Judgey in laws

[Loudina]

PIL arrived to stay for a week on Friday. Thus far I've been criticised for the following things:

• DD (6) goes to bed too late (8pm)
• we eat too late (6pm)
• DD should not be allowed to watch TV after 5 as that's TV time for grown ups
• DD talks too much and should be told to be quiet more
• our cat shouldn't be allowed in any of the bedrooms (I keep him out of the guest room because I know PIL don't like him) but apparently it is disgusting I let him in DD's room or our room
• I spend too much time cooking and why don't I just make easy meals
• we eat too much pasta and rice and why can't we just have some meat and veg
• our Halloween decorations from Sunday still haven't been taken down
• we spend too much time on food and why do we shop at sainsbury's when Aldi is so much cheaper
• we should not drink full fat milk, only skimmed (I bought skimmed milk specially for them)

Driving me crackers. DH is at work when I expressly asked him to take time off. Apparently he didn't ask in time. I'm sure he did it on purpose but apparently I can't complain as I was happy to have them to stay. So tempted to just go out on my own tonight and leave them all to it.

@Igfdyjxzyjkv

My point to OP is follow my method you will be less stressed, avoid a nasty confrontation and they will probably back off when they see they have some influence (of course there will be many who say oh no they want and cite horror stories but 99% of the time they just want some recognition). Everyone will say it won’t work because (a) MN loves a confrontation more than a resolution and therefore (b) no one will have actually tried my approach to find out that it works. I offer this up as one view (and trust me it absolutely works) But if you want to have a fight - go ahead if you feel you need it but once you open that box, you never close it again.

I can’t see how, shutting a blind, indoor only cat in one room or outside causing stress to the family pet and forcing a child to go to bed earlier than is their regular routine to suit someone else’s preferences is goi by to do anything but cause the OP to be more stressed. Just because they are her husband’s parents does not mean they should dictate how the oOP (and presumably her husband) run their household and raise their child.

If they’re not happy with how the OP does things, they don’t have to stay

I would not stay in a house that lets any animals in the bedrooms, even kitchens and living rooms makes me feel queasy - the only reason I raise it is to say that some people feel that way, it really is not normal to have animals inside. If I had animals inside I would put them outside or some separate in the house if I had guests, it is just politeness.

You may not like many things, millions of UK households have pets. One figure says 44%.

Based on your thinking that in laws should come into a household and dictate everything, I suspect you are a MIL. I know you should not visit other people in their homes.

Also just imaging the future relationship between grand children and grand parents if they are allowed to completely change the household routine so that they are hidden away in bed at 6pm.

The children would come to dread these visits.

Erm, in my house, the cat has the complete run of it, and no manners at all. The poster that gets 'queasy' at indoor pets would have been full on tossing her cookies when my cat landed, as she once memorably did, in the middle of a guests dinner plate. Naturally it was the cat phobic, allergic guest. (Couldn't have happened to a better person, lol).

Animals inside are indeed normal. Not liking it, not doing it, one's self, does not make a thing abnormal.

If I had guests who were uncomfortable with my inside cat being inside, I'd put the guests outside. It's just politeness.

@ldfdyjxzyjkv I personally don't see a point in owning a pet if you just plan to keep them outdoors. Especially in the UK. But that's another thread. There is no way my 3 cats and dog who are used to run of the house would be either locked out of rooms or outside because of shitty in laws. There is also no way I would put my kids to bed earlier than 8pm and change meal times. I think next time the in laws should fork out for a hotel. It's not their house, they shouldn't dictate shit!

I would dramatically exclaim "Goodness me you do complain a lot!" or "Gosh that's rude!" or "Ooh you're never happy are you?". Every. Single. Time. And then continue doing things in MY house exactly the way I want to. How rude they are. Hope they bugger off soon OP.

@JenniferJareau

- DD (6) goes to bed too late (8pm) that is late for a 6 year old to be fair

• we eat too late (6pm) they are unreasonable
• DD should not be allowed to watch TV after 5 as that's TV time for grown ups guests should get the first crack at the TV
• DD talks too much and should be told to be quiet more Does she?
• our cat shouldn't be allowed in any of the bedrooms (I keep him out of the guest room because I know PIL don't like him) but apparently it is disgusting I let him in DD's room or our room they are unreasonable
• I spend too much time cooking and why don't I just make easy meals they are unreasonable
• we eat too much pasta and rice and why can't we just have some meat and veg they are unreasonable
• our Halloween decorations from Sunday still haven't been taken down they are unreasonable
• we spend too much time on food and why do we shop at sainsbury's when Aldi is so much cheaper they are unreasonable
• we should not drink full fat milk, only skimmed (I bought skimmed milk specially for them) they are unreasonable

What planet are you on @JenniferJareau????

