Worried about my mother's neighbour and her obsession.

[missmartha]

My mother died recently , but 20 yers prior to this she met a younger woman from the town she lived in at her art class and despite a 20 year age gap they hit it off.

This woman was so friendly she had a key to my mother's house and to be honest, was a help in my mother's final days but obsessively so.

Mother was 98 when she was admitted to hospital and the friend was with her, she visited twice daily and when she wasn't visiting she spent all day at my mother's house.
I do not live locally so could not visit daily but mother had other friends and neighbours but this one did not stop to the extent that she put people off visiting and the hospital staff thought she was my mother's daughter. She was there constantly, even attending ward meetings about my mother's future.

I am unclear what she did at my mother's house. I did ask and was told that she did the washing, took in the mail and 'aired' the house.
I'm pretty sure she moved in if I'm honest.
She lost weight , she wouldn't' eat. She refused days out with friends , gave up her hobbies and delayed her holiday.
When my mother returned home she slept in the house. Mother's other friends were afraid to visit.

My mother died recently and although I have visited, I have rarely seen the friend as she keeps out of my way. I have no idea why, we have a telephone relationship, but a good one I think.
Anyway on seeing the friend I was frankly shocked. She had obviously lost several stones in weight , looked much older and was restless, pacing and shaky.
I believe her to still be living at my mother's house though she can't do that much longer and has a very nice house of her own anyway.

All this has worried me and I am concerned about this woman. What , if anything can I do to help her, I fear she may be ill.

You sure the house still belongs to your mother?

You sure your mother will of left it to you?

Is there a reason she can't stay at the house for a couple of months?

Apart from money and inheritance of course. But are those really good reasons to hurt your mother's closest friend of 20 years? If you need the money from the sale, could you offer to sell it to the lady?

If you are going to look at this from a financial perspective, perhaps you could take into account the tens of thousands of pounds that your mother's friend has saved her/ you in care fees over the years.

There are some well-meaning and kind posters on here but sorry, also quite naive.
You need to protect your interests here. It could be quite difficult to get this woman to leave the house.

Who does the house belong to now? Did you inherit it? Maybe if so you need to let the friend know of your plans and ask for the key back.

I think you need to sit down and have an honest conversation. I am presuming you are Executor and main beneficiary? Have you seen the Will? If so, I would be saying could she make arrangements to leave the property in a couple of weeks. And hand over the keys as you will need to arrange clearance and put the house on the market. I wouldn’t delay the conversation.

After my father died my mother did come out, in her way. She lived for over 20 years with her female partner who died just before Covid . Gay and Lesbian were not mentioned, but it was fairly clear that they were partners and obviously I had no problem with this.
To be honest, even when my father died and my mother's partner died , she didn't behave like this.
I will have to face the music one way or another but it does worry me.

This friend may be in her late 70s but she is very young for her age, plays tennis, follows sports teams about , dresses nicely etc.

I am not the executor of the will and he will not be as kind as I am I know that and that's a bit of a worry too.

Would you be able to take her out, somewhere neutral, say for a lunch. I would just be listening kindly to what she says, what comes up and noticing her body language. She might need someone to talk to, someone to give her time and listen to her.

You are both grieving

I would also try separately to meet with some of your mum’s other friends, over a coffee, again somewhere neutral, to onserve what they share with you.

I think then I would stay very temporarily for a number of days in my mother’s house to “establish my presence” (without discussing the timescale) - in order to set things on the correct footing, i.e. so the friend can check she has removed her own things, to choose some keepsakes that you may offer her, and finally for you to obtain her key (unless, as a result of your conversations you conclude there is nothing sinister and it would be of benefit to have a keyholder close to home)

I'm sorry for your loss and that this situation is adding to a difficult time for you.

Next time you're at the house, why not say to her "come on, I need a break. Let's go out for a coffee/lunch". Spend some time getting to know her better. What her own home is like. What relatives she has. Share memories. Ask How she's coping since your DM's death. Tell her you're worried for her and once the house is sold etc, concerned how she'll adjust.

Don't take on caring for her. Or become her crutch. Be caring but not a carer. Be a guiding friend going through grief in different ways. Gently let her know that things have changed and you'll need to make plans for the house.

That’s sad. She’s clearly grieving & your DM was lucky to have such a loyal friend/partner. Just be kind to her. As others say, perhaps see if she would like a couple of mementos. It would be interesting to see your DM’s will, as she may have left her something.

How do you feel towards this woman OP? Are you happy with her being in the house and the huge influence she has over your Mum's care? You are allowed an opinion here. If something about this feels 'off' then listen to yourself here, there is a reason you have posted this afterall. You are thick in the grief too, yes, but there are certain practicalities after death that need to be faced. I would definitely let your friend know you can see she is suffering following your Mum's death but maybe start to ask about the house and moving forward.

