Help! Can I really manage full time work and a happy family life with older kids?

[Labbingtons]

Circumstances have necessitated a return to full time work (term time only) for me. Kids will both be at secondary from September and there’s a chance to take on a project I don’t want to miss. I’m self employed, but the project is a risk so will take it on alongside my 3 day a week consultancy role. I’ll do client visits 3 mornings a week and will work at home or in my (nearby) office the rest of the time.

I’ve always worked but never full time since having children. They will both get to school independently on buses (home at 4.45.) DH has also recently taken on a big promotion and is super busy but very involved, great with helping with homework etc. DS has additional needs and will need lots of support with homework/ organisation. DD is pretty independent but loves a chat at the end of the day. Both have weekend and after school activities (Scouts etc.) to be taken to.

Please help with any tips and thoughts about keeping a happy family life with two full time working parents. And how to avoid feeling run into the ground with commitments. If you work full time, how do you find time for your own interests, your relationships and social life?

The new role means we at least have money to throw at the problem and I’ve already asked our cleaner to do an extra day a week to accommodate laundry, found a gardener/odd job person and arranged a 3-day a week dogwalker. Anything else to make life easier?

Was your father around then?
your children have 2 parents and you seem to have plenty of money to pay for the menial tasks to be done by someone else. You’ll be fine, your dc will be fine, your dh will be fine.

I think you’re massively overthinking this. You aren’t your mum and sounds like you’ve got everything planned well. I also work ft in a school (poorly paid admin job) so can’t afford any help with chores (my sisters cleaner charges £14 an hour and that is £3 an hour more than I’m paid.)
I do everything myself -cleaning, gardening, cooking, house paperwork, ironing etc but what I do is cut myself slack. If the house doesn’t get cleaned for a couple of weeks, that’s fine. As long as we’re all fed and happy that’s priority. I use the holidays to catch up. My house and garden have had a full clean/tidy up so all’s straight for September. I’ve already bought a few Christmas presents and wrapped them, the rest of Christmas will get done in October half term. My mother also worked ft when I was little and she didn’t cope well either, had a nervous breakdown and she passed away from cancer before my kids were born.
my DH is good at maintenance but works about 60 hours a week, he’s supportive and does his bit when he’s not working.

You will be fine OP. Prioritise what needs to be done and do other things when you’re able.

I'm surprised at the pile on, OP. I get that lots of people are in a similar position, or with less help but I think it's the uncertainty or change to family set up.
To every one who worked ft since their child was however old, didn't you feel a bit unsure how it would pan out when you first started..?
OP I'm in a similar position that I worked pt since my DC started school and gradually worked up to ft when DS was 10 or 11. I don't have the budget for outside help but I also don't have a dog that needs walking, or DC with SEN. I'm not the most organised person so probably not one to give advice, I still feel like I'm winging it most of the time! I do do Saturday housework but we also have a chore rota (feeding cats, putting out recycling, unloading dishwasher, tidy kitchen etc that everyone is meant to do) We have a family whatsapp to communicate who is home when, to remind DS to take keys if he's the last one out etc.
Other friends near me use gousto or hello fresh and there are near planning apps or websites.

I think (I hope this is not patronising) that being mindful and aware that you don't want to be in the same scenario as your mum is helpful, and that it's good to plan for and outsource where you can to mitigate feeling like that.

Often DD will want to come on an errand with me, mainly to have a chat in the car, or when she was a younger teen, we might walk to the petrol station in the evening (about a mile)to get last minute groceries chocolate and chat on the way there and back.

An equal number of posts have breezed past the happy part

I shall spell it out then.
My parents both worked FT until I was 12yo.
The seemed happy & would have said they were happy & we (the kids) were never unhappy about them working FT.

After that my dad started earning much more, so my mother whose income was main income most of preceding period, quit her conventional job. She still had a cleaner & threw a lot of her time into private business & volunteering. When (I will spell it out again) she & my dad still seemed happy & we kids never minded these choices. My mother ferried us places & took us to clubs and paid attention to our school work & social lives, etc.

They never had perfect marriage or perfect lives but as far as I can tell, short of scientifically validated tests, everyone was "happy" with these working life situations. They never seemed "coping but unhappy".

