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Original poster

Why is children's behaviour worse these days?

524 replies

salviapages · 12/04/2022 20:30

I recently retrained as a primary teacher, did placements in a few schools then worked as a supply teacher so seen a wide range and I've been shocked at the behaviour. Nothing like how I remember kids in my class at primary being.

Every teacher I've spoken to about this says behaviour has gotten worse over the years and I've seen mumsnetters say the same, including in the current thread about teachers leaving the profession.

So - why is this? Have we changed how we raise children? Have schools changed? Why the rise in bad behaviour?

OP posts:
autienotnaughty · 14/04/2022 06:06

@TomPinch I agree we started drinking in pubs at 14, smoked, would go out poll up in early hours hammered. Went off in cars with boys. My girls have been positive angels in comparison although obviously lockdown played a role.

LethargeMarg · 14/04/2022 06:48

It is good for resilience for some risk taking behaviour (eg climbing treees etc) so there could be an argument that these non drinking and staying in teenagers aren't getting these risks so act out against authority / in classrooms more ? I was a fairly wild teenager (drugs raves etc) but I was still very well behaved in school, respectful of adults etc
I know there's a school of thought about helicopter parenting and kids being more dependant on parents

LethargeMarg · 14/04/2022 06:51

I'm still so suprised by how many sixth formers go with their parents to uni open days - I never would have done this - again to me that's changed ...in my era you were pretty much left to your own devices from 16. I don't remember my parents having any involvement with my choices re education , uni whereas now parents are so invested in this stage .

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about these subjects:

Families General education
BertieBotts · 14/04/2022 07:32

I think we broadly agree Porcelain - there is definitely a need for that kind of leadership and authority in a structured environment where learning needs to take place in a limited time - which yes, OK, I can see that does apply to schools as well. I think I was just getting sidetracked because the concept of an extracurricular activity feels quite different.

CarryonCovid · 14/04/2022 07:40

I'm still so suprised by how many sixth formers go with their parents to uni open days - I never would have done this - again to me that's changed ...in my era you were pretty much left to your own devices from 16. I don't remember my parents having any involvement with my choices re education , uni whereas now parents are so invested in this stage
I think there are 2 main reasons for this;

  1. Parents are explicitly expected to contribute to University costs
  2. We understand far more about the physiology of the adolescent brain and realise that the decision making impulse control centre aren't mature at 18.
gingerhills · 14/04/2022 08:30

The parents at uni thing is because we're paying! Thousands of pounds. Or DC are getting saddled with massive debts. We want to check that the places they look at are worth the money, since they all charge pretty much the same amount.

Organictangerine · 14/04/2022 08:34

I am surprised by parents posting in the local Facebook group asking for a job for their 16/17/18 year olds…

Nothappyatwork · 14/04/2022 08:42

@LethargeMarg

I'm still so suprised by how many sixth formers go with their parents to uni open days - I never would have done this - again to me that's changed ...in my era you were pretty much left to your own devices from 16. I don't remember my parents having any involvement with my choices re education , uni whereas now parents are so invested in this stage .
That is true but one of my friends chose to go to Bradford University because there was an iceskating rink. I don’t think anything terrible happened as a result of that decision probably wasn’t the best reason to pick a course.
VenusClapTrap · 14/04/2022 08:49

@Flutterby106

^VenusClapTrap
Hmm. This is only my own personal experience, but I’d say behaviour at the primary school I attended in the 1970s was worse than the behaviour of the kids at my dcs’ primary today. Some of those kids I went to school with were quite terrifying. Looking back, it’s pretty clear they had unpleasant home lives. I doubt that Mrs Hardiman hitting them with a plimsoll for their misdemeanours helped matters either^
Would this have been D....Junior School, with a certain Mr. D, Mr. M (music) Mr. B..(popular) and Mrs. S ( secretary!).
The school that's now (like many others) converted into flats?

Yes! I wondered if anyone would recognise this.

Preg19 · 14/04/2022 12:13

@Itshothothot

Gentle parenting has a lot to answer for.

Children don’t fear their parents these days like they did many years ago.

Many parents give in to their children for an easy life

Gentle parenting helps raise emotional secure children, you obviously don’t know how gentle parenting works and thinking of permissive parenting, why would you want your children to fear you?!
Preg19 · 14/04/2022 12:16

@cafedesreves

I find this really interesting... I agree I think "gentle parenting" can lead to poor behaviour. Big difference between being afraid of your parents and understanding firm boundaries.
Gentle parenting does have firm boundaries, I think you’re thinking of permissive parenting
Preg19 · 14/04/2022 12:21

@Rebecca1305

I’d hate to have you all as parents. There’s ways to discipline with gentle parenting - ways that won’t make your child fear you. I bet a lot of you on this thread support smacking too.
Totally agree!!
Preg19 · 14/04/2022 13:03

@Yahyahs22

Yes and gentle parenting is awful. I've yet to see it have a good outcome
Do you actually know what it involves though?
bringincrazyback · 14/04/2022 14:01

@Rebecca1305

I’d hate to have you all as parents. There’s ways to discipline with gentle parenting - ways that won’t make your child fear you. I bet a lot of you on this thread support smacking too.
So firm parenting automatically equals smacking, does it?

Give your head a wobble.

Roundeartheratchriatmas · 14/04/2022 14:02

Hmm Confused I don’t believe in hitting children no.

