DD1 has just moved back into the family home and is causing chaos

[drivinmecrazy]

DD1 (21) graduated in June. she had a job in her university town which means she has only recently returned home.
She came home about three weeks ago. I left a few days later for six weeks and am now in Spain.
That left DD1, DD2 (17) and DH.
DD1 then came out to stay with me for ten days as a way to reconnect after three years away.
She's incredibly independent, opinionated and selfish. TBH I was, sadly, relieved when she went back home.
Since then I've had DD2 constantly messaging me about her, often in tears about what her sister has said to her.
DH, for all his tough talk when DD1 not there, just gets sucked into her side every bloody time.
It's got to the point that I cannot have a private conversation with him without DD1 being present.
This evening o have resorted to asking DD2 to write him a note to put on his pillow asking him to phone me from work tomorrow to discuss things.
I just don't know what to do and am dreading going home in a few weeks if it's still a war zone at home.
Honestly DD1 manipulates him so much that he can't see that DD2 is really struggling.
We all had a talk a few weeks ago about how it will be a big adjustment for us all living together again, and acknowledged that it would be tough on all of us especially DD1, who really doesn't want to be living back at home in an ideal world.
I'm feeling a mixture of frustration at all of them not being able to communicate and relief I'm not there!

@HardLanding why are you being so rude to people? For somebody so keen on boundaries, apply some to yourself!

I was rude to the PP who was “genuinely interested” in how a non working adult lived alone. Ask a goady question, get a goady answer. As if they’d never heard of benefits/disability benefits. And if you’re just here to pick me at, then piss off.

It wasn’t a goady question. Landlords won’t rent to people on benefits. Specialist housing is very hard to source. I know this.

My PD sibling lived in supported living for a few years and then was moved to council flat.

Everyone on benefits is finding private rentals hard now. I work full time and get UC as a lone parent, all 99% of landlords see is the UC part, not the 35K salary part or that most of my UC claim is the Severely Disabled Child Element, or the high earning Guarantor or great references, so no, I can’t imagine anyone getting anywhere between £250-£750 a month depending on shah they have been awarded will get anywhere.

You wrote ‘don’t be thick.’ Don’t you consider that rude? Please don’t swear at me.

If swearing bothers you I suggest you leave the internet.

On a practical level OP your DH should change his notifications - if the actual messages are popping on on his phone then he just needs to deselect banners and show previews for his WhatsApp/iMessage notifications. There is no reason someone glancing at his phone should see the content of the message. This at least is an easy fix

I think some of the pps have come down on you very hard. It's an adjustment for everyone in the family when an adult child moves back home - I should know; I've two of mine back home after several years away. They would prefer to be living independently but for various reasons this is the way it has to be for now. Add to the mix a 19 year old who's at uni but hasn't lived away as yet. It's challenging!! I love them all dearly and part of me is happy to have all my chicks back in the nest but there are arguments (with me, mainly over housework!!) and they do wind each other up. It's a madhouse sometimes!

They are all strong-willed so it's inevitable that they will clash at times, but they are also incredibly close to each other.

Your DH needs to step up here (I know, I've a useless prick here too) - you must be so torn, knowing that your mum needs you and that your DD2 needs you! For those saying you should go home - don't you have a heart?!!! I lost my mum 16 years ago and I miss her every single day, but at least I have no regrets because when she was terminally ill I did all I could for her while balancing working fulltime with rearing 3 young children under the age of 9.

Maybe your DD2 should fly out to you for a weekend, just for a break from things? Might do more good than harm? And, is there any way you could bring your mum home with you?

Your eldest's behaviour isn't acceptable and she needs to know that in no uncertain terms. She probably didn't want to have to move home either. She needs to find a job, any job, to occupy her and get her out of the house. I wouldn't be skirting around her re phone calls though. I'd openly say, "I need to speak to you when X isn't around" - what harm if she does see/hear that?

How did she get on with her flatmates at uni? Did she behave in this way with them? I somehow doubt it. Explain to her that, now she's an adult, she's now living in a houseshare arrangement at home, and needs to behave accordingly. Be firm with her. I've said that to mine, but it is an uphill struggle sometimes, and you have to stick to your guns.

Hope your mum's health improves and that you can get this sorted out so that everyone can be happy. Whatever about your eldest's behaviour - and you know it can't go on - it's hard to read/hear some of the horrible comments that have been made about her. She's still your baby, at the end of the day! Take care x

Given the level of goady, nasty posts about people on benefits on here, it wasn’t too much of a leap to think @SilverLiningPlaybook was being goady. I apologise as that wasn’t the case, and sympathise with a lack of specialist housing.

Where my sibling lived for 3 years and had DBT, staff in the building 24/7, was taught other life skills doesn’t exist any more, other stuff.