Who is the executor and why have they not told you whether or not you are a beneficiary?

I'm so sorry for your loss.

This sounds like such a tricky situation, and I agree with other posters that this lady may have been your mum's partner rather than just a friend. Whatever the nature of their relationship, she's clearly deeply grieving.

However, unless your mum left the house or any contents to her, then she is essentially squatting in your mum's property and that is a legally tricky situation.

I think the first step to take is to see your mum's will and make absolutely sure you know who she left everything to. Then, if you can face it, I would recommend taking her to a neutral place (a coffee shop is good) and gently acknowledging that she is clearly feeling dreadfully lost and heartbroken by your mum's death. And, in the same conversation, explain the terms of your mum's will. You can then tell her that you will be changing the locks on X date as you need to secure the property until it's time to sell.

It's desperately sad for this poor lady that she's lost someone who clearly meant so much to her. However, you have your own grief to process, as well as the mountain of hard work that comes with dealing with a death. Please don't feel you have to take on the burden of supporting her as well as looking after yourself.

That's a drip feed.

Was made out she was an obsessive neighbour now a full blown partner.

Changes everything. This was the person your mother chose to spend the rest of her life with. She's grieving and this was her home she shared with her.

I’m so sorry for your loss. What’s going on in the aftermath must be very emotionally challenging.

Sadly I think you have to take this situation firmly in hand and ask the dear lady to leave. Get the locks changed. She had a house to go to and that’s where she must go. It’s not as if you have the moral dilemma of her being homeless. Is she using utilities whilst there?

If she’s living and spending a lot of time at mum’s house beware of her becoming a “squatter.” That can open an entirely different can of legal worms.

Sensitivity is key but she has no right to be there at all.
Time for big girls’ knickers.

I don't think the neighbour / friend is the same person as the partner of 20 years once she was widowed, is she?

No my mother did not chose to share the rest of her life with this woman. After my father and then her partner of some years died in 2019, she was a woman who just continue to have a close friendship with my mother.

She is grieving, I can see that, but to be honest, people in my life , and I'm sure hers have died and we grieve, we all do, I am grieving now but I am not starving myself or shaking and it tugs at my heart strings when I leave my mother's house but I do leave it.

The executor is mother's solicitor, a no none sense bloke and the house was mothers but she wanted it sold and the proceeds distributed to her favourite charities

No one gains from mother's death. There are some bequests and that's it. I have a lovely photo od my grandmother , it's all I ever wanted from her , she knew that. That said, the friend will have to leave and as I said, she has a very nice house of her own and as far I can see there is no evidence that she has moved to mother's in in any real sense.

I have no doubt that mother left her friend something too. I didn't ask, I might do that later. Asking the woman out for a coffee results in a 'no, I'm not thirsty" ditto every other request to chat.

I have no idea what to do next or why she is so obsessed with my mother. Ma was 98.

I have no idea what to do next

I'd tell her that she has to hand back her keys as you are preparing the house for sale. That's what your mother wanted, for her house to be sold and the money given to charities.

If your mother had wanted her friend to live in the house she would have given it to her. She didn't want that.

Yes, and another concern would be to ascertain, maybe from a legal person, what rights etc she has acquired over your mother's house, which presumable, would be your inheritance.
It seems strange she's coming and going at will, after the funeral.

Was made out she was an obsessive neighbour now a full blown partner.

No, re-read the posts - the OP's mother had a partner who died in 2019.

This is difficult for you. I’m sorry about your mum.

If your mother left her things to charity I’m not sure either of you can take anything from the house unless left in the will. Someone else will be along who may know more than me.

I think OP can safely take an old photo of her grandmother without legal advice. No charity will mind that.

I wasn’t thinking of the photo but of a keepsake.

Years ago a friend was taken to court by her cousins, for taking an item of furniture that had belonged to her grandmother, but that my friend’s dad had bought for his mum. She’d been left out of the will. I can’t remember the outcome.

I think you need to get in touch with the Solicitor and advise of the position. Personally, I think it would sound better from you but you seem reluctant to have the conversation with mum’s friend.

I’m thinking less obsessed with her, more loved her. She seems to have been her whole world. Why is that difficult to comprehend? If you lose your whole world, then it is not difficult to understand her devastation. Were she your mother’s partner, could you accept her behaviour? People die from a broken heart.

You need to change the locks.

You can help the woman if you think she is genuine and didn't latch on to your mother to play the long game of hoping to inherit the house from her by giving her the number of bereavement counsellors.

The fact that she kept your mothers other friends at bay is disturbing.