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Original poster

Why is children's behaviour worse these days?

524 replies

salviapages · 12/04/2022 20:30

I recently retrained as a primary teacher, did placements in a few schools then worked as a supply teacher so seen a wide range and I've been shocked at the behaviour. Nothing like how I remember kids in my class at primary being.

Every teacher I've spoken to about this says behaviour has gotten worse over the years and I've seen mumsnetters say the same, including in the current thread about teachers leaving the profession.

So - why is this? Have we changed how we raise children? Have schools changed? Why the rise in bad behaviour?

OP posts:
bellac11 · 14/04/2022 21:54

@Twentysplenty

Gentle parenting just means validating the child’s feelings. It doesn’t mean no boundaries and getting their own way. Eg “I know you want to throw water on the bathroom floor as it’s fun to you isn’t it? Well it will damage the bathroom floor. I can’t let you do that so if you do that again I’m taking that cup off you.” Rather than just taking the cup with no explanation and the child just thinking your spoiling their fun.
I think that is going to be terribly confusing to a 2 year old. She will hear you in a calm voice talking to her about what she is doing and not understand at all when you remove the cup

If on the other hand you say, no in a stern voice, different tone to how you normally speak then she learns to associate what you are doing with your sanction, because the no turns into 'cup removed' as a physical consequence.

Without the tone of voice and short sharp no, it makes no sense to a child that young

fedupwithitnow · 14/04/2022 21:57

@BertieBotts

I have three children ranging from teenager to baby, it does work in households with multiple children.
Yes, perhaps, my dc were much closer in age and I wouldn't have had time in certain situations

I can see my dd using GP with her one dd which is good but sometimes they run rings around her

Twentysplenty · 14/04/2022 21:58

@bellac11 Yes as I said above I wasn’t talking about a 2 year old but was thinking of my 4 yr old son. It obviously depends on the child’s understanding.

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about these subjects:

Families General education
Tiredalwaystired · 14/04/2022 22:01

From where I’m standing I see plenty of well behaved well rounded children and teens. Most with a much better work ethic than my generation for sure. This feels like a wild generalisation to me. There have always been well behaved and less well behaved children.

Tabitha789 · 14/04/2022 22:11

Peppa pig!!

ldontWanna · 14/04/2022 22:18

@Tabitha789

Peppa pig!!
Well that's a new one.
AliceW89 · 14/04/2022 22:29

@Tabitha789

Peppa pig!!
At least it’s not Socrates.
ldontWanna · 14/04/2022 22:32

Socrates skunk. That kid stinks.Grin

ReggaetonLente · 15/04/2022 01:12

GENTLE PARENTING INVOLVES BOUNDARIES.

No means no in gentle parenting too.

And it is 100% harder, more effort, and involves more thought and self control than the because I said so, life's not fair, it's my house and you just live in it crap I was brought up with.

I'm really trying to remain polite here, not that I've been afforded the same courtesy, but there is irony here on people coming to mock, sneer and be rude about something they don't understand, despite multiple clear explanations and signposting to further resources, and then say that the 'good old days' worked well to raise emotionally intelligent and respectful adults.

ReggaetonLente · 15/04/2022 01:15

@BertieBotts

I have three children ranging from teenager to baby, it does work in households with multiple children.
Agreed. And what's more, the emulate it in how they talk to each other, and to us.
Bumbelinaaa · 15/04/2022 01:32

It’s not the kids, You are all just just older, more narrow minded, less tolerant and have a poor/selective memory of “the good old days”

autienotnaughty · 15/04/2022 05:30

@ReggaetonLente

GENTLE PARENTING INVOLVES BOUNDARIES.

No means no in gentle parenting too.

And it is 100% harder, more effort, and involves more thought and self control than the because I said so, life's not fair, it's my house and you just live in it crap I was brought up with.

I'm really trying to remain polite here, not that I've been afforded the same courtesy, but there is irony here on people coming to mock, sneer and be rude about something they don't understand, despite multiple clear explanations and signposting to further resources, and then say that the 'good old days' worked well to raise emotionally intelligent and respectful adults.

