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Ukraine Invasion: Part 25
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MagicFox · 12/05/2022 08:18

Hi all, another thread for supporting and sharing

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katem98 · 12/05/2022 08:20

Thanks for new thread @MagicFox Smile

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baroqueandblue · 12/05/2022 08:21

Thanks @MagicFox and everyone who makes these threads such a great resource.

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Natsku · 12/05/2022 08:26

Thanks for the new thread. Breathing a sigh of relief now https://yle.fi/news/3-12442140 even though it does bring worry too, but more relief than worry.

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MagicFox · 12/05/2022 08:30

Feels epic @Natsku

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SerendipityJane · 12/05/2022 08:41

.

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WorriedMumofTeen16 · 12/05/2022 08:43

I've just answered another poster.on the previous thread about how wire would stop a train. I've just had chance to check and Russia does indeed use track circuits, in fact they've invested quite heavily in digitising the railways so the method I described would certainly cause chaos as signals wouldn't clear, and would explain the notes left also, as the track walking teams sent to investigate would find these and know it was sabotage

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Thunderpunt · 12/05/2022 08:45

WorriedMumofTeen16

I've just answered another poster.on the previous thread about how wire would stop a train. I've just had chance to check and Russia does indeed use track circuits, in fact they've invested quite heavily in digitising the railways so the method I described would certainly cause chaos as signals wouldn't clear, and would explain the notes left also, as the track walking teams sent to investigate would find these and know it was sabotage

Brilliantly explained, thank you

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saltedcaramelchocolate · 12/05/2022 08:46

.

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WorriedMumofTeen16 · 12/05/2022 08:58

Thunderpunt

WorriedMumofTeen16

I've just answered another poster.on the previous thread about how wire would stop a train. I've just had chance to check and Russia does indeed use track circuits, in fact they've invested quite heavily in digitising the railways so the method I described would certainly cause chaos as signals wouldn't clear, and would explain the notes left also, as the track walking teams sent to investigate would find these and know it was sabotage

Brilliantly explained, thank you

Thanks, was trying to explain in without all the technical terms so it was easily understood! Have just started drawing it out if anyone is unsure

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ShinyHat22 · 12/05/2022 08:59

Fair play to Finland

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Igotjelly · 12/05/2022 09:03

Morning all. It occurred to me this morning that this might still be occupying my every waking thought for months and years to come. Anyone else a bit concerned about reaching total mental health burnout? Sorry a bit off topic.

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katem98 · 12/05/2022 09:05

@Igotjelly Yes, considered. I've had to have MH tablets put on a repeat prescription already. I don't have a great history of MH but this was just the icing on the cake.

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Natsku · 12/05/2022 09:06

Igotjelly

Morning all. It occurred to me this morning that this might still be occupying my every waking thought for months and years to come. Anyone else a bit concerned about reaching total mental health burnout? Sorry a bit off topic.

Nah, I'm pretty good at compartmentalising so I try to switch off thoughts about the war when I'm doing anything else. Helps my anxiety a lot since I started doing that.

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ScrollingLeaves · 12/05/2022 09:13

Thank you, MagicFox

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Igotjelly · 12/05/2022 09:17

Thanks @katem98 and @Natsku - I'm terrible at compartmentalisation and, without giving too much personal info away, the work I do means that I can't escape it. I have a terrible history of mental health episodes too. Feel OK at the moment. Guess its anxiety about being anxious.....

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TargusEasting · 12/05/2022 09:19

I heard on Radio 4 this morning the first War Crimes trial is opening today. I believe it follows the capture of the soldiers who killed the civilians at the bicycle superstore on the edge of Kiyv. The CNN report is here. The accompanying video is uncensored, just a warning should you watch it.

Shooting of Kiyv civilians

I hope now for a short war and an unlimited era during which soldiers committing war crimes are brought to trial. Europe has a healthy population of human rights lawyers, so that should not be a problem.

