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Original poster

Ex requesting birth certificates

200 replies

gallina · 12/07/2023 19:05

My ex is leaving the country (UK) to move back to his home country (EU)

He is leaving this week although won't tell me a date. He is pressuring me for copies of the children's birth certificates.

Is there any reason why I should refrain from giving him a copy?

They are 2 and 1 years and don't have passports yet.

I'll give him a copy to keep the peace if there's nothing he could really do with it, but don't want to willingly hand it over if I'm opening myself up for him to try and take the children

Feeling pretty broken so appreciate any replies

OP posts:
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6
Unexpectedlysinglemum · 12/07/2023 19:45

I would also get apple air tags and sew into your kids rucksacks when they go out for the day with him so that if he does abduct them you can track their location

PaigeMatthews · 12/07/2023 19:49

Fuck no. He can get his own.

order the passports asap.

do not let him have them alone.

misslooloo · 12/07/2023 19:49

Chowtime · 12/07/2023 19:28

There aren't many ferries that go to Holland. Have a look at the Stena Line Harwich/Hook of Holland sailings timetable. I'd bet there's only 2 or 3 sailings a week. That'll tell you something.

There are daily sailings from North Shields to Amsterdam.

MrsCarson · 12/07/2023 19:50

ThePM · 12/07/2023 19:32

I’m not sure if this is still the case, but you cannot (used not be able to) be Dutch and have a second citizenship/Passport.

Show quote history

Yes my friends Dh is Dutch and never got his US citizenship because of this.

mrsneate · 12/07/2023 19:50

Try and get their passports yourself. However recently I did my youngest boys first passport and needed his fathers passport details and a few weeks later they asked him for a letter authorising the application 😲

Oceanus · 12/07/2023 19:58

I know several countries that "officially" don't allow for double nationalities but in reality officials don't really make a big deal out of it and don't really take people to court for it or do anything if it comes up.
Hypothetically speaking, given the Netherlands are an independent country that owes the UK zilch, I wonder how they would find out whether a Dutch citizen also has a passport from the UK, for example. The UK owes the Dutch nothing so it's also free to issue passports without anyone calling the Dutch. I can't see a civil servant anywhere making a call and going "hey, we're giving a guy with a name that sounds vaguely Dutch a British passport, are we allowed? is this guy Dutch? is this person one of yours?".
I mean, unless a person gets in trouble and foreign police departments talk to each other, how would a country know whether one of its own has a passport from somewhere else too?

Whatiswrongwithm · 12/07/2023 20:01

I would be telling your kids schools (if they’re old enough to attend) that their dad is not to be allowed to pick them up before the summer holidays as you are concerned about him kidnapping them.

QueensBees · 12/07/2023 20:05

Chowtime · 12/07/2023 19:30

Your kids having a different nationality to yours could potentially make it easier for him to apply to a court in his country for the kids to stay.

Oh yeah, never even thought of that. You don't want the kids to have a different nationality to you.

You can’t stop the kids having the two citizenships because they already have both.
What they don’t have is passports. But it’s not because you don’t have a passport that you are not a citizen
eg you are British even if you’ve never had a British passport.

I would assume the dcs are and will always be Dutch because their dad is Dutch. Regardless of the passport situation. It’s not something the OP has any control over. (And they will always be British too btw)

QueensBees · 12/07/2023 20:07

@Oceanus but that’s a decision for the child to take, not the parents.
So the child will have dual citizenship until they are 18yo, at which point they have to chose.

The OP’s dcs two citizenship until they are at least 18yo

easilydistracted1 · 12/07/2023 20:09

Without wanting to be too dramatic, is there anything stopping you having an impromptu break away with them? Tell him sorry you're not sure where they are and head off with the children. Apply for the passports and get legal advice. Not worth the risk

madeleine85 · 12/07/2023 20:10

mrsneate · 12/07/2023 19:50

Try and get their passports yourself. However recently I did my youngest boys first passport and needed his fathers passport details and a few weeks later they asked him for a letter authorising the application 😲

Just FYI as I am a UK citizen, and my DH is not. I did an application recently, and I did not have to get anything from their father, I think because he is foreign. I did have to list his name, DOB, his citizenship, place of birth etc. He did not have to sign anything (from memory) and definitely was not contacted by the passport office. Hopefully you have this experience too, as it really felt easy. I think I had to get someone to sign the photos/say the children were who the photos were of, send in birth cirtificates for myself and the children, and that was about it. Maybe call the passport office to see what the process is/just give it a go.

megletthesecond · 12/07/2023 20:12

unexpected I applied for my dc's first passports 8 years ago and they didn't need their dad's signatures even though he has parental responsibility and we were never married. I just had to confirm his name and DOB.

liveforsummer · 12/07/2023 20:12

Hopelessacademic · 12/07/2023 19:36

Get them British passports ASAP!
Then to get a Dutch one they'd need to send in the British one.
But if he applies for the Dutch one before they have a British one it's much easier. But I think they'd still need the other parent's consent if they're not present.