Exactly this. Of course it's easier to rule by fear. But gentle parenting done correctly is so much more effective and no therapy bills when they get older!
Simonjt · 15/04/2022 06:25

@bellac11 Worked perfectly well for my son at that age, no scary voice needed in this house, well, apart from when the dog steals things.

SpidersAreShitheads · 15/04/2022 06:39

Just in response to PP saying it wouldn't be possible for multiple children or those close in age - I have 12yr old twins, both with SEN, one with significantly high needs.

We have always followed gentle parenting and I've found it to be really effective.

As others have said, no means no. I have boundaries. Both my DC know that I don't say anything that I don't mean - no empty threats. I also don't do punishment for the sake of punishment, but there are natural consequences.

For example, a few months back my DD was trusted with something and the boundaries were made very clear. She went behind my back and did what I'd explicitly asked her not to do, breaking the trust I'd shown in her. When I found out, I was honestly gutted as I thought she'd confide in me before doing something like that but I guess it's part of growing up and finding your own feet. Anyway, I had a very calm conversation with her about how I felt disappointed she hadn't felt able to come and talk to me about this thing, and that I felt sad that she had broken her promise. I said that I felt particularly sad because now I had no option but to remove this privilege because she had shown she wasn't yet mature enough to be trusted. And I told her I felt really sad about that because I know how much she was enjoying it, but those were the consequences of the decisions she had made. And I did feel genuinely gutted for her but I can't just ignore what she did. She was really sad but she understood and unprompted she gave me a hug, apologised and said she didn't know why she didn't come and talk to me about it. When she apologised she knew that I wouldn't change my mind so she wasn't saying sorry to try and get what she wanted back. I haven't reinstated her privilege for this thing, and I won't be. We've moved on and she understands what happened and why. Without going into detail, it was all a bit horrible but I am so bloody proud of how she handled her own screw-up and how she handled a very difficult conversation with me, and accepted the consequences.

Flutterby106 · 15/04/2022 08:24

I have sent you a pm.

Goldbar · 15/04/2022 08:32

@Organictangerine

Assuming what Idontwanna? That if a 2 year old discovers lobbing water on the floor at home is fun then he is likely to try it at nursery? Yes I do assume that Confused
I think children learn very quickly that what is acceptable in one setting (home, for example) may not be acceptable in another.
Preg19 · 15/04/2022 09:15

@SpidersAreShitheads

Just in response to PP saying it wouldn't be possible for multiple children or those close in age - I have 12yr old twins, both with SEN, one with significantly high needs.

We have always followed gentle parenting and I've found it to be really effective.

As others have said, no means no. I have boundaries. Both my DC know that I don't say anything that I don't mean - no empty threats. I also don't do punishment for the sake of punishment, but there are natural consequences.

For example, a few months back my DD was trusted with something and the boundaries were made very clear. She went behind my back and did what I'd explicitly asked her not to do, breaking the trust I'd shown in her. When I found out, I was honestly gutted as I thought she'd confide in me before doing something like that but I guess it's part of growing up and finding your own feet. Anyway, I had a very calm conversation with her about how I felt disappointed she hadn't felt able to come and talk to me about this thing, and that I felt sad that she had broken her promise. I said that I felt particularly sad because now I had no option but to remove this privilege because she had shown she wasn't yet mature enough to be trusted. And I told her I felt really sad about that because I know how much she was enjoying it, but those were the consequences of the decisions she had made. And I did feel genuinely gutted for her but I can't just ignore what she did. She was really sad but she understood and unprompted she gave me a hug, apologised and said she didn't know why she didn't come and talk to me about it. When she apologised she knew that I wouldn't change my mind so she wasn't saying sorry to try and get what she wanted back. I haven't reinstated her privilege for this thing, and I won't be. We've moved on and she understands what happened and why. Without going into detail, it was all a bit horrible but I am so bloody proud of how she handled her own screw-up and how she handled a very difficult conversation with me, and accepted the consequences.