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TheABC · 12/05/2022 09:21

It will be a very different type of war if it goes on for years. More like Afghanistan or Iraq. I will be surprised if Russia keeps it up that long - a lot of their BTGs are reported as "degraded" and the Ukrainians are getting more and newer weaponry.

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ScrollingLeaves · 12/05/2022 09:24

@WorriedMumofTeen16 · 12/05/2022 08:20
TargusEasting
People use a wire to stop a train in Russia.

That is interesting. I wonder how that works if the train is hurtling at high speed.
Ive not read further down to see if anyone's yet replied to this but I'll give my tuppence worth, as a train signaller here in the UK.



If their system is anything like ours (and not had chance to look so am just presuming), it will work with what's called track circuits. These basically detect that a great big hunk of metal is in that particular section of tracks. These sections can be miles long. For the length of time that a train is in that section, it holds the signal/s behind it at red so that no other train can enter that same section, until it clears past the next signal and then the track circuit clears, holds the signal it has passed at red and the previous one can clear to green to allow a train into the section that has just cleared. It's a safety thing and makes movements easy to do and track. And protects the advance train if it breaks down so that nothing backends it.

Unfortunately track circuits can be tricked. A fridge lobbed off a bridge onto tracks, cable theft and so on. These then fool the TC into thinking that a train is "in section" and won't let the signals clear and release. A small length of conductive material eg wire would be very effective at doing this, halting any advancing trains from the previous section as the signals simply won't go green, to protect the train the system thinks is there. As I mentioned, these sections can be miles and miles long, especially rurally. A fridge would be easy to spot although would still require the track to be walked, taking time..Wire would be a very cheap and easy form.of sabotage, taking time to find and clear. In the meantime, everything behind is at a halt.


Requires a basic knowledge of how the TC system works but they obviously do, and if it's a long stretch, or a busy stretch with plenty.of crossovers and junctions, it would cause chaos as trains from other directions would also be held as THEIR signals also wouldn't release as they'd be crossing track where the system thinks there is a train.


Clever and effective

WorriedMumofTeen16,
Thank you for this explanation about how using a wire to stop a train would work I see you’ve followed up on this new thread to confirm it would have been this system.

It is marvellous to see the expertise and knowledge posters have added to these Ukraine discussion and support threads. Your expertise appearing out of the blue this morning is particularly satisfying.

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Natsku · 12/05/2022 09:25

Igotjelly

Thanks @katem98 and @Natsku - I'm terrible at compartmentalisation and, without giving too much personal info away, the work I do means that I can't escape it. I have a terrible history of mental health episodes too. Feel OK at the moment. Guess its anxiety about being anxious.....

I'm sorry, that must be really difficult :( maybe speak to your GP about the possibility of anxiety meds? Oxazepam really helped me when I had bad anxiety

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WorriedMumofTeen16 · 12/05/2022 09:30

ScrollingLeaves

@WorriedMumofTeen16 · 12/05/2022 08:20
TargusEasting
People use a wire to stop a train in Russia.

That is interesting. I wonder how that works if the train is hurtling at high speed.
Ive not read further down to see if anyone's yet replied to this but I'll give my tuppence worth, as a train signaller here in the UK.



If their system is anything like ours (and not had chance to look so am just presuming), it will work with what's called track circuits. These basically detect that a great big hunk of metal is in that particular section of tracks. These sections can be miles long. For the length of time that a train is in that section, it holds the signal/s behind it at red so that no other train can enter that same section, until it clears past the next signal and then the track circuit clears, holds the signal it has passed at red and the previous one can clear to green to allow a train into the section that has just cleared. It's a safety thing and makes movements easy to do and track. And protects the advance train if it breaks down so that nothing backends it.

Unfortunately track circuits can be tricked. A fridge lobbed off a bridge onto tracks, cable theft and so on. These then fool the TC into thinking that a train is "in section" and won't let the signals clear and release. A small length of conductive material eg wire would be very effective at doing this, halting any advancing trains from the previous section as the signals simply won't go green, to protect the train the system thinks is there. As I mentioned, these sections can be miles and miles long, especially rurally. A fridge would be easy to spot although would still require the track to be walked, taking time..Wire would be a very cheap and easy form.of sabotage, taking time to find and clear. In the meantime, everything behind is at a halt.


