Page 2 | Child deliberately not eating enough to stay up later

Musicalmaestro · 26/12/2021 19:41

I'd try giving her a regular supper at 6.30 of something like cereal, making it a routine matter.

Hen2018 · 26/12/2021 19:42

Could you buy some sort of curly straw (or one of those straws that looks like a pair of glasses) and both have a drinking competition?

Again, definitely don’t mention to her anything about how much or when she drinks.

Catch her unawares e.g bring some daft straw drink or drink with a cocktail umbrella in it so she can drink it in the bath.

GoGoGretaDoll · 26/12/2021 19:42

I'm really confused about what she's eating when, would you mind listing a typical day for me? Because having seen what a typical school lunch looks like, both in terms of quantity and quality, and seen how much kids leave because they want to get out and play, I think the first step is to make sure she actually is getting enough food throughout the day.

WaningMoon · 26/12/2021 19:42

If your daughter is hungry then you need to make sure her evening meal is substantial as well as her dinner time meal.

What is her after school routine like ? Can you do a long walk home with her or a stop off in a playground ? You can then have a substantial meal, then after eating spend some time playing with her, then bath & light supper , story & bed.

Musicalmaestro · 26/12/2021 19:43

It's a long time from 4.30 pm to breakfast for a growing child.

smileanddance · 26/12/2021 19:43

What's her bedroom setup? Anything you can do to make it more relaxing/comfortable for her? My DD used to wake up at 5am every morning and we just thought that was how she was, but when we moved her from her cot bed to a single bed, she instantly started sleeping until 7:30am every morning, sometimes even 9am!! Wish we had done it sooner as we waited until she was 3 and a half!

Original poster

Helpmetosleepplease · 26/12/2021 19:43

@Hen2018

Could you buy some sort of curly straw (or one of those straws that looks like a pair of glasses) and both have a drinking competition?

Again, definitely don’t mention to her anything about how much or when she drinks.

Catch her unawares e.g bring some daft straw drink or drink with a cocktail umbrella in it so she can drink it in the bath.

She won't keep any kind of liquid apart from soup and fruit juice in her mouth, she spits it out saying she doesn't like it. Even then it has to be orange juice or tomato soup she won't eat any other kind at all.

OP posts:

fallfallfall · 26/12/2021 19:43

How much of these “meal” choices are down to financials?
This “plan” doesn’t work at your or your ex’s.
Maybe it’s time for a totally different approach like a robust dinner between 5-6 pm with fluids.

Hen2018 · 26/12/2021 19:45

What does she drink at school? My children’s schools have never let them take anything except water, even the SEND schools and college.

Original poster

Helpmetosleepplease · 26/12/2021 19:49

@GoGoGretaDoll

I'm really confused about what she's eating when, would you mind listing a typical day for me? Because having seen what a typical school lunch looks like, both in terms of quantity and quality, and seen how much kids leave because they want to get out and play, I think the first step is to make sure she actually is getting enough food throughout the day.

Typical Day

Breakfast 5.30am - Bowl of Cereal (dry), 2 slices of white toast (won't eat wholemeal, I do she refuses to even try it) cut into 4 (so 2 slices cut in half), banana and a box of raisins, if she's still hungry she'll have an apple or an orange as well

Snack 8.30am on way to school - Another banana and a box of raisins

Snack 10am - Bagel and a banana

Lunch 12.30pm (at school) - Example would be Macaoni and Cheese, peas and brocolli, biscuit on its own, banana (I'm told by both DD and the deputy head who does lunch duty she eats all her food and often asks for more)

Snack 2pm - Breadsticks and a piece of fruit

Tea 4.30-5pm - Soup or omelette with 2 slices of toast

It's the tea thats the issue, when she eats all her tea she's ready for bed at 7.30pm and sleeps until 5amish, if she refuses to eat it or doesn't eat enough she wants something else at 7pm and won't sleep until 9pm, thats why I think it's deliberate.