I can't speak for every other household in our social circle, but like I said, 2 working parents was in the 1970s and still is the norm, at every social strata in our region. I also can't attest to how totally FT their hours were, maybe some were much closer to PT. I grew up thinking 100% SAHP was a bizarre concept. Families around me seemed to constantly make 2 working parents happen successfully.
hth

My parents both worked from about when I was 12, but their jobs were sooooo much easier, my dad was a headteacher and used to come home at 4pm and lie down! My mum was also a teacher and doing endless prep in evenings, and marking, was just not the norm then. Full time jobs have become 'bigger' for want of a better word, we work the longest working hours in Europe, and most women work part-time, not full-time as a consequence, scuppering their pay and progression to try to square the circle. I work full-time in a demanding job, but I depend on my family if the kids are ill, drive everywhere (no nice strolls to school), have had a cleaner on and off, dust-bunnies if not, and their diet hasn't been the best over the years. I also feel frazzled a lot (as a lone parent).

I don't think working out how two people can both go full-time in a sensible happy way so no-one's wellbeing is massively compromised is unreasonable. I would say, though, OP keep flexible, if one of the kids suddenly has a crisis in the teen years, which mine did and has happened to several of their peers too, you may need to build slack in the system, one of my friends has just taken several months off to deal with a very difficult late-teen as she was burning out at work and crying all the time.

We are all human and modern life seems a little overdemanding to me, at times,.

A headteacher coming home at 4 pm and lying down?!! Unheard of. Having had one in the family, quite normal to work 15 hour days, weekends etc. it’s brutal.

Highdaysandholidays1 I agree that jobs have become so much more full-on now. DH and I have planned for him to have two early finishes a week to cook supper etc., by which he means by 6pm. As you say, with those expectations at work, is it shy surprise people opt for part time working, thus affecting their career prospects and pay.

I am surprised by people saying two full time working parents is the norm. It must be absolutely exhausting with no gel at home, and hats off to those doing this and finding work and family life enjoyable. I know very few families who do this, and I know I never could. The ones I know who do have full time nanny/housekeepers, or much older kids. Almost all families I know have either a SAHP or one part-time parent, either in a not well paid but convenient role (like school admin) or in their pre-child professional role, but part-time.

A friend IRL is about to take on a full-time secondary deputy headship and is having similar worries to me, so it is nice not to feel the only one, and we’ve promised to give each other a bit of moral support.

I would get meals delivered from Gousto, Hello Fresh or somewhere like that for week nights so you know what you’re cooking. Easy to follow, fairly quick recipes which I find makes life easier.
if you have a cleaner shouldn’t be too much need for housework so just don’t stress about what doesn’t get done & you’ll be fine

You’ll be fine OP. Sounds like a great set-up. I’m interested in what work you do that’s term time only & not teaching?

OP you will be fine, you have a great set up of lots of hired help and the opportunity to work from home regularly. It sounds idyllic to me!
we both work FT, no Family help , I commute 2 hours a day, am in a board level role and have no paid help. The COL and increase in mortgage payments have meant it’s just not possible. I feel that I am literally surviving.

I think one of the best things you can do is reframe it to see this as something that both your dh and you need to tackle not just you. As you've said you'll have a cleaner in and to do laundry, and a gardener. I'd meal prep, get groceries delivered or use a service like gousto so less planning involved in making meals after a long day at work. I'd have set days to help kids with homework and look in to tutoring if you find you can't spare the time although with the age of your kids this for me would be a priority.

In terms of extra curricular activities I would limit this to 1 or 2 each because I wouldn't want it to cut into actual family time. Kids may need you less in terms of doing chores for them as they get older but they still need lots of emotional support around friendships, being a teenager, exams etc. Make sure to tag team when it comes to pick ups and drop offs. I'd encourage the kids if you haven't already with set chores, so making sure all dirty clothes are in laundry baskets, setting the table or loading dishwasher. A shared calendar and lots of communication is necessary.

This HAS to be a troll. Nobody seriously thinks that having a term time only, wfh job, plus a gardener, cleaner, odd job person and a dog walker, plus a supportive partner, is remotely a difficult situation? Try being a single parent, working full time in a stressful tech management role, with no lackeys to run around after you, and then ask what else you could be doing to ‘make life easier’. You’re literally hardly lifting a finger love.

