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Do you think you subconsciously judge other mothers' with 2+ fathers to their children?

338 replies

mysavinggrace123 · 25/07/2023 21:43

Could potentially have three children by three different fathers. (Already have two by two)

This isn't particularly something I would shout from the roof tops.

There is a part of me that feels I would have a tarnished reputation.

I mean, do I judge women with 2+ (children) fathers myself...?? Hmmm... I can't say I do, but I have definitely been 'surprised' by a few women who I would have never expected.

What do you think?

OP posts:
Guiltyfeethavegotnorhythm0 · 27/07/2023 00:53

ConsuelaHammock · 27/07/2023 00:32

Yes and I wouldn’t have touched a man who had multiple children with multiple women.

Red flag in itself , why would any woman with any self worth go near a man like that . I really wish women would value themselves more , I really do .

justanothermanicmonday1 · 27/07/2023 00:57

One of my old friends had 2 DC to two dads. Then she met the third and they now have a baby. She's been engaged three times. At first I did, but then I sat and thought well these relationship have been years long and she was madly in love, had stable relationships and unfortunately it didn't work out. She's still with the third. He seems lovely. Great role model for the kids and he's a doting dad to their wee one.

So no, I don't judge anymore as we don't know peoples stories do we!

GreyCarpet · 27/07/2023 08:39

Hibiscrubbed · 26/07/2023 23:28

Can someone explain the need to have a child to ‘seal the deal’ with each man, as alluded to by the OP and some other posters.

I think the starting point of this is the understanding that women who make these decisions are not coming from the same starting point as women who don't. It's not a level playing field decision.

I'm going to try and say this as sensitively as I can because I don't actually want to upset anyone and I will caveat it by saying I grew up in abuse and had my first child within an abusive relationship so I don't think I'm pissing in the wind with this and I can see how it could have easily been me too. But it is also just my opinion and I'm not staring it as fact.

IME, many women who have three or more fathers to their children have grown up or lived within or been exposed to abuse or dysfunction. So, IMO, the decision is often rooted in trauma/a trauma response.

When people grow up in abuse or have lived with abuse, one of the fears (in my experience) is being seen by everyone as the person your abuser sees you as - weak, incapable, incompetent, worthless, undeserving, unseen and unheard, ugly, unlovable - whatever their focus was. You are mocked, 'invalidated' (God, hate that word!) and feel 'less than'.

Your drive is to correct that; to prove to yourself and everyone else that you are just as good as them. (Or, conversely, they become core beliefs and you accept that you are all of those things.)

Eg some people correct it by going to university (thats what i did. If i was going to be judged for being a 'young' single (not by choice) parent - and I was - I was going to be one with a degree); some correct it by focusing on their career and earning a high income to be completely self sufficient (and a lot of the high income/career threads show this and it's what my brother did); some correct it by focusing on building a small, close, supportive, loving family and ensuring their children never experience what they did (again, my brother and i did this). Those are all healthy responses (I think). And there are probably many more I haven't thought of.

Some decide not to have children because they're worried about their skillset as parents and the cycle repeating (I've read that on here too). I think that's sad but understandable.

Some people chase approval, love and affection. But are not sure what it looks like. They haven't healed from the past and so are destined to repeat their mistakes. Again, that is evident from relationship posts on MN in general.

Being single feels like you are those things your abuser said; having a child feels like he will step up and raise his game (and how many threads are there along those lines!); being a family feels like you can do something right.

Some women, as has already been said, feel that they are still judged and invalidated (for relationship failures) and so having a child within a relationship makes it more real. This is the relationship that is going to last. This is the decent man they were worthy of the whole time. This is the man who loves them. But they are unable to see certain red flags that would suggest to others he isn't the decent man they wish him to be. So those men don't make good partners, good dads or stick around. But they still hope that this is the relationship that will make them seem a real person, one who is worthy of love and a baby proves it. In their eyes. And sometimes they stay in those shitty relationships for fear of being judged for that too.

