Pretty sure Paris Hilton wasn't pregnant ?

[bathtublove]

Another celeb surrogacy I'm presuming !

I agree. So why is the NHS paying for IVF for couples who want it, as it is not a need?

The problem is that no child should be created in order to be taken away from the mother. Also I believe that it is fundamentally immoral to ask another woman to do this, no matter what you pay, even if the woman is willing.

There must be hundreds of thousands of kids in the US foster care system who have been abused and or neglected by their birth parents who have a plan for adoption.

Such a shame these rich people create babies to buy them instead. Surrogacy is abhorrent. Being a parent is not a right.

Good lord the misogyny on this thread

Have you even bothered to read the full thread? The issue with surrogacy is that the baby gets taken from their mother at birth. Hugely traumatic for the baby who has grown in that woman's womb, got used to the sound of her voice and will immediately be attracted to her smell. It's a very strong, visceral bond. That's not the same situation when using donor eggs.

What? How does that equate to an argument? Plenty of things that aren't a life or death need get funded by the NHS. What a weird logic.

@Liorae it's a good question and one the NHS cannot agree on. It's a real postcode lottery as to whether the NHS will fund IVF for a couple. There are often many rules around life style, BMI, any previous pregnancies etc.

I do feel it's ok for the NHS to fund fertility preservation in the form of sperm / egg storage for young cancer patients.

But what about the child? That’s going to be one mixed up kid knowing her birth mother literally sold her.

Yay more human trafficking 🙄

A lot of celebrities seem pro surrogacy.
Not seen any offering to be the surrogate mother yet.... (obvs not relevant for same sex male couples)
Wonder why not considering great, empowering and lucrative it must be...? I wonder why khloe Kardashian didn't ask one of her millionnaire childbearing age sisters to be a surrogate for her?

I had horrendous pregnancies, including multiple hospital admissions, poor aftercare (C scar bursting open after 4 months, despite me flagging up.pain in the area for weeks beforehand), dreadful issues with episiotomy scarring after a VB.

No way would I expect another woman to risk all that for me, even if I was paying a fortune.

Its a real mystery. 🙃

In France surrogacy is illegal. How's that for a better answer than either the USA or the UK?

Because they don't want the inconvenience of pregnancy, and see other women as commodities to be bought and sold?

My birth mother did it twice. First when she got pregnant at 16 with my brother, then again at 18 with me. Both of us adopted out at birth. No SS involvement as far as the court records are concerned. She just didn't want to keep the babies. Her family didn't even know she was pregnant with me, apparently.

There is no medical need to commodify another woman’s body, ever.

👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

Sorry but that’s rubbish. A woman’s urge to want a baby and have a family can be very strong. I was unable to get pregnant despite years of trying so had to have ivf to get pregnant because my body wasn’t working properly. So it was a medical need. Experiencing infertility for years and years while all my friends were starting their own families was a very painful experience and really impacted on my mental health. People don’t normally decide to bring a baby into the world on a whim…

It's still not a medical need though? It might be a biological need. It might be a medical want. But it isn't a medical need. Surely you can see that?

Can I make it clear that if a woman has infertility I have so much sympathy, it took me almost 7 years to have my second baby, clomid, ivf, a miscarriage and then I somehow got pregnancy naturally after all that - and she is my absolute world. So I do get the urge to have a baby, it really messed with my mental health, it was all I could think about, it consumed me, it almost ruined friendships !!

My point is that it seemed almost normal now for celebrities to just pay a woman to carry a child for her. Yes we might not know the reasons but it just seems to be happening so much more often... maybe I was wrong for jumping to conclusions. But I stand by what I said because it can seem like for some it's the easier option.

So much judgemental ignorance spouted on this thread. Pretty confident none of you know the ins and outs of the women you are talking about, and certainly not about all the thousands of women who are surrogates or go the surrogacy route around the world, every year. The viciousness here is nasty. And for those talking about babies torn from their mummies: I wonder how many of you used daycares or nurseries or childcare or grandparents. Or does it only matter when the baby is a newborn?

Not sure where to start with that utterly ridiculous comparison. It’s not even slightly the same.

And we all know one thing - how many rich privileged celebrities USE surrogates compared to how many rich privileged celebrities ARE surrogates.

That tells us everything we need to know about this abhorrent practice. How anyone defends it is beyond me, it’s evil.

Are you in favour of rich people being able to buy organs for poorer people who need the money, or just babies? Interested to know where the line is for you?

That is a ludicrous comparison.

The commodification and exploitation of women’s bodies and socio economic status because that’s the only way some women might have a baby does not make it morally right.

Nobody has a right to have a baby.

@Imicola @Hoppinggreen @BlueBooh

All 3 of you have tagged/quoted me and jumped on only two words in my post and made assumptions without properly reading what I actually said.

NOWHERE have I said whether or not I agree with surrogacy.

It was the OP who brought up "medical need" not I.

The point I was making is that the reason Paris Hilton chose surrogacy (or may not have because we don't actually know!) is absolutely none of anyone else's business.

And yes @Motelschmotel it does matter more when it’s a newborn, that’s literally what the first weeks are for - building a lasting attachment that enables a baby to later be separated for short temporary periods of time without suffering emotional damage. Like going to nursery or school. The removal of a newborn from its gestational carrier mother is a permanent thing and wildly different to a securely attached older baby or child going briefly to childcare settings and then home again.

Honestly I didn’t fully get this until I had my babies and was blown away by their ability to get comfort from proximity to me in a way they just couldn’t with anyone else, however much that person loved them. That’s not because they were born from my eggs, it’s because my body, my smell, my sounds was all they knew. They grew in me, I was their everything and their home. It breaks my heart into a million pieces thinking of the trauma they would have experienced if they couldn’t just be handed back to me like they were anytime they got distressed from being away from me 😢

I have every sympathy for people struggling with infertility but that doesn’t justify this abhorrent act. It’s not ok to make other people suffer as long as you get what you want.

In years to come when the true long term impacts of this are known and understood, history will judge us for this practice 😢