So long as a child gets enough sleep to see them through the next day, then there isn't a one-size-fits-all approach here and 8pm is a fine time for a 6yr old to go to bed. If they need to go earlier due to being tired out from activities, they go to bed earlier but not because of guests/family staying or just because.

As for guests having first crack at the tv, well, that would be a no in our house. We will ask them if they have any programmes that they would like to watch but I would guess that they would have some sort of set top box set to record those programmes before they left to come to stay with us because that is what we do before we leave to go on a break away or holidays, we set up all of our programmes to record while we're away and enjoy binge watching them on our return.

My MIL is just like this and at the start I found it infuriating at the constant criticism. I was once making toast for toddlers and she even told me ‘you need to leave that to rest first before buttering’. Then proceeded to show me how to prop it up to let it ‘rest’
Everything I did had a better way of doing it. So I would ask/mention first what I was thinking of doing, eg ‘I might make a lamb roast tonight, I was thinking for about 4.30, as that was the time they would eat, she then said hmm what about a bit later and make for the normal time at 6.30 because every one is used to that time, no point changing the routine’
By discussing/mentioning what I was thinking of doing or making or buying or child rearing stuff, I found the criticism was much less and we developed an amazing bond.
All she wanted to do with the previous criticism was to feel like she mattered, her opinion mattered and her advice was helpful, she was in the wrong way trying to be a good MIL.
Not everything has to be a full blown drama and no contact etc.
Just think of how they also must feel, they want to feel needed, relevant and that they are wanted in the lives of the next generation and not seen as ‘old people’ who don’t know anything or are annoying. They do thinks in a different way because of the generation gap.
Embrace that and take about why they think there way is better etc
Dont forget we will all be somebody’s PIL in the future, will you embrace everything you seen done and not offer any criticisms of your own?
I actually started to enjoy her long stays because I had some one who loved to cook, pick up shopping and show me receipes I should make. I would watch and we would chat and I would enjoy the time off from having to actually do it myself, she loved feeling her experiences were worthy and my children grew knowing Nanna does it this way and mummy does.
If wanted baby equipment we would research, go to the shops and look at the stuff and i would lead her to the faults and pros of both and then point a few more cons on hers if it wasn’t suitable and she would actively engage in the things I liked because she felt I valued her opinion.
At the end of the day, the mothering/parenting instinct that is there doesnt just disappear once your child becomes 18, and as a MIL she wants to still care and look after her child/their partner and also the grandchildren.
I for 1 have been excited and planning for my children giving me grandchildren since they were small.
I just don’t understand why people get so offended at little things in life.
Do what if she says your daughter goes to bed a bit late, has it damaged or hurt you or your daughter? Ask her her opinion at a suitable bedtime, maybe even just be non confrontational as say ‘I read/heard that it’s best for children at her age to have a full 11-12 hours sleep a night, so she gets up at 7.30-8.00 and I heard it wouldn’t be enough and I want her not to be tired so she can learn better etc, and if I put her to bed earlier then she wasn’t getting to see her Daddy. Then I would say something like ‘I really want my daughter to have a time with her daddy before bed so it works best for us’
I’ve never had issues with my MIL when I have actually explained my reasoning, how it benefits the grandkids and their relationship with others.
The early to bed was a generational concept and actually if you discussed it like an adult with her she would probably say, that it’s so much better than how she had to parent her children. When fathers looking after children after tea wasn’t the normal thing to do

I just saw your list as pettiness and a way of showing it’s your house, your husband and your children so it’s all your way. These PIL have raised kid(s), worked, ran and maintained a home etc and you talk as if you expect them to walk into your house and just sit saying nothing that you might find ‘critical’ as if they are stupid and know nothing.

Just make them feel valued, wanted and needed. At the end of the day they both raised the man you thought was the perfect man for you to marry, set up home and have a child with. So they really can’t be such bad people or there ways so offensive that for a week you can’t include them.
If they want meat and veg - invite her shopping to pick something and ask if she would like to make the meal with you and your daughter?

Can’t understand why there has to be so much drama and offended going on. When on the grand scheme of things in life - is what they say bad?
I lost my daughter and my grandson within the last few years….who do you think understood my pain the most- who also stepped up at 80 years old to help me. The dreaded MIL

Older does absolutely NOT mean wiser.