Some women, who've left abusive relationships, want the experience of 'normality'. The experience of pregnancy and birth and the early days and child rearing and family life with someone who is supportive and present. And they hope that this man will be the one to provide it. Sometimes this is the third man and so it goes no further. Some times it's never the right man and so the cycle continues. Some women crave it but decide not to have any more because they don't want 3+ children by 3+ fathers for a variety of reasons.

Some women crave the attention and validation of being 'mum' (because its lacking in other relationships in their lives) and so continue to have babies for that reason. The snuggliness of baby cuddles etc and crave that when the child starts to grow and so have more. When the previous partner hasn't stuck around, this is only going to happen with the next new relationship.

Some feel entitled/a desire to have that positive experience - why shouldn't they have that experience that we read about in magazines of a loving, supportive partner? And why shouldn't they? Some women (eg on this thread) feel unfairly judged and will explain - but I was in an abusive relationship etc. Some decide to not risk it happening again and decide no more children.

These are largely trauma based, emotional responses and not logical or 'intelligent' ones. Not to say they're 'thick' or 'stupid' but they are heart decisions and not head ones. They are not rooted in practical decisions such as financial stability, childhood experiences, child/parent relationships etc but in personal desire and want.

As I've said, I chose badly (although I didn't realise it at the time) twice. OK, my exh has been a reasonably good (not brilliant) dad to his children and he took his stepdad commitment to 'our' eldest seriously. For which I am thankful and respect him. But he was not a good dad when we were together and he wasn't a good partner to me. It would have been quite easy for me to become one of these multiple children by multiple men women. But I made different choices because I believed they were the right ones for me and my children.

So the need to 'seal the deal' is not one I made. But I do understand the basis of the drive to do so.

I understand the concerns for the children and agree. Like I said, I worked in CP and now work in education. I've seen lots of dysfunctional relationships of all dynamics professionally and I'm mindful of how they arise. I also see the impact on the children and it's not a posiitve one.

This post is already long enough and I've only really scratched the surface of how/why I think it happens but I think that if you don't understand it at all, be thankful for that.

GreyCarpet · 27/07/2023 08:51

Forgot to add a disclaimer - I know the above won't necessarily apply to all women in this position and I'm not intending to be offensive, condescending or minimise. I'm aware it's based on my personal experiences and those of families who are struggling.

But, for me, I still wouldn't have had 3 or more by 3 or more. Regardless of circumstances.

My partner now says that he would have loved to have raised a family with me. I know what he means and it would have been totally different to either of our previous experiences.

But, even if we'd met 10 years ago, I wouldn't have done it because I didn't want 3x3.

Yea2023 · 27/07/2023 10:44

Excellent post @greycarpet.

As someone who didn’t have a happy childhood there is so much truth in this.

My early trauma based responses meant I had relationships with unsuitable men, both of whom wanted to start a family with me.

incidentally, one now has 5/6 kids by loads of women plus about 8 step kids (I think) past and present.
Prob a grandfather by now but wouldn’t know it if he was.

I knew I didn’t want my DC feeling how I did, 2 by 2 would have been my limit but I had DC later anyway (part choice/part infertility from young age) in a 15+ year long relationship.

I was just lucky to be shown a different way to live that I found desirable it raised my expectation of partner.

I was just lucky in meeting my DH if we split there won’t be any more DC (I’m old & infertile, he’s having a vasectomy - doesn’t want our DC having half sibs either)

user1471556818 · 27/07/2023 11:08

Stichintime · 25/07/2023 21:50
For me 2 is the limit. 3 or more suggests someone keeps making the same mistake.
As above I judge both male and female the same

caringcarer · 27/07/2023 11:49

LobsterCrab · 25/07/2023 21:48

Yes I agree with pp. Two different dads would be fine but somehow (sorry) three or more wouldn't be.

Btw - not being sexist here. I'd also think the same about men who had children with different women.

I think the same. Three is just one too many.

