MISSING TITAN SUB - THREAD 5

[tortoishelll]

Thread 5 - a continuation.

My heart aches for those poor men and their families. 💔😔

I found it on the app on my phone and tv.

The video @cakeorwine linked is fascinating. The delivery is a bit dull but well worth listening to. He makes some great points that seem obvious but hadn't occurred to me like

• the fact the occupants were just sitting on the floor unrestrained is very dangerous - eg. if it surfaced in rough seas, could be fatal or very unpleasant as bodies thrown around or even a rough landing on the sea bed
• the fact the pilot is just sitting on the floor unrestrained is very dangerous because disorentation of pilots is a very real risk so you need to be strapped into a seat that lets you orientate your self relative to the craft.
• there are lots of entanglement risks on the outside of the craft including things tied on with cable ties.
• if you are joining things together with composite and epoxy resin (!!) (when they were installing the window) that needs to be robust under pressure then it should be done in a sealed dust free controlled environment becuase introduction of elements could cause failure. They just did in an open warehouse.

The beginning bit is him explaining his credentials and then giving and example of how you can convincingly spout a lot of technical rubbish to fool people that cheaper is better when it isn't. From here on is where it gets more interesting - at least to my mind.

For people asking about the styrofoam cups - I posted this link with a graphic of different effect of different depths when I mentioned it above.

https://nautiluslive.org/resource/compressed-styrofoam-cups-teaching-graphic

On YouTube there is a very good clip straight after your video link sirquintus, similar in nature to the British guy, but more professional delivery, by an American chap. He focuses a bit more on the fact that probably after two, and a maximum of three dives Titan should have been retired due to fatigue.
I think it clearly shows that genius and madness are very often two sides of the same coin, I think Rush was an innovator, I think his use of materials was genius, but he was also verging on insanity, watching Rush on the clips was eye opening. And both his ingenuity and madness (and kamikaze approach to safety) caused the resulting tragedy.
I can fully understand the draw to deep sea exploration, as a former scuba diver I was always at my absolute zenith of happiness when diving, it's a magical and alien world, but it's also an incredibly dangerous and an inhospitable environment if things go wrong (and that's at just at several metres depths).

Pressure differences are amazing.

I remember when we were scuba diving and using lifting bags to lift some cannonballs stuff from the sea bed. The pressure from 10m to 0m halves so the volume doubles. You could just see the bag expanding.

Now think of all that going the other way down.

Watched a video where someone went into a pressure chamber with a blow-up doll (a male one, non-sexual AFAICS). Doll squished flat quite quickly, and yer actual man’s voice went very high and heliumy, and he could barely do simple sums without mistakes and giggling. Apparently the pressure forces a gas - nitrous oxide? - into the breathable atmosphere. It was quite amusing! As the pressure reduced, the doll reinflated, the air was still in there, it was just entirely squashed.

Wish I could link it but can’t find it now, it was on youtube and nothing to do with the Titan disaster.

Apparently the pressure forces a gas - nitrous oxide? - into the breathable atmosphere

You can get nitrogen narcosis - basically the pressure of nitrogen makes you feel drunk. Which is not good underwater - you hear stories in training of people giving their regulator to fish as the fish can't breathe.

Slightly off topic - but I am a fan of The Big Blue - an 80s film about free diving - which is an incredibly dangerous sport where you just descend to a depth and then surface. All on one breath.

Until last week the only thing I knew about underwater pressures was “the bends” and even that I barely understood. These Titan threads have been so educational!

The bends and effects of too much nitrogen are explained well in this podcast:

Actually it opens with a woman telling her story of the Bends. I was listening to it while out walking and was having to fight back tears.

Ooh, thanks, will have a listen!

I am watching 'Just Alex' s video now (as an aside, what's the correct grammar for that?😂
I like the way he's explaining it, no jargon.

'Just Alex's'

Following the loss of the Titan, this thread and my new found interest in all things underwater, I watched this film:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Underwater_(film)

about a group of workers on a drilling facility at the bottom of the ocean who encounter hostile creatures after an earthquake destroys the facility.

I kept watching it and thinking well that's wrong and 'the pressure would kill them'.

& thinking about one of the experts saying at the bottom of the ocean you don't get any slow leaks, the pressure means if there is a leak there is a catastrophic implosion.

There's a lot of dripping water in this film!

It's not good and I wouldn't recommend it. Kristen Stewart is particularly bad and has very, very strange styling - white blonde buzz cut - that isn't attractive or in keeping with the film or the character.

Anyone got any other suggestions for undersea films - I really mean people living in undersea facilities rather than snorkling!

In space rather than sea, but I bloody loved Gravity.

And there’s always Das Boot.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Films_with_underwater_settings

This one could be awful good:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sphere_(1998_film)

Dare I mention The Abyss?

The Netflix film The Last Breath is very good - and based on a true story

And Le Grand Bleu - The Big Blue (but not the US ending) is just a visual underwater treat

Le Grand Bleu

Free diving

I can only imagine the groans and sniping if yet another Titan thread was started, now it’s all over bar the law suits, but I’d really appreciate another one to continue my crash course in physics and the dangers/wonders of the world beneath the sea.

Would anyone else be interested in continuing the discussion?

Yes, I would. I’ve learnt so much.

I’ve finally watched the BBC interview with Christine Dawood and am sitting in tears. I can’t imagine the strength it must’ve taken to give that.

Too claustrophobic for me!

<shudders>

I couldn't watch it all.

Yes - I would.

I've enjoyed these threads and have learned a lot.

Also have recommendations for books and films which is great.

Please PM me the US ending (in case others don't want the spoiler)

new thread:

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/4837418-beyond-titan-physics-and-the-deep-sea

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/4837420-the-deep-sea-world-and-all-that-physics

Started one at the last minute!