what we feel,” she says.

I’d like to see this evidence that by including swear words in your vocabulary that you are simultaneously reducing it overall. I swear like a trooper and I am a writer with a fantastic vocab (not a commercial tabloid type, this isn’t for a story don’t worry!)

In the real world, of course, we all swear occasionally: and, if you do, the important thing, says Sandahl, is to own it, to maybe laugh about it, to explain why you’re feeling frustrated. “Instead, be honest about the fact that you overreacted; ask your child what better word you could have used instead.”

first off I take issue with the fact that one might only swear when frustrated or angry. I rarely swear in aggression.

secondly, the thought of getting down to a 3 year old’s level and saying ‘let’s think of ten beautiful words mummy could have used instead of fuck’ is ludicrous.

I’d rather teacher my child that words are words and all words can be beautiful I’m the right context.

thoughts?

You forgot my favourite: ”fuck me” both as an instruction and an exclamation.

My primary aged child hates hearing people swearing. I can see him react when we're next to a group (nearly always men) in a cafe or park who are swearing a lot. He's said things to me like "don't they know there's a child here" (hopefully not loud enough for them to hear!)

I’ve never used the f word, it’s a lazy throw away word and it’s offensive.
My kids never swore in the house when growing up and still don’t now.
It’s a reflection of society that most posters on here think it’s funny, which is in itself very childish, maybe time for the adults on here to grow up, heaven help the kids of today!

You’ve just quoted three of my favourite words. Thanks 😊

@MistressIggi but what happens if a child hears swearing like that? Literally, what happens? He hears a word.

I never swear in front of my children but to my great embarrassment my 8 year old has picked up a few from somewhere. He's autistic and doesn't completely understand it's not appropriate to say things like that. I find it mortifying, which I'm sure makes it worse than just ignoring it.

Ah ok, so it's more about her not getting told off by teachers etc?

So if it wasn't for society's attitudes, if your daughter was using swear words in every sentence, you'd be fine with it?

(This is not meant to sound judgemental at all by the way - just genuinely interested in your thinking).

I taught my ds swear words and what context to use/not use them in. I also left the sweet jar on the lowest shelf and he knew he could help himself whenever. The result was he barely touched sweets after the first two gorges and swears only in extremis.

He doesn't like it. Are you telling him he isn't allowed to know what he feels comfortable with? I assume his primary teachers don't swear and tell pupils not to - most times when he hears swear words they are said in an aggressive tone and I imagine that's what bothers him.
I don't accept the idea that "it's just a word" people can imbue any word with negativity and they certainly can cause hurt.

If you want to “see the evidence” it is there for you to view if you look for it so I don’t think you really do want to see the evidence.

All words can be beautiful? That’s the most twee nonsense I’ve ever heard. The n word? The f word? The r word? Beautiful?

Words have meaning. That’s why they exist. They have purpose and intent behind them. I’m sure you wouldn’t be fine with being called a paedophile because it’s “just a word”. You’d know fine well that word has meaning behind it. So no. Words aren’t just words.

I totally agree with this and it's why despite swearing often, I try extremely hard not to swear in front of my young children.

Or perhaps it's because 'if you can't be a good example, you'll have to be a terrible warning' . I love a swear word or ten. 😄

But what are words?

Words are not just sounds or letters. They are meaning.

Think about what words like 'fuck', and most swear words, actually mean, where they come from, and why we use them. Their actual meanings are very adult things, usually pretty lewd and/ or sexual in origin.

Children using these words is incongruous because their meanings come from an adult world and have adult meanings which they do not really understand or have been exposed to, unless there has been some kind of abuse or negligence.

The word 'fuck' to me, even used non-aggressively or humorously, has quite adult associations and not something that I think most kids really understand.

I think that's why most kids are encouraged not to use them and most adults will generally try not to use them too much around kids.

With 2 teens, ours us a sweary house although that is 90% me!

Meh I can't get worked up about it, raising kids is frustrating, a bit of swearing gets me through the day.

Though I am grateful to have learned the infamous FOTTFSOFAWYGTFOSM and ODFOD from mumsnet.

I swear in front of my kids. I wouldn't tolerate for them to swear.
It would be ridiculous to imagine they are not coming across any swear word out of the house.

I also drink the odd glass of wine in the house.
I drive (not at the same time).

There are many things I do that they know not to copy. It's not a difficult concept, most kids manage!

It always amuse me when people talk about their (older) kids are "they never swear". Unless you record every one of their conversation, it's a rather bold statement 😂

Fuck is a great word and can be powerful when used sparingly. But it loses all that power if you use it to excess, it becomes meaningless and reflects badly on the person using it excessively.

but what happens if a child hears swearing like that? Literally, what happens? He hears a word.

To me saying "fuck" in front of a child is the same as saying "suck my dick" or similar crass sex based expletives. Obviously nothing happens other than a child learning inappropriate language that they may then use in inappropriate settings. when they are too young to understand when it is not appropriate or deal with the consequences or judgement.

Sympathies @NDfamily - we've had similar here.

My autistic DS read the word "bumhole" at a friend's house once. She had one of those light boxes where you can rearrange letters and her older DC/DH had been messing about and leaving mildly rude words. All fine.

Echolalia was a real thing with my DS for years so the word bumhole was stuck in his head. We got home and got out of the car, and a neighbour opposite arrived at the same time. Instead of saying hello as he normally would, DS literally hooted "BUMHOLE!!" at the top of his voice. Repeatedly. I swear I nearly fucking died of embarrassment.

Another time he shouted 'Baldy" repeatedly at a very bald man in a shop. No malice intended, he was just delighted by the very shiny scalp on show.

Yet conversely, DS has scolded "gangsta" teenage boys he heard swearing in a shop. Told them off for using "inappropriate language". Mind you, now he's in his teens he's much happier to swear himself - this was a few years ago!

The joys of an autistic child 😅🤦🏻‍♀️ (and I say this as an autistic woman!)

I prefer not to swear and save my swear words for when I am really angry.. this is what I teach my children. As if you use swear words all the time they lose their impact in my opinion.

I also actually really like swear words when they're used in an intentionally humorous way.

@SpidersAreShitheads oh yes the echolalia!

Also, sorry but your stories are so funny - did the neighbour laugh?

Swearing is one of my very favourite things. Not being able to do it as fully, vociferously and imaginatively as I wish is, perhaps, the thing I resent the most about motherhood.

You already have my sleep, my figure and my money. Please at least leave me my profanities!

There's two sorts of people, the ones brought up to find it upsetting to hear, and the ones who don't give a damn.

I'm not militant, but it's like a vegetarian smelling bacon and steak everywhere they go- or perhaps worse the smell of a butcher's shop. As a child I couldn't tolerate the smell of the butchers or of kwiksave. The feeling they evoke is not unlike the feeling I get when people are sweary.

I'm not bothered by a judicious expletive in specific circumstances, but the casual fuckery of teens and young adults out and about littering fucks with no particular wit or necessity is gratingly disturbing.

I don't swear in front of kids and I don't like hearing swearing in general conversation.

Oh for fucks sake … or should I say ducks sake as auto correct likes to phase it.

You know what ..I swear. A lot.

In front of the children veh veh occasionally ( when I’m driving and people
are being dicks , when I’m really angry etc ) and I swear in front of and with my husband when the children aren’t around.

I’ve not got a mouth like a sewer , it isn’t constant , but I love the versatility of fuck and will use as and when needed or required.