Ridiculous phrase.

My PIL, MIL in particular, were so critical of everything I said, wore, cooked, how the house was decorated, MIL criticised me for breastfeeding saying she though it disgusting & I should bottle feed . I haven't spoken to her or seen her for years now and it's been a huge relief tbh. Going NC with DH finally understanding how mean and spiteful she was to me, was the best decision. Not everyone's PIL are welcoming or friendly and mine were definitely not that. Apparently MIL did the same to DH's first wife and his brother's wife too

Sometimes others opinions are different to ours, sometimes people see them as ‘criticism’. Did you ask her why she thought breastfeeding was disgusting, in a non-confrontational manner? People of different generations have wildly different views to ours. My MIL also thought breastfeeding was disgusting and was very very vocal about it.
At a different opportunity I brought up her view as obviously mine was clearly different. She had that view because it was what she had been taught at a young age, that exposing breasts was not the correct thing and disgusting, her husband had also told her it was disgusting because they weren’t meant to be on display but covered and he didn’t want his wife showing everything to anyone.
So I explained I would be discreet, hard we 34GG Boobs, but the health benefits were better, gave her stuff to read about, she didnt come round straight away, but I expected her to respect my view and I did it discreetly to respect hers.
So what I could have seen as a criticism that I’m not doing it right, was disgusting was actually just something she was taught.
It then also transpired she wanted me to bottle feed so she could do some feeding. After 6 weeks I would express milk so there was always that ability for her a couple of times a week.
Not every different opinion, should be seen as an out right nasty criticism and get offended at.
It’s ridiculous that different opinions will MIL are seen as such bad criticisms that adults have to stop seeing their parents and grandparents are kept from grandkids over a parent being offended over different opinions

Get offended and cut off contact if GP’s are doing something that is actually nasty to your children but ‘I’m offended brigade’ really do need to learn resilience and teach it to their children.
How will you feel when you are the PIL and have to tread on eggshells just in case you offend the your children’s OH by not bowing and scraping at their feet profusely stating how everything they saw and do is the only time and the best thing they heard. Just in case contact is withdrawn because some feels critiqued and ‘offended’

Offended and disgusted is a world where a 55 year old man can by a 9 year old girl

A MIL saying isn’t that 8pm bedtime a bit late for a 6year old…. Oh wow- she needs to be told to leave and DH needs to tell them is disgusting and how dare they?
Priorities for being offended and disgusted really needs to be on the right issues

Well, how do you feel as the parents, in your own home, with your children and animals, are supposed to tread on eggshells just in case you offend your OH's parents by not bowing and scraping at their feet profusely stating how everything they saw and do is the only time and the best thing they heard.

People are, or are not resilient. I would suggest that 'back off, you had your turn, now this is ours, and this is our home, our kids, and our pets', has at least the merits of honesty and clarity. If the parents are upset by that, well, I guess that's a them problem. Lack of resilience, maybe?

@Igfdyjxzyjkv
Basic respect is not changing your daily routine because they think it needs changing. That's just weird. No doubt they would find something else to criticise anyway.

I don't see what the generation gap has to do with anything tbh. I know they did things differently back then, as did my own mother. I don't have an issue with that. What I do have an issue with is them pulling me up on absolutely every tiny little thing because that's incredibly rude and it wasn't how I was brought up. My own DM did things differently but she would never dream of telling me that meant I wasn't doing it "right".

It's the commenting that is rude, and yes it is rude. The "generation gap" is not an excuse. They are not even elderly, we are talking early sixties here.

I never once treated them as "stupid" either. I don't think they are stupid.

@Igfdyjxzyjkv

I asked if you had dc and what ages as often people without dc or who's own children are now adults forget what dc of ops child's age and stage are like I've seen that a lot. They expect young children to behave in ways they aren't yet capable of.

Entirely your choice whether to answer or not but that was the point I was making

It doesn't necessarily need to be a "fight" or even a confrontation, but it IS ops home and child and so she does have the right to have a say indeed the final say. What "power" do the in laws have here aside that bestowed by op and dh?

As far as they are concerned they rule the roost

But it's not their roost!

Nor did I at any time say op SHOULD "throw a tantrum" -

STOP putting words in my mouth!

I said raise the issue in a diplomatic and assertive way this is entirely possible to do.