OP posts:

Original poster

Helpmetosleepplease · 26/12/2021 19:51

@WaningMoon

If your daughter is hungry then you need to make sure her evening meal is substantial as well as her dinner time meal.

What is her after school routine like ? Can you do a long walk home with her or a stop off in a playground ? You can then have a substantial meal, then after eating spend some time playing with her, then bath & light supper , story & bed.

After school routine:

On nights she has no activities we walk a mile from school to the shop/her dads house (next door to the shop), then 0.9m home.

On two nights she has activities, so we walk 0.2mish home from school, get changed, eat then go out again, and back for 6.15 or 6.30 depending on night.

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SmellyOldPartridgeinaPearTree · 26/12/2021 19:52

Maybe she's fed up of light dinners, it's winter, I wouldn't want soup or an omelette either? Or toast after having toast in the morning. Try making her a spaghetti bolognese or something, mix it up a bit.

Try a weighted blanket too. Home bargains do them for £14.99.

Original poster

Helpmetosleepplease · 26/12/2021 19:52

@smileanddance

What's her bedroom setup? Anything you can do to make it more relaxing/comfortable for her? My DD used to wake up at 5am every morning and we just thought that was how she was, but when we moved her from her cot bed to a single bed, she instantly started sleeping until 7:30am every morning, sometimes even 9am!!

Wish we had done it sooner as we waited until she was 3 and a half!

She has a single bed, and has since she came out of her cot at 20m. I can't change her room round or put a bigger bed in as it's a box room.

She sleeps fine if she actually eats at 4.30-5pm if she doesn't then she's not down until 9-10pm.

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Original poster

Helpmetosleepplease · 26/12/2021 19:53

@Hen2018

What does she drink at school? My children’s schools have never let them take anything except water, even the SEND schools and college.

@Hen2018 Nothing at all but thats not unusual for her with me either as she doesn't like water, milk or squash, she will literally spit them out.

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Original poster

Helpmetosleepplease · 26/12/2021 19:54

@SmellyOldPartridgeinaPearTree

Maybe she's fed up of light dinners, it's winter, I wouldn't want soup or an omelette either? Or toast after having toast in the morning. Try making her a spaghetti bolognese or something, mix it up a bit.

Try a weighted blanket too. Home bargains do them for £14.99.

She has a weighted blanket, and loves it, wraps herself in it.

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Hospedia · 26/12/2021 19:55

It's the tea thats the issue, when she eats all her tea she's ready for bed at 7.30pm and sleeps until 5amish, if she refuses to eat it or doesn't eat enough she wants something else at 7pm and won't sleep until 9pm, thats why I think it's deliberate

If she doesn't eat her tea or eats very little of it then try offer her supper at around 530/6pm rather than 7pm.

Hairyfriend · 26/12/2021 19:55

Thats seems like a lot of bananas in one day!!![shocked]

Is the cereal sugary or plain? Seems like lots of fruit and very little veg or protein. Would she eat porridge?

Hen2018 · 26/12/2021 19:55

And what are school doing about that?

Hen2018 · 26/12/2021 19:56

Quote fail. What are school doing about a pupil who doesn’t take a sip of fluid all day?

Original poster

Helpmetosleepplease · 26/12/2021 19:57

@Hen2018

Quote fail. What are school doing about a pupil who doesn’t take a sip of fluid all day?

@Hen2018 they tell me to send a water bottle in anyway and they will try to get her to drink. She's in year 2 now, none of her teachers have ever seen her drink ever.

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GoGoGretaDoll · 26/12/2021 19:58

Thanks for taking the time to type that out.

I think that most adults really overestimate how much food is in a school lunch - it's great that she's eating it all up, but it probably isn't as much food as you think it is. Or to put the same thing another way, it's maybe not quite as much food as this particular child needs.

There's lots of carbs in her diet (which is good!) but not a lot of fat or protein, which is what fills you up. So could you look at something like cheese cubes or even cream cheese/humus to dip with her breadsticks in the afternoon, rather than more fruit.

