Do children belong in a "fancy" restaurant?

[Puttingchildrenfirst]

Hello All!

I'm looking for people's thoughts on children in high end restaurants.

For context we were invited to a very high end restaurant this weekend (think £150 a head set tasting menu fine dining place) to celebrate a family members birthday (less than a weeks notice).

We have a toddler and a new baby so I declined as soon as I looked the restaurant up as I knew we couldn't organise childcare and husband was on call that night (needs to be near home).

Family wanted me to still come and bring the children but I declined as I really couldn't imagine wrangling a hungry toddler (no children's menu) and trying to latch a baby on while the couple on the next table celebrate their wedding anniversary!

I'll be honest I was also thinking of a popular thread on AIBU here recently where people were commenting on the behaviour of young children in a cafe at an aquarium. The consensus there was children shouldn't be in any sort of fancier restaurants!

However family think we're being overly precious to not bring the kids (and therefore not attend) and another thread yesterday had posters recommending a mum took her 8 month old to a 3 Michelin star restaurant.

If you were sat next to 2 kids under 3 at a very expensive restaurant... what would you be thinking?

Absolutely not, out of consideration for everyone else paying for a fine dining experience.

Exactly this. Even a cafe down at the beach wasn’t fun for me when DD was small.

OP, if you can manage the baby and the other family member will actually help, then it may be ok. But it depends on your family dynamic.

Also depends if they’re expecting you to eat at the toddlers bedtime too. For us, it would have been hellish doing that. Some people through I was being precious but some things just didn’t work for us.

I dunno. Why should the fact the place costs the earth be the main decider? Most people can't afford that price per head. So is it only the very wealthy who have to be considered too well off to have any children around? Why does it make a difference over a less expensive place which also might be somewhere people have saved up to go to for a special meal? You are as likely to ruin a special meal for someone in a place of less than half that price per head. So I don't see the money is the issue.

If the place allows children, they allow children. But it's up to you whether you feel your children will be a bit of a nightmare and bored and likely to kick off or not and how stressful that would be for you if they did. Like with most occasions, if you're prepared to take the child outside if being too noisy or having a tantrum or something, then I don't see too much of a problem. Large family groups can be a bit annoying and loud anyway with children being there. But only you know if you actually want to be in that situation or not. If you really think it's unworkable, perhaps you could drop in on the meal briefly and then leave again? Or just go for desert? So it's not too long for your children and they don't get bored?

It would entirely depend on how they behaved and whether DH and I (or other family members) could tag team to entertain them. DH and I did it successfully with one when DS was 4 but now I have two (5 and 1) there’s just no way I’d go to a high end restaurant as we wouldn’t get to eat, we’d just be marshalling a child each and probably dying of embarrassment. At the moment I refuse to go even to the local pub as I just don’t see the point in paying for food I’ll eat cold if at all because I’m trying to stop the children disrupting everyone else. No fun if it’s stressful. You made the right call in my experience, OP.

I might have taken a sling-age little baby but my DC was very chill and easy to settle. Toddler nope unless the restaurant was some degree of enthusiastic (e.g. "we don't have a children's menu but we could knock them up an omelette") so OP did the right thing to phone ahead. Some Michelin places are more family friendly than others though (Locanda Locatelli v welcoming, prob cos Italian...but also places that are more countryside-y maybe?) Also big difference between lunch time and dinner time. Tablets are fine muted or with headphones ffs.

👎 No

I have experience a family with a young child at wetherspoons chain restaurant,
the child had a electronic game 🎮 that she was allowed to play loud sound on

And the mess families with small children in tow is like remisant of feeding times at local zoos

Loud sound on electronic game 🎮 was on almost constant,
I could hear it other side of room,

As you state this is only a UK and Ireland thing. My children have been to high end restaurants since they were born. And you don't need a children's menu either for children. Though many of the top end French (as an example) restaurants we have been to have an upmarket menu specially designed for children. I remember one birthday in Ireland we had booked a lovely restaurant for the evening and they were shocked we arrived with 3 children. The stares we got. I wouldn't bring them if they didn't know how to behave. There is a reason French children eat properly in restaurants. It's called discipline.

I wouldn't go if not confident my children would behave. And children should not be excluded from family events just because they are children. As regards welcoming restaurants, I find the Italians and Greeks to be the most laid back. They also adore children. Thankfully they don't offer sausage and chips, or burger and chips as a children's option.

I couldn’t afford to take myself as with drinks even soft drinks the bill will be much higher. I don’t think they would be impressed by my tap water request! The restaurant can’t say no children as it would probably breach some equality rules.

if it is booked late then you have to factor in travel and bedtime. It will be a good couple of hours meal.

turn it back on them saying you think they are being selfish for making you feel guilty.

Absolutely.

And if they had nowhere else to put us but beside a group of children I would not stay.

I have done this.

