The invasion continues - Thread No.4

[ChimChimeny]

Following the previous (2? 3?) Threads

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/_chat/4492641-The-Invasion-Has-Stalled

Listening to the speech from the Russian representative today feels like a parallel universe. Ukraine were the Nazi invaders, killing people and committing genocide. The bloke sounded barking mad ranting on.

Do their people really believe what they are being told. Surely the internet means that the real truth does leak into the country.

Putin needs to go and the Russian people led by the Oligarchs are the ones to do it. Assuming they want to of course.

Just caught up on the new thread.
Can't believe Putin is bombing schools now the bastard.

I asked MNHQ to add Thread 4 to the title : ) Thanks MNHQ! And thanks OP for starting the new thread.

Unfortunately there is no way NATO can put up a no-fly zone over Ukraine, they would have to enforce it and that means direct war between NATO and Russia.

The only way I see that happening is if Putin completely freaks out and decides to bomb Kyiv to dust, i.e. slaughter 3 million people. I think then NATO might consider it. But I don't know how likely this is. Putin did bomb Grozy and Aleppo to smithereens but those were against 'terrorists' and non-Slavic people. Even Russians who are supporting him now are not likely to agree with the complete destruction of Kyiv (which is the birthplace of the Russian nation in the first place).

@Roussette

At last...

here

FIFA/UEFA suspend Russian clubs and national teams from all competitions

They love their sport so this is more important than some realise.

Financial hits
Sporting hits
Culture
Political
Everyone together against Russia (and Belarus) and eventually they must realise they are in the wrong

Any Russian on here or Russian supporters? Interesting to hear what they think about the madness of Putin.

Ukraine yes a person on Times radio said the same

Not to underestimate the hit of removing those

That super long convoy headed toward Kyiv is crazy. Given how dependent they are on roads for moving around, if you can take out the beginning and end of the convoy, they would be pretty screwed for a while. Ukraine does still have some drones active.

What's interesting is that Russia's actions have so far done everything Putin is (supposedly) fearful of. The EU is coming off as coherent, organised and taking action. He's got Germany doubling their defence spending, Kosovo asking for NATO membership and Ukraine applying to join the EU.

@Ncwinc

I know. FIFA drawing the line, Switzerland taking a moral stand. What next?

UK welcoming Ukrainian refugees would be good.

@Tigersonvaseline

Thanks the silly mastiff.

Well the poor Russian people fighting the enemies outside whilst allowing the enemy within??

The horrors of wicked evil bastard's, Lenin, Stalin just like the tsars with no respect at all for the sanctity of life, just like chairman Mao and the list goes on.

And now Putin. apparently he's penciled in that he's happy too loose 50 thousand troops to this.

I do think Putin truly believes that Ukraine poses an existential threat to Russia.

Thus if the survival of Russia relies on the war then he is prepared to lose that many men. Probably more. That number is probably more about how many he thinks will be ultimately tolerated by the Russian public (remember the psychology of Russian History is lined with the ideal of loss and necessary suffering - 15% of the population or 16 million Russians died in WW2)

Again this is kind of incomprehensible to us, but does sound different to a Russian audience.

@TheSillyMastiff I don't have any sympathy for Russian soldiers, whatever their age, they are committing war crimes, shelling civilians, invading a peaceful country and i hope that together with Putin and the Generals that sent them there, they end up in the Hague, however unlikely that is.

I wonder what would happen if the UN voted to send an armed force into Ukraine on the basis of a majority vote, bar one maybe two obvious abstentions.

I don’t think Ukraine got the memo from Putin that it would be over in 24 hours 😳

A bully has to be stood up to no matter how hard it is and yes, there will be a cost to us but nowhere near as bad as it is in Ukraine

Everyone together against Russia (and Belarus) and eventually they must realise they are in the wrong

Or cause them to join them in Putins bunker mentality fantasy where they are the innocent victims of a hostile world order led by the old enemy, the USA.

(This is what I came across in Serbia - anyone who is an enemy of the USA / NATO is my friend.)

So thoughts on the EU offering membership to the Ukraine?!?

Doesn’t this escalate tensions so not a wise move??

@RedToothBrush
Do you think 15% of the population of Ukraine or 7 million people might be willing to die for Ukraine? Given also that Ukrainians formed part of the same Soviet forces in WW2.

[quote Alexandra2001]@TheSillyMastiff I don't have any sympathy for Russian soldiers, whatever their age, they are committing war crimes, shelling civilians, invading a peaceful country and i hope that together with Putin and the Generals that sent them there, they end up in the Hague, however unlikely that is.[/quote]
Hence why I said "their families" is who I have the utmost sympathy for.

Problem is with Russia being so great at its propeaganda machines, you've no idea what those men believe. It's definitely not fact but they have been brainwashed. It was the same for German soldiers in WW2 the propeaganda machines brainwashed a country to believe in its cause and to fight for it.

Blame the general not the footman.

Putin needs to go and the Russian people led by the Oligarchs are the ones to do it. Assuming they want to of course.

I don't think that's going to be possible, unfortunately. Even his closest generals/officials would have a job (this picture was taken yesterday). I think he has obviously watched the film 'Valkyrie'.

A bully has to be stood up to no matter how hard it is

Failure to do so is exactly why we are here now.

I have been reading about the Russian victory announcement that was published by mistake. Is it really genuine? How do we know?

@DrBlackbird

So thoughts on the EU offering membership to the Ukraine?!?

Doesn’t this escalate tensions so not a wise move??

This seems huge to me too

And I was wondering what happens next if they’re in

@DrBlackbird

So thoughts on the EU offering membership to the Ukraine?!?

Doesn’t this escalate tensions so not a wise move??

They are unlikely to. Its already been said there is a split between member countries over this.

So, for the time being at least, its not on the table regardless of whats being said.

Ukrainians are posting videos on social media about how to drive abandoned or captured Russian tanks/vehicles...

Look how much fun this woman is having!

twitter.com/AsaadHannaa/status/1498343442316996614?s=20&t=n9Es0QIupEqR2N_5n5NArg

@StormzyinaTCup

Putin needs to go and the Russian people led by the Oligarchs are the ones to do it. Assuming they want to of course.

I don't think that's going to be possible, unfortunately. Even his closest generals/officials would have a job (this picture was taken yesterday). I think he has obviously watched the film 'Valkyrie'.

Goodness, that reminds me of that scene in Evan Almighty when the draw pops out of the filing cabinet.

@DrBlackbird

So thoughts on the EU offering membership to the Ukraine?!?

Doesn’t this escalate tensions so not a wise move??

I did not think the EU "offered" membership. They are free to apply. Ask Turkey.