TheBloatedMiddle · 27/07/2023 12:00

I don't think so. My main concern (as someone who used to work in Family Law) is how all the co-parenting works and if each father (assuming the children live with the mother as primary parent) has different parentings styles - expectations and how that impacts family dynamics.

I confess though that when I first started in family law all those years back I felt a bit judgy about a woman who had 8 children by 6 fathers. I thought she was off her rocker. Then of course I learned more about coercive relationships and so forth and as a fairly naive young person it was a huge eye opener to me. So i don't think I am judgy now. I hope not anyway.

TheBloatedMiddle · 27/07/2023 12:03

I am probably highly judgemental though of fathers who have multiple children with multiple women and don't pay proper maintenance; proper attention (or any) to their children or who use the children as pawns in their nasty little games.

But again- this is the side I used to see in my work. So that influences that perspective.

I'm glad to be out of that line of work now tbh.

ConsuelaHammock · 27/07/2023 14:05

Guiltyfeethavegotnorhythm0 · 27/07/2023 00:53

Red flag in itself , why would any woman with any self worth go near a man like that . I really wish women would value themselves more , I really do .

Some women just can’t be alone. I blame all the fairytale princess crappy stories they’re bombarded with when they’re little. ‘ You will meet your prince one day’
I remember taking my daughter to see Frozen. At 8/9 she leaned over to me in the cinema and whispered’ She only just met him!’ Hallelujah I thought. You get it!

One of my dearest friends was widowed with three children a few years ago. She has met a most unsuitable man but won’t walk away because she doesn’t want to be alone. I asked her what would she do if he hit her? She said as long as he hugged her afterwards she could cope. This is an educated ,clever, beautiful woman with a respectable job. I’ve given up trying to help as she will not listen. She considered a baby too just to keep him. I’ve given up trying to talk sense to her. She has fallen out with most of her friends and family because of a man she’s known for a year.

LittleFifteen · 27/07/2023 14:07

Yes, my ex friend is in this position, 3 kids by 3 different men, I just find it a bit distasteful really, and is seen as flighty and lacking in self respect.

HideTheCroissants · 27/07/2023 14:12

I’m afraid I do. I know I shouldn’t but I just do. It’s very different to my lifestyle where I’ve only ever had one sexual partner so, obviously, only one father to my children.
All my “judginess” is kept to myself (and anonymous Mumsnet).

LittleFifteen · 27/07/2023 14:22

I agree. I have a half sibling myself and always told myself that all my children would have the same father and a stable upbringing, something that I did not have

readbooksdrinktea · 27/07/2023 14:24

More than two, yes. It's the kids I feel for. It would seem chaotic to me.

uncomfortablydumb53 · 27/07/2023 14:58

Absolutely not.
Relationships end for any number of reasons
Even a one night stand that resulted in a child wouldn't raise my eyebrows
If the child is happy, loved and safe that's all that matters to me
None of anyone else's business

B72 · 27/07/2023 15:57

Yes, both mother and father.
I wouldn't go anywhere near a bloke who had kids with different women.

SchoolShenanigans · 27/07/2023 16:12

Honestly?

I would probably would judge someone having kids with a third father.

I'd wonder if you had a poor judge of character and whether you make poor decisions.

May be completely wrong, it could just be bad luck, but I'm just being honest.

FirstFallopians · 27/07/2023 16:23

2x2- no.

3x3 plus- absolutely.

Shit happens and relationships fail, that’s life.

But when someone causes instability for their existing kids by continuing to introduce parental-figures and new siblings with every new relationship, then yes I do judge. They are prioritising their own wants over their dc’s needs.

I desperately want a third child- when DH and I planned our family it was always with three children in mind.

We have two dc, and I’ve accepted it’s not in their interests for me to have any more children. I’ve found this a difficult decision to make, but it’s clear to me that for our family circumstances our existing dc need to be the priority over my desire for another baby.

So yes, I judge any parent who doesn’t stop to consider the potentially negative impacts of their life choices on the kids they already have.