With girlfriends we went to a lovely hotel for lunch and when they tried to sit us near that noise I told them very clearly that we were having a break from our own children and were not interested in listening to the noise of others.
They understood.
We went else where.

As you state this is only a UK and Ireland thing

Except that it isn't as other posters, including those living abroad, have discussed restaurants in other countries where children aren't welcome.

And children should not be excluded from family events just because they are children.

So have the 'family event' at home, or in a family friendly restaurant. Not everyone is obliged to welcome the presence of your children.

And as I said above, everyone thinks their own children are impeccably behaved, but outsiders may not see it that way. And in any case, the presence of even the 'best' behaved children changes the atmosphere of a place. There are plenty of restaurants whose selling point is being family friendly, so why insist on taking them to one which is not?

I definitely wouldn't be going. Your family clearly haven't considered the children when booking the restaurant. What the restaurant said about kids not technically being banned was hardly inviting and I would take that as a No! Ring again and ask is it ok if you bring some coloring books, tablets etc🤣? Or enquire about this play area they have advertised??!

'As regards welcoming restaurants, I find the Italians and Greeks to be the most laid back. They also adore children.'

There is so much of this Brits hate kids, everybody else lives them. It's rubbish. As pp have pointed out, in societies where children go everywhere, mothers especially are loudly judged if their children aren't well behaved and people think nothing of reprimanding children which would go down like a lump of lead here.

Southern European societies love making a fuss of SMALL children and babies in social settings. After about the age of 4 or 5 they're pretty much left to their own devices to run around, make lots of noise and be either ignored or told off.

The whole world would say yes! Child hating UK ONLY would say no!

I wonder if Bunbuns3 has read the comments from posters who have actually eaten in various countries, almost all of whom disagree with this remark?

Of course Bunbuns3 maybe has eaten in very expensive (£150 per head is surely considered expensive) restaurants all over the world, in the evening, with very young children, but somehow I doubt it.

So self entitled, I'm sure no one appreciated you bringing your children and you chose to ignore the glares. I'm not in the UK by the way. Also, don't make out this is about yoir children, this is about you not wanting to miss out on things despite your choice to have children. If you can afford a high end restaurant, then don't cheap out on a babysitter. Maybe have a think about why you are like this.

No, I love children they don’t bother me at all being in pubs and family style restaurants but if I’ve paid to go to a high end expensive restaurant I don’t want children around no matter how quiet the parents can make them. It’s unfair to other diners, you know what your expecting from Bella Italia or Harvester and expect kids to be loud and getting up and down.

You haven't been many places have you? I'm not in the UK and its a definite NO to children in high end restaurants, obesity also travelled fairly extensively (60+ countries) around the world, and it's a no to all as far as any high end places are concerned. SMH!!

Yes, all this children are so welcome 'on the continent' thing is such nonsense.

Are they welcome in casual restaurants during the day? Sure. But they mostly are in Britain too. However, I doubt you'd get too warm a reception if you turned up with your 8 month old and toddler at a Michelen starred restaurant in Paris or Milan.

In the UK, Ireland, US and France tap water is free. There is no reason not to order it unless you prefer to pay for bottled. I had tap water in a restaurant in a 5 star hotel in London last month. It was served beautifully in a meal jug. In America and Ireland they normally put the tap water on the table immediately.

As we were visiting Ireland, and it was a significant birthday I had no intention of my children missing out. I had not anticipated the staring as it's not what we are used to. I wouldn't have brought the children to any restaurant if they were likely to misbehave. I don't make a distinction for high end ones. Children should, in general, eat with their parents so they learn to socialise properly and appropriately. This is about being a family, not about paying for a babysitter.

Depends on the children. My eldest two were the only little ones in the family for a while and we often took them to restaurants when they were little. They would sit nicely, eat properly with knife and fork and not mess about or whine. However I only took them because the family we went with would take charge of a child (grandparents who only saw them Once every couple months) and I could relax. So it also depends on what help you would have.

If it's later in the evening when they might be getting tired its different to going at 5/6pm when they might be eating.

Ultimately you know your children and how much support you'd get from family/friends.

Honestly, better not to go with the kids. I started a thread about this a few weeks ago when my fancy lunch was disrupted by a young child singing loudly and tunelessly over and over. You will enjoy yourself more following your initial feeling of what you want to do.

This is one of the most entitled and pretentious twaddle I have ever read on here.

I really hope your highly disciplined, impeccably behaved, frog leg eating, sophisticated palated, widely travelled, connoisseur kids enjoyed their fine dining in Ireland.

I still wouldn't want to go and spend a fortune on a meal and be sitting next to you. It is not the experience I am paying for. I would never bring my own kids and they are very much like your own on the behaviour scale but their culinary palate might be a little behind, they love a good burger and chips.

Why would you say ODFOD!? Do you not think children should behave in restaurants?