Calafsidentity · 14/04/2022 14:21

So firm parenting automatically equals smacking, does it?

Give your head a wobble

Exactly this^^! There is a pretty massive gap between firm but fair parenting and being violent towards your dc thanks very much!

Organictangerine · 14/04/2022 14:39

Why don’t you explain @Preg19 ?

Fairislefandango · 14/04/2022 17:14

I’d hate to have you all as parents.
There’s ways to discipline with gentle parenting - ways that won’t make your child fear you. I bet a lot of you on this thread support smacking too.

Rubbish. The world isn't divided into gentle parenting advocates and people who smack their children. If you read some of the hundreds and hundreds of (often heart-wrenching) posts by MNers talking about their bad childhoods, they are pretty much always about parents who were either physically or emotionally abusive, or neglected their children by failing to give them proper boundaries and let them do what they liked with no consequences.

Every day I see kids who can't function properly in school because they have not been taught how to behave or interact with other people appropriately.

taybert · 14/04/2022 17:41

Gentle parenting is ALL about how to interact with other people- I think there’s a lot of mixing up of gentle parenting and lazy/poor parenting here. The very foundations of gentle parenting are about teaching children to communicate without shouting or demanding, to be able to get their thoughts and feelings across clearly whilst trying to understand the thoughts and feelings of others. And yes, a lot of this is done by modelling behaviours - we try not to shout when we’re cross and our children learn that shouting isn’t necessary when communicating displeasure. There’s also more discussion involved in telling them to sit in a step, but that’s not supposed to be persuading, it’s supposed to be an explanation to help the child understand the other point of view. Speaking respectfully to each other is supposed to set an example for the child. That doesn’t mean there aren’t firm boundaries. It definitely doesn’t mean never saying “no”. Some people might call their laziness or desire not to set boundaries gentle parenting but if you look at literature around it that’s not it at all.

Preg19 · 14/04/2022 19:15

@taybert

Gentle parenting is ALL about how to interact with other people- I think there’s a lot of mixing up of gentle parenting and lazy/poor parenting here. The very foundations of gentle parenting are about teaching children to communicate without shouting or demanding, to be able to get their thoughts and feelings across clearly whilst trying to understand the thoughts and feelings of others. And yes, a lot of this is done by modelling behaviours - we try not to shout when we’re cross and our children learn that shouting isn’t necessary when communicating displeasure. There’s also more discussion involved in telling them to sit in a step, but that’s not supposed to be persuading, it’s supposed to be an explanation to help the child understand the other point of view. Speaking respectfully to each other is supposed to set an example for the child. That doesn’t mean there aren’t firm boundaries. It definitely doesn’t mean never saying “no”. Some people might call their laziness or desire not to set boundaries gentle parenting but if you look at literature around it that’s not it at all.
@Organictangerine this explains it quite well!
Yahyahs22 · 14/04/2022 19:19

@taybert

Gentle parenting is ALL about how to interact with other people- I think there’s a lot of mixing up of gentle parenting and lazy/poor parenting here. The very foundations of gentle parenting are about teaching children to communicate without shouting or demanding, to be able to get their thoughts and feelings across clearly whilst trying to understand the thoughts and feelings of others. And yes, a lot of this is done by modelling behaviours - we try not to shout when we’re cross and our children learn that shouting isn’t necessary when communicating displeasure. There’s also more discussion involved in telling them to sit in a step, but that’s not supposed to be persuading, it’s supposed to be an explanation to help the child understand the other point of view. Speaking respectfully to each other is supposed to set an example for the child. That doesn’t mean there aren’t firm boundaries. It definitely doesn’t mean never saying “no”. Some people might call their laziness or desire not to set boundaries gentle parenting but if you look at literature around it that’s not it at all.
Okay this is the kind of gentle parenting I try to do. Not the ones I've seen though. But I fully agree eith all of this. My consequences for my child doesn't involve naughty step or whatever. It's more like, 'if you carry on banging that cup against the window I'm going to take it' then actually follow through with taking it and not giving in to the tantrum.
Organictangerine · 14/04/2022 19:24

And if you speak respectfully but firmly to your child and they laugh and carry on disobeying - what then @Preg19 ?

CoverYourselfInChocolateGlory · 14/04/2022 19:43

I think following through on consequences of both good and bad behaviour is vital. If they learn you make empty threats and empty promises, your words mean nothing.

Preg19 · 14/04/2022 19:49

@Organictangerine

And if you speak respectfully but firmly to your child and they laugh and carry on disobeying - what then *@Preg19* ?
It depends on the situation, laughing can be a sign of them being uncomfortable not necessarily trying to be naughty, so things like saying why are you laughing etc wouldn’t help but calmly removing them from the situation and then a logical consequence given, again this depends on the situation. There are lots of books out there If you are interested on looking more into it!
Organictangerine · 14/04/2022 20:03

Ok let’s take my daughter’s bedtime antics this evening - throwing cups of water out of the bath onto the bathroom floor. I give her one warning that if she does it again I will remove the toy cups. She does it again, I remove them. The only ‘gentle parent’ I know uploaded a clip of their similar age child flinging water onto the kitchen floor from the sink as the mum laughed along indulgently, so I’m assuming my ‘punishment’ wasn’t in the spirit of gentle parenting?