Echio · 27/07/2023 16:23

ZeldaWillTellYourFortune · 27/07/2023 00:37

I've wondered this, too.

Can't even imagine the chaos and confusion of kids in these "families" with mutliple bio-sires and half-siblings and step-siblings etc etc. It's really sad and so unnecessary. Every bio-urge need not be gratified.

I'd disagree - there's no problem to having 'complicated' families just because outsiders can't keep track (it's very straightforward to those who actually need to know).

My sister has 4 kids by 3 (she remains with the dad of the youngest 2). It's all quite straightforward. One day a week the older two get collected from school by their dads and brought home for bed. Every other weekend (the same weekend), they go off to their dads after school on the Friday. Sis gets a nice break(!!), they have a lovely time catching up with grandparents and dads, back Sunday evening ready for school. If there's sport on or a party or whatever, it simply falls to the person looking after the kid during that time to sort out travel or whatever.

It isn't always chaos, sad, confused. It's a regular pattern that's been in place for years, no issues.

Sartre · 27/07/2023 16:38

No because I’m that person. Have 3 with ex, 2 with DH. I was very young when I had older 3 and the relationship didn’t work out. I didn’t think I’d meet anyone else until they grew up so meeting DH took me by surprise. All children are well rounded and bloody good kids and all have my surname (which I kept too).

I have a PhD if that helps so I’m not a numbskull who made ‘bad life choices’, my children are not a bad life choice.

Elsiebear90 · 27/07/2023 16:50

Yeah I do tbh, same for men who have kids by multiple women. I would assume they struggle to maintain long term relationships/take creating children with people lightly/choose unsuitable people to have kids with. I imagine life is chaotic with so many different sets of families and fathers in the mix and different partners coming and going.

People can live their lives anyway they want, but truthfully I do judge, I just keep it to myself.

Epicstorm · 27/07/2023 16:50

Unfortunately I would but I would try hard not.

As a reception teacher I once had a boy in my class who was on his fourth surname. I judge that more. Poor child.

Namechange72626262 · 27/07/2023 17:17

I think it depends (although its none of my business).

I had my first child when I was a teengaer, it didn't work out i am now married with another child and pregnant.

There is a 12 year age gap between my first and second as i wanted to make sure i was sensible (mortgage, job, married) when I had another child

So i will have 3 kids by 2 dads, however we have been together almost a decade and he has PR of my eldest.

OhmygodDont · 28/07/2023 15:43

I know a women four children three dads. Two divorces. Those children were all lock in children. The second dad was actually amazing. Took on the first completely as his own, even once they split visitation was all involving the oldest child too.

She cheated had babies with third man and split up. Bonkers. Torn apart the 2x2 to end up 4x3 and single.

zero lessons where learnt clearly. Dad 1 and 3 are shits who didn’t care at all or cared only the bare minimum while dad 2 gives the world.

Once you’ve hit two dads it’s time to stop thinking a baby will make the family work and be complete because it didn’t work out the first two times and children don’t need a revolving door is new mummies/daddies and a new sibling each time.

Oatycookies · 29/07/2023 07:29

“I confess though that when I first started in family law all those years back I felt a bit judgy about a woman who had 8 children by 6 fathers. I thought she was off her rocker. Then of course I learned more about coercive relationships and so forth and as a fairly naive young person it was a huge eye opener to me. So i don't think I am judgy now. I hope not anyway”

I don’t know if judge is the right word but I would certainly feel negatively about this kind of lifestyle and rightly so because she’s endangering the children not to mention creating an incredibly chaotic family with children who will all have different experiences of having a father. Eg. One has an involved father, the other an absent father, the other a violent drunk etc. it’s one thing to have one coercive relationship or even two but at some point you’re going to need to stop dating if you can’t pick correctly and to pick 6 crappy men like that for your family is awful. Especially if you have kids. Incredibly selfish and reckless, my heart goes out to the kids.

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