Could a fruit juice be turned into a smoothie with whole milk to get more calories in there?

There's a thing called laddering that you can do with food where basically you take one accepted food and 'ladder' up from there. So my DS likes fish fingers in breadcrumbs with ketchup, which meant he started accepting homemade salmon with breadcrumbs and ketchup, which then led to him accepting just plain salmon. So it's about thinking of a favourite food and working out from there to hopefully land on foods that will fill her up more.

I think I would maybe try snack at 2, snack at 4, tea at 6 and maybe make that more plentiful?

The key thing with food though is to not make it into a battle which I know is easier said than done. It actually doesn't matter if she's doing it deliberately or not - you have to be totally easy breezy chill about it. I think in this case that also means letting go of some of your bedtime anxiety too. If she's up till 9, she's up till 9. It's not ideal, but it's better than making bedtime and dinner time a battle.

Also teach her to make her own toast! That way she's in control. Just another way of de-escalating.

Original poster

Helpmetosleepplease · 26/12/2021 19:58

@Hospedia

It's the tea thats the issue, when she eats all her tea she's ready for bed at 7.30pm and sleeps until 5amish, if she refuses to eat it or doesn't eat enough she wants something else at 7pm and won't sleep until 9pm, thats why I think it's deliberate

If she doesn't eat her tea or eats very little of it then try offer her supper at around 530/6pm rather than 7pm.

I will try slightly later, thank you.

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Hen2018 · 26/12/2021 19:59

She’s getting almost no protein at all.

Original poster

Helpmetosleepplease · 26/12/2021 20:00

@Hairyfriend

Thats seems like a lot of bananas in one day!!![shocked]

Is the cereal sugary or plain? Seems like lots of fruit and very little veg or protein. Would she eat porridge?

@Hairyfriend she loves bananas, it's the one food she's always loved and eaten with no issues so I've always encouraged it.

She does eat some vegetables but can be fussy, and will spit out any food she doesn't like which is fine when it's just me but when she's eating with all of Key Stage one (so 120 children) she can upset them so school don't push the veggies on her.

Cereal is usually either cornflakes or wheetabix, she doesn't like chocolate cereal. She has it dry so no milk.

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takenforgrantednana · 26/12/2021 20:02

@Helpmetosleepplease

DD is 6, she hates going to bed and will do everything to get out of it. I’ve learnt to ignore her and put her to bed, she does eventually sleep.

She’s now realised if she doesn’t eat enough at 5pm she’s too hungry to sleep. I’ve tried ignoring it but she wakes up 2, 3, 4 times in the night screaming she’s hungry which means I get even less sleep.

So she’s now having a substantial snack at 7pm (bed time is 7.30pm – snack has to be toast or a crumpet and a piece of fruit and sometimes she’s still hungry and wants a bowl of cereal (dry)) but she’s then too hyped up to sleep so ends up playing (with no toys just her own voice) until 9 or 10pm at night.

I can’t sleep until she goes to sleep (anxiety related) so that’s meaning I’m not getting enough sleep.

Earlier bedtime doesn’t help, not giving the snack means she wakes up, giving a smaller snack means she still hasn’t eaten enough so wakes up in the night, just milk doesn’t help because she doesn’t really like it so will take a few sips and then say she doesn’t want anymore, she also doesn’t like water or squash – she’d live off fruit juice if allowed but the dentist has said it’s really bad for her.

I suspect she has ASD although no-one agrees so I’m struggling to get anyone to get a diagnosis for her. She is diagnosed with Hypermobility and has an eye problem as well.

Any suggestions? I can’t go on like this. I need to sleep.

put her meal out, what she doesnt eat at 5 pm, then when she goes to bed and wakes hungry, she only gets offered the rest of the meal she didnt eat.

maybe 5 pm is too early for her? try moving meal times to 6 - 6.30 ish instead to make her want to eat

Child deliberately not eating enough to stay up later

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