I lost patience with my mum that time admittedly but when I had similar difficulties with my parents or other guests I generally managed to address it without it becoming an argument or even a heated discussion.

or let herself get emotional

Nice bit of misogyny there

Because god forbid a woman disagree with how she is being treated in her own home lest she be thought  emotional

Re routines - I did not say that every child that needs a routine adhered to has or could have a disability I was very clear about that, that was just possibly the case with my own dd. I have cared for literally hundreds of babies and toddlers over the years and some need a routine, some aren't fussed at all, most fall somewhere in the middle.

NOT just because of disability but simply personality differences. Children are as varied as adults in that. I'm on another thread totally different subject and one poster has a username indicating they're more of a lark, I'm most definitely a night owl, some adults like to always eat at a regular time (like these in laws - they don't want their routine disrupted but expect a child's to be!) others eat whenever...

If they are looking for basic respect - they need to start by GIVING it

I think you're just being deliberately inflammatory!

A definite possibility

Giving in to unreasonable demands in your own house will invariably lead to even more unreasonable demands

Totally agree

some kids just need less sleep

Also true!

Dd didn't sleep right through until she started school and even then was up at 5-30-6am most mornings - then teens hit and couldn't get her OUT of bed 

but people seem to forget there's such a thing as being a good guest too.

Absolutely!

That's reminded me - when I had flare up with mum at one point she went "I'd never behave like that" at which point dad reminded her of HER mil first visit just after my brother was born (prior to that we lived in same street!) mum was dealing with a colicky baby, a toddler and dad was on deployment. Her mil/my gran had supposedly come to "help" and caused ructions apparently with trying to correct EVERYTHING mum was doing with us. She lasted exactly 2 days before she blasted her with "actually help or go home! So far you've been nothing but a hindrance!"

Now I loved my gran...but she could be a bit much and quite...brusque/abrupt - even for a weegie! So I can well imagine how those 2 days had been!

Gran to her credit apologised and basically wound her neck in and was super helpful after that.

It was a turning point for mum and grans relationship and they got on famously after that. I'm told this is when my mum started calling her "mum" I don't remember it but I remember the relationship they had around me growing up and my mum was one of the few people that could get away with telling my gran to quit being so critical! Even her own dds my aunts didn't get away with that! To the point mum used to get phone calls from her sil's "can you have a word with mum? She's driving me nuts!" 

I suspect you are a MIL

Yes I considered that - likely to sons too

@Biscuitmonster2318 so sorry for your losses

I don't think anyone is saying pil aren't entitled to an opinion but there's a right and a wrong way to express it and sometimes it doesn't need expressing at all just think it!

My own now ex mil was lovely and super helpful. She very rarely if ever criticised but would express things as in "it was different in my day we did it x way" or at most "can I make a suggestion?" And then she'd explain a way of doing things and her reasoning behind it ex fil was a quiet man and not inclined to offering anything unless asked - but when he was asked he often had great ideas but he was very much NOT of his generation (he's in his 90's now) because he was raised differently to most as he was unfortunately raised in care.

Gotta go for now

But why does it have to be like that? Life is very short and many things are worthy of getting offended by, going NC etc, but because PIL or relatives have opinions that are viewed as Constant criticism’s - instead of finding a way to build and create relationships it isn’t

I also have to add that I absolutely do fully agree with NC etc as I went NC with my mother due to abuse as a child and at 16 I left. I wouldn’t put my children or partner or anyone in a situation that wasn’t safe.

I just like to look at a bigger picture and also how would/will I feel if that happened to me and I was suddenly stopped from being allowed contact with my adult children and my current and future grandchildren because any future in laws think my old fashioned/out dated and need to feel I’m still useful even if I’m old ways warrant my children and grandchildren taken
I’ve already lost at 13yr old daughter and an 11 month old grandson to health conditions, I don’t want more.
Raising a child and losing them is simply horrific and a pain I cannot describe.

I could and would not wish to put any other person through that just because they asked why my children was going to bed late or why we ate too much pasta etc.

But they didn't ask 'why' was the child going to bed later, or 'why' so much pasta.

They said child was going to bed too late, and said too much pasta.

This may have been their perception and way in their house. I'm sure they have the awareness that this is not their house, so not their way, and so their perception, while entirely valid, is not entirely relevant.

I'm working on the theory my sister aspires to with her kids and grandkids (I know at least one of her kids would say she is not entirely successful, lol) - STFU until asked.

I’m a mother in law to sons and one daughter now as my other passed away and to step-children.