Wow that’s a wonderful example of gentle parenting done properly, it’s tough but so worth it 😀
Organictangerine · 15/04/2022 10:43

I think children learn very quickly that what is acceptable in one setting (home, for example) may not be acceptable in another.

Too confusing for a 2 year old. A 4 or 5 year old, yes.

Organictangerine · 15/04/2022 10:46

One of my teachers at secondary school used to teach at a school for ‘difficult’ pupils that had been expelled from other schools. She was quite strict with them, very clear about expectations and didn’t engage in any form of negotiation with them. A few years later she left, and a new ‘softer’ teacher took her place. She heard from colleagues that her old pupils were extremely upset and wanted their old teacher back; they had thrived under clear boundaries and strict routine, and were not enjoying the sudden ‘chaos’ of a gentle approach.

Directorlevelmaybe · 15/04/2022 10:55

I think these are the reasons:

Technology and social media - kids sit on pads all day, demand mobile phones aged 7… it’s too much too soon

Both parents at work - I work full time as does my husband and i find my kids are hard work, over tired and quite honestly don’t get attention from us in the way 3 year olds need. When I’m at home on a week off they are much calmer. But we both need to work to pay bills!

Covid- has not helped

Soft parenting: in my childhood I was a bit scared of my mum. No meant no and I wouldn’t dare ask again. And things like drugs/alcohol as a teen scared me… not because I thought I might take a pill and die but because I was scared I’d wake up in hospital and face My mum Grin she’s as great mum but parents of today give in and say yes and kids Just expect to be given things.

Tiredalwaystired · 15/04/2022 11:37

@Directorlevelmaybe

I think these are the reasons:

Technology and social media - kids sit on pads all day, demand mobile phones aged 7… it’s too much too soon

Both parents at work - I work full time as does my husband and i find my kids are hard work, over tired and quite honestly don’t get attention from us in the way 3 year olds need. When I’m at home on a week off they are much calmer. But we both need to work to pay bills!

Covid- has not helped

Soft parenting: in my childhood I was a bit scared of my mum. No meant no and I wouldn’t dare ask again. And things like drugs/alcohol as a teen scared me… not because I thought I might take a pill and die but because I was scared I’d wake up in hospital and face My mum Grin she’s as great mum but parents of today give in and say yes and kids Just expect to be given things.

Seven year olds can demand phones all they like. They don’t have to be given them.
PegLegAntoine · 15/04/2022 11:44

A lot of the examples of gentle parenting done right (as opposed to permissive parenting) just sounds like normal sensible parenting to me, not ruling with fear, discussing emotions etc. In particular natural consequences, I believe that’s really important and much more effective than arbitrary unrelated consequences. I don’t know why it needs a name as a method (genuinely - not being snarky).

Having said that I do resort to “because I said so” sometimes. Things like chores especially, maybe a “I expect you to do it because we are a family and we all help out” etc.

Tiredalwaystired · 15/04/2022 12:45

My dad used to rage and lash out. I did as I was told but I have a recoil reflex these days when I hear anyone shouting. It’s not a great legacy.

LethargeMarg · 15/04/2022 13:02

@Organictangerine

One of my teachers at secondary school used to teach at a school for ‘difficult’ pupils that had been expelled from other schools. She was quite strict with them, very clear about expectations and didn’t engage in any form of negotiation with them. A few years later she left, and a new ‘softer’ teacher took her place. She heard from colleagues that her old pupils were extremely upset and wanted their old teacher back; they had thrived under clear boundaries and strict routine, and were not enjoying the sudden ‘chaos’ of a gentle approach.
Teaching isn't parenting though . I'm a mum and an ex teacher and you do need to have very high standards and be confident to manage challenging behaviour as a teacher -but there is already a certain amount of structure and routine and boundaries in place it's a much more complex relationship being a parent
BertieBotts · 15/04/2022 13:06

Well exactly pegleg! I'm not sure why people go on about it like it's some bizarre totally weird thing. Most of it is totally standard parenting that anyone would do unless they're a complete harridan.