My kids have both Dutch and British passports, and when we applied for the Dutch one (before the British) my husband didn't attend the appointment, and I had to show a signed copy of his passport, a letter of consent, and our marriage certificate

Which one of you is Dutch though? My dc have 2 passports and I had to have a signed letter from their dad for their non Uk one as he was the one who entitled them to it. He would not need permission from me if he were to apply. Similarly I didn't not need anything from him for their UK passports. You just need one British parent to be eligible. I only put my details on the form. If you put absences persons details on the front then yes you have to provide their info (to those saying she needs dh's permission)

liveforsummer · 12/07/2023 20:14

mrsneate · 12/07/2023 19:50

Try and get their passports yourself. However recently I did my youngest boys first passport and needed his fathers passport details and a few weeks later they asked him for a letter authorising the application 😲

Simple thing to do here is not to add his details. You don't need a second parent's permission

CurlewKate · 12/07/2023 20:17

I know it's too late-but for the sake of other people who might be in the same position, if you're not super confident of your relationship, don't give your babies his name or put him on the birth certificate.

NowItsLikeSnowAtTheBeach · 12/07/2023 20:18

Bluebellsbells · 12/07/2023 19:22

They can only have one passport. Get this sorted asap so he doesn't get the chance to and always renue so he can't.

He can obtain birth certificates himself if he wants one.

They may have dual citizenship so they'd be entitled to more than one country's passport.

Oceanus · 12/07/2023 20:18

@QueensBees Agree 100%, you should have read all of my original comment. When the kids are older they can make their own decision, I agree, I'm not saying the mother should renounce their heritage, never ever did I say that.
My main point was the "passport", being a legal citizen is the first step to getting having documents issued and those are how one goes about settling in a different country. There's a difference between Dutch kids (with papers) living in the Netherlands and British kids visiting the Netherlands.
If he went to a Dutch court, as a Dutch national, stating the mother's nuts and presented evidence/witnesses, he'd always have the upperhand. She's not Dutch, she'd be a foreigner battling for the kids in a different court, in a different country.
Yes, there are Treaties, bla bla bla, but there will always be legal ways to stall things. By the time she won, the kids wouldn't even remember their mother or likely speak English.

honeylulu · 12/07/2023 20:19

You have to provide both parents details when applying for a UK passport for a child but only one parent needs to apply. My husband and I have each applied separately for our kids passports at different times and the non-applicant was not contacted about permission. Not sure if its different if divorced or never married though. I do remember having to put our wedding date on the form so that must be relevant somehow.

burntshortbread · 12/07/2023 20:19

Online passport applications are quick and easy, but you need proper passport quality photographs, signed by an appropriate person.
In your shoes I would pack up and go for a nice break with a friend or family member, turn off your phone and sort out your children's passports while you are there.
Is there somewhere you can go and stay that is a fairly long distance away.
Do you have documentation/proof of domestic violence? If so, contact the police and tell them there is a risk he will try to take the children.

Museya15 · 12/07/2023 20:21

First thing you do tomorrow is apply for their passports, if you don't and he does, you will have big problems if he becomes difficult and doesn't give you access to the passports.

liveforsummer · 12/07/2023 20:21

honeylulu · 12/07/2023 20:19

You have to provide both parents details when applying for a UK passport for a child but only one parent needs to apply. My husband and I have each applied separately for our kids passports at different times and the non-applicant was not contacted about permission. Not sure if its different if divorced or never married though. I do remember having to put our wedding date on the form so that must be relevant somehow.

Well i certainly didn't. He couldn't find his passport to get the details so I just left the other parent bit blank. Had no issues either time

FuckYouDailyMail · 12/07/2023 20:25

Unexpectedlysinglemum · 12/07/2023 19:45

I would also get apple air tags and sew into your kids rucksacks when they go out for the day with him so that if he does abduct them you can track their location

This won't work as AirTags have been changed to stop stalking and will notify your ex they are there.

Choux · 12/07/2023 20:27

Acknowledgement by a Dutch citizen
Did a Dutch citizen acknowledge the child after 1 March 2009? And did the acknowledging parent do this after the child’s birth and before the child turned 7 years old? In that case the child is automatically a Dutch citizen.
Source: ind.nl/en/dutch-citizenship/dutch-citizen-by-birth-acknowledgment-or-adoption

I would guess he wants the certificates to legally acknowledge the children as his so they become Dutch citizens.

Oceanus · 12/07/2023 20:31

You can’t stop the kids having the two citizenships because they already have both.
This is wrong. The kids have Dutch DNA and they are entitled to apply for Dutch citizenship because the father is Dutch. However, at this point, should the Dutch issue a list with the names of all their citizens, these kids would not be on it. The kids were born in the UK, so the Netherlands must be legally, and through the appropriate channels, informed that these kids exist and are Dutch, otherwise there's no way they know. The UK is under no obligation to send other countries a list with names of all the people born on British soil who have a foreign parent, as if! Unless the Netherlands have been legally informed and said "Amen", these kids are only British.

Unexpectedlysinglemum · 12/07/2023 20:33

@FuckYouDailyMail nice v user name!
Can you explain what you mean by anti stalking measures? What happens/how would he know?