I treat and view my daughter-in-laws with love and they are extra girls we have gained in the family.
I also told them if I saw or do something that isn’t sitting right with you then just say.
When my grandson passed away I would be called all times of day and night by my daughter-in-law, her mum and my son to say she wasn’t coping and I would drop everything and did my best to keep her safe, feel loved and cared for with out any criticism, judgement or malice as she worked through her emotions.
Even now I don’t take offence to anything that has been said or done. It wasn’t very pretty either and some horrible, I mean truly awful things were said, I could have got offended and gone NC but why?
If you love people and care about them you pick your battles and let others go.

I just think extending families is accepting people for all their wierdness as nobody is perfect in life, and treat people how you want to be treated. Complaining and making people take sides to agree with you etc is what a lot of people complain about regarding others.

@Igfdyjxzyjkv

My point to OP is follow my method you will be less stressed, avoid a nasty confrontation and they will probably back off when they see they have some influence (of course there will be many who say oh no they want and cite horror stories but 99% of the time they just want some recognition). Everyone will say it won’t work because (a) MN loves a confrontation more than a resolution and therefore (b) no one will have actually tried my approach to find out that it works. I offer this up as one view (and trust me it absolutely works) But if you want to have a fight - go ahead if you feel you need it but once you open that box, you never close it again.

You capitulate to demanding and rude people so that they feel that they have some influence, but it’s OK because it’s strategic

@Loudina

It's all phrased as advice or comments rather than out and out criticism.

With my MIL it's always passive aggressive questions:

"Do you always let the kids watch TV after nursery?" (Yes, it stops them trashing the place long enough for me to do dinner)

"Do you not find they are really tired by the end of the week in nursery?" (Yes, I don't put them in that many days for laughs, I have to work)

"Could you not be bothered with taking them swimming this weekend then?" (It was booked up)

@mbosnz

But they didn't ask 'why' was the child going to bed later, or 'why' so much pasta.

They said child was going to bed too late, and said too much pasta.

This may have been their perception and way in their house. I'm sure they have the awareness that this is not their house, so not their way, and so their perception, while entirely valid, is not entirely relevant.

I'm working on the theory my sister aspires to with her kids and grandkids (I know at least one of her kids would say she is not entirely successful, lol) - STFU until asked.

I stand corrected but -

I think a ‘why is my grandchild going to bed late’ even worse than what OP has wrote ‘ They said child was going to bed too late, and said too much pasta.
As those are really just statements. Why can’t a person query something without fear of being told leave or as OP has been told to leave them in house alone and take daughter out.

I might ask a friend, neighbor, my kids etc if they also said a young child went to bed later.
Why so late? I would just expect to be told so she can spend more time as a family, dad likes to have time with her after work or as my reasons with my 3 and 4 children, I don’t get in from work until 6pm, have really and I want to see them for a bit!

In no way did I get huffy and want to through out my PIL let alone get offended and a perceived‘criticism’

Treading on eggshells doesn’t build a good relationship. If you need or want something from a person be specific and kind about it.
Before I got on with my MIL I used to be in absolute floods of tears all the time, especially as my 3rd child was born with a brain malformation and I was very sensitive at the time and I did take her comments the wrong way. As I believed she was judging me and that I had done something to my daughter, it did lead to one day of an almighty argument, because I’m feisty and very stubborn when the situation is right. It ended like the situation of a previous poster who’s mum and Gran had had an almighty row and then cleared the air and we’re very close after it
I told her I felt her criticisms were a way of saying I wasn’t a good enough parent because of how she was and I thought she blamed me and hence wanted to do everything for her as I wasn’t good enough and I had had enough. She was gobsmacked I had taken it that way as she herself was just wanting to make it as easy for me as possible because she had no-one, she felt guilty that maybe she hadnt helped me enough before

So every single slight or offensive comment that is taken there is another thought process going on when it’s said

Not everyone can truly say exactly what they mean and in a way the other person needs or understands.

@Pumpkinsonparade - that is beyond disgusting

I'm with you OP, that sounds like such hard work. Your husband owes you for this!

I struggle with guests when they try to change dinner time in my house. I've had friends (my own age) come to stay (with their kids) and they have made dinner for 5pm for themselves and the kids. I find it so odd, and rude because my husband isn't home from work until 6.30/7pm. Eating after 7 is our norm and you are in our house. It's irksome. Not enough to have a row about it, but still odd!

Or alternatively, why can a person not be aware enough to understand that different family's do things different ways (yes, even when one person is your adult offspring), accept it, and respect it? That removes any possibility of perception of criticism and taking of offence. Win/Win?