If your mum didn’t go back to work until you were 13 then she had the life of Riley too. You both sound spoiled and lazy. Pull up your big girl pants and do some hard work for a change.

What a dickish non-contribution.

Are you in a way asking for approval to work full time? Do you feel guilty that you seem to be putting your career and what you want ahead of their needs?

I'm not judging btw, just putting a different angle out there

Have you thought about school holidays, medical appointments etc? Days when they suddenly have coughs, colds upset tummies and can't go into school but still need a parent around

Do you have responsibilities for elderly relatives etc, or possibly will have in the future. That's what impacted my career, once my kids were old enough then my time had to be given to my parents.

There is no one answer, what works for one family won't for another. It is hard juggling home and work and all the physical, mental and emotional ties of both worlds.

Best of luck, my only real advice is to make the most of time with your children, as soon as they hit secondary the time just flies and they are adults before you know it.

High school aged kids need a parent around for coughs and colds?

Thank you. I do feel a little guilty, although the children seem unbothered. At the back of my mind I worry the extra two days is perhaps a bit of an unnecessary vanity project that might tip a great balance.

Luckily DH has flexibility to work from home when the children are unwell. Or I would be home with them, but working. Part of the reason I’ve stayed self employed is to have that flexibility. And I’ll always be here when they get in from school even if I have an hour or so of work to finish off. I am really enjoying the kids at the age they are so don’t want to waste a moment.

No parents with caring responsibilities but as I’m an only child (my sister sadly died) living two hours from parents I know that will come and this time might be a bit of a ‘sweet spot’.

My DS is 15 and he's never needed me around when he had a cough or cold since he's been at secondary school. He's perfectly capable. People really baby their kids sometimes.

Unless they're on deaths door step or seriously unwell, the vast majority of high school kids do not need a parent around for a minor illness. I used to LOVE a sick day as a kid in secondary school, no parents for the whole day with full access to the fridge and TV. Absolute bliss!

Another thing to add is I honestly think the best thing my parents did for me as a teenager was both working full time. It gave me valuable skills as having to organise myself to get ready for school and leave on time, responsibility for housework and at times a being responsible for making my own tea. I loved the independence of it all and I felt really proud of having a mum who worked full time and thought she was a great role model for me in combining work and family. On top of this she managed a volunteer role and social life. I honestly believe her being at home would have been far worse for me. She was already overprotective and if she had been at home, I can guarantee it would have felt almost suffocating. Working gave her her confidence back and a focus away from a family and gave us a kids more space to grow into adults with the independence we had. Win, win all round.

Your definition of full time is different to others. Your DH works over and above full time if an early finish is 6pm unless he's starting at 10am.

The majority of parents of school age children work full time or pretty damn close to it. You don't sound like you fully appreciate the hugely privelidged position your family is in.

Teenagers don't need someone at home when they get in. They will survive! As for sick days, why do they need an adult there? You're placing babyish expectations on family life. It would be interesting to know what other tasks you deem required that could probably be binned.

Thanks for your thoughts. You perhaps missed my mention of my son having SEN. He has learning difficulties. He will not be able to organise and do homework alone. My expectations aren’t ‘babyish’ ( he isn’t a baby) but he will need someone there when poorly, and when he gets home from school, possibly for years more than your own children did. That’s not me babying him, it’s about providing the time and care he needs.

What? Seriously? I’m a single mum with two sporty teenagers (out most nights to clubs). I work full time and do extra consultancy work on the weekend (5am to 9am when my teens are asleep). I don’t have a cleaner or gardener - would love them though 😂. We manage just fine, I’m sure with all the help you have you will be okay. We have time together evenings and weekends.

Quite a few people on this thread completely ignored the additional needs part. There's a lot of ignorance, speaking as a fellow SEN parent.

Apologies OP I did miss the learning difficulties. Is he in mainstream school? You will benefit him by creating the conditions for him to become more independent as he grows older. Part of this is you being less available.

I really think you're over thinking this whole thing massively. You are in a far better position than most. Be grateful for what you have.