I fought hard alongside others to keep it open because without it, my sibling would still be a chaotic PD mess, wrecking peoples lives and an addict and all that comes with addiction.

It’s the 21st century DH can take his phone off showing messages on the locked screen. I’d read him the riot act. If you are sacrificing DD2 because you are in Spain supporting a parent who pissed off to enjoy their retirement abroad then you seriously have your priorities wrong. I’ve been there torn apart and it’s no fun.

I swear like a trooper…just not generally at people I don’t know, nor in public.

I am allowed to ask you not to swear at me. It’s called applying a boundary.

And calling someone ‘thick’ is rude. I thought you were anti people being nasty to each other. Isn’t that where your anger in this thread comes from?

I’m anti parents sticking their heads in the sand about their child whilst their other children suffer.

You choose not to swear, I choose to swear. Grow up.

And support for the rent via benefits is also limited to a single room rate (shared housing) for under 35s although there are some exemptions.

You sound very angry. You probably have good reasons to be angry, but please don’t take it out on strangers on an Internet forum.

Swear all you like, just not at me, please.

I’m not angry. I’m concerned about OPs youngest DD. OP will be surrounded by people that have been manipulated by DD1, and so will reinforce the dysfunction and further damage/alienate DD2.

For the vast majority, the penny doesn’t drop until they’re told in very plain, harsh terms by an outsider that clearly sees the dysfunction.

I have a lifetime of experience with this.

How does your middle son live alone if he doesn’t work? Asking out of genuine interest.

@SilverLiningPlaybook I imagine the same way most of us with disabilities who can't work do- PIP, other benefits for those unable to work etc.

@drivinmecrazy Others have mentioned DBT for BPD for your DD1. I didn't find DBT helpful for Borderline traits, but I found EMDR helpful. It processes trauma and BPD is usually a result of trauma of some kind (this can be anything, such as having been bullied etc.) But of course only she can choose to seek therapy really. I suppose some people might make it a condition of living with them (if the family could afford therapy for the person.)

But honestly I'd just set her up in her own room somewhere.

Both DDs need to get their acts together. DD1 sounds like a selfish nightmare who enjoys trying to upset others. DD2 needs to toughen up a bit, she's nearly 18, why is she so upset to have not been included in a conversation between you and your husband about dogs?!
I am the older sibling if I'd said to DB we would have to get rid of the cat because I was allergic (I also moved home after uni), he would've laughed and said we'll re-home you before we re-home the cat.
Your husband needs to change the settings on his phone and if your daughter interferes with his messages he needs to tell her to stop. You both need to tell both daughters that household decisions are yours (you and DH) and if they don't like it they needn't be there, especially the older one.
FFS OP come on.

Much to ponder and many hard truths told on this thread.

Regarding those that have posted possible diagnoses, she has indeed been far down the path of assessment.

She's had lots of psychodynamic therapy which
In hindsight was possibly more damaging for her than beneficial. She started a course just as I began mine.

I'd had a stroke which triggered an awful lot a familial disruption.
With both of us simultaneously going through the process, it was extremely difficult to process. I think our 'bond' was maybe weakened during that time.
She's since been assessed again and she has been diagnosed with complex ptsd. All the counsellors we've approached have suggested NHS so she's on a very long waiting list, possibly 18 months.
The issue is the here and now.
How to manage family dynamics without being detrimental to anyone.
It's like grabbing onto the tinniest thread to stop your self falling from the highest cliff and hoping that that one singular thread stops you from falling.
This thread has helped in as much as putting 'pen to paper' can do. To articulate and lay it all out and to hear the views from others has been helpful.

SevenEleven why are you taking up space on a thread trying to support OP? Stop harping and picking at Hard Landing, you're coming across as tone deaf. And just a little bit up yourself.

@SilverLiningPlaybook I always got a friend to say I worked for them and give me a reference, otherwise it is harder to get somewhere (but there are some, usually fairly basic, places that'll accept people on benefits.)

I got a council flat in the end which is such a blessing.

Who diagnosed CPTSD? A counsellor? If so, not even close to qualified to do so and are totally unregulated.

CPTSD is diagnosed and treated via NHS Psychs. They will not accept a diagnosis from anyone other than a Psych, and even with a private Psych Dx, they will still do their own assessment.

As it stands, they’re so stretches that you’ll be lucky to even get her in the list I’m afraid.

Thank you.

I won’t be hassled by someone who’s just told her 36 year old child no for the first time.

I work full time and get UC as a lone parent, all 99% of landlords see is the UC part

@HardLanding You don't have to disclose that you get UC and they'd have no way of knowing.

Interesting that you take an adult applying boundaries as being ‘up herself’. The pp was rude and swore at me. I asked her stop. That’s an ok thing to do. It’s hard though OP, but good luck.