Requires a basic knowledge of how the TC system works but they obviously do, and if it's a long stretch, or a busy stretch with plenty.of crossovers and junctions, it would cause chaos as trains from other directions would also be held as THEIR signals also wouldn't release as they'd be crossing track where the system thinks there is a train.


Clever and effective

WorriedMumofTeen16,
Thank you for this explanation about how using a wire to stop a train would work I see you’ve followed up on this new thread to confirm it would have been this system.

It is marvellous to see the expertise and knowledge posters have added to these Ukraine discussion and support threads. Your expertise appearing out of the blue this morning is particularly satisfying.

I must admit I didn't ever think my training would qualify me to add technical expertise to a war thread! Just shows the the defenders are using every method available though, and I had to try and explain it as I had mental images of folks scratching their heads thinking the train would run into the wire lol. As I said it's simple yet effective and cheap.

Thanks to all contributors, these threads have been informative.

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TargusEasting · 12/05/2022 09:32

@WorriedMumofTeen16 You have joined the MNUK Resistance now!

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Alwayscheerful · 12/05/2022 09:36

F

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TargusEasting · 12/05/2022 09:39

This is actually the first Russian soldier to be indicted for War Crimes. Interestingly, despite the title 'Commander' appearing in the news report, it would appear he is of junior rank and even possibly a private.

Indicted : Russian soldier Shishimarin

Сommander of branch of tank division of Russian Federation Shyshymarin - first Russian military who will appear before court for murder of civilian in Sumy region, - Venediktov. PHOTO

Photo Censor.NET War in Ukraine

The first Russian military will stand trial for killing a civilian in the Sumy region.
The Prosecutor General Irina Venediktova reported about it on Facebook, informs Censor.NET.

The Office of the Prosecutor General sent to court an indictment against the commander of the unit 32010 "4th Panzer Kantemirov Division of the Moscow Region" Vadim Shishimarin.

The investigation established that on February 28, 2022, this 21-year-old Russian serviceman killed an unarmed resident of the village of Chupakhivka, Sumy Region, who was riding a bicycle along the roadside.

"Before that, the column, which included a sergeant, was defeated by our Armed Forces. While fleeing, he and 4 other employees fired at a private car with machine guns and seized it. The invaders drove into the village in a stolen car with punctured wheels. On the way, they saw a man returning home and talking on the phone. One of the soldiers ordered the sergeant to kill a civilian so that he would not report them to Ukrainian defenders. He fired several shots through the open window of a car from a Kalashnikov rifle at the head of a 62-year-old victim. The man died on the spot just a few dozen meters from his home," the statement said.

The suspect Shishimarin is currently in custody. Prosecutors and investigators of the Security Service of Ukraine have collected enough evidence of his involvement in violating the laws and customs of war, combined with premeditated murder (Part 2 of Article 438 of the Criminal Code of Ukraine). He faces between 10 and 15 years in prison or life in prison.

SUPPORT CENSSOURCE: HTTPS://CENSOR.NET/EN/P3340581

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TargusEasting · 12/05/2022 09:43

Remember:

Today is the tomorrow we worried about yesterday, and all is well.

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ScrollingLeaves · 12/05/2022 09:45

@TargusEasting · 12/05/2022 09:19

I heard on Radio 4 this morning the first War Crimes trial is opening today. I believe it follows the capture of the soldiers who killed the civilians at the bicycle superstore on the edge of Kiyv. The CNN report is here. The accompanying video is uncensored, just a warning should you watch it.

Shooting of Kiyv civilians
[video posted by Targus’s 09:19]

I watched it.
That video shows a mindset of extreme cold-blooded criminality on the part of the soldiers. It is broad day light. They are not scared. They have not been tricked. They are not battered up. They just think they can do what ever they want.

It surely is an indication of complete Russian thuggery, entitlement and sense of impunity. They do not act like poor, ignorant, terrified boys running amok.

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