Can someone explain what my son saw?

[WitchesInTheWoods]

My DS (14) and his friends went for a walk deep in the woods yesterday. They came across four people standing in a circle with candles and markings on the ground. Two were dressed in all black, very smart, like priests. The other two were in normal clothes and were bleeding from their arms. My son said he saw them cut themselves, they were mumbling something inaudible while the two in all black held their arms in the air and chanted. When they realised they were being watched one of the people in black told the boys they were going to cut their heads off if they don’t leave. I know it’s true because one of the kids filmed it and I’ve watched it. Wtf!?

@HerRoyalWitchyness

yes I would think stuff like that about other religions if they favour dark views. I hate our so called evangelical neighbour for being a bigoted, misogynistic, homophobic arse

But your neighbour doesn't favour dark views. As far as he's concerned he's right and thats the path to the light. This is the problem with dark and light and good and evil. Everyone interprets it differently

@HerRoyalWitchyness There is a line here though. Is it evil to take a child from a children's home, drug them, have them raped multiple times and post the images online for money? When you get to this point there is surely a line about what should be considered good or evil - granted there are grey areas in the middle where people disagree - but I would say the above example is evil, would you agree? If you have the opportunity to either help and support and keep safe a teenager runaway or groom them to become a sex worker and get them hooked on hard drugs to keep them under control - which option is good or evil? I would say the latter is evil, would you agree?

The fact of the matter here is that this group in the woods threatened to cut off a child's head - is that good or bad? I would say bad, it is harmful to the children and against the law. Do you think it was okay?

@me4real The bible was written by people (not by deities...) and arguably by people who were wanting to use religion to control others, and there are inconsistencies and many of the stories are similar to those in other religions including the pagan religion. But as you say, what it comes down to is what you as an individual sees as good or evil, their own moral compass - it sounds as though you are in reality going against the moral norms of your own culture and society, in fact, ie secular not a spiritual choice, if you think the examples I thought of as evil or bad above were fine.

So imagine a religion that every week takes part in ritual cannibalism under an image of a man being tortured to death.

Every week the participants confess a list of minor "transgressions" to a man behind a screen who may be raping small children.

He may be scourging himself or wearing a spiked band around his leg too.

How twisted is that?

Not really. It's all open to interpretation.

Interpretation Or justification of abhorrent views or practices. 🤷‍♀️

@biuyvoih of course there's a line. But everyone's line will be different and merely holding different views like PPs neighbour doesn't make them necessarily evil.

Also if you look at "evil" from the point of view of psychiatry, people who cause harm to others are considered not normal, and there are reasons for this able to be analysed. We are as humans arguably hard wired to be kind to others and not cause harm, as we are "rewarded" with feel good hormones and higher levels of happiness.
It isn't just to do with spiritual beliefs, it is to do with whether or not you buy into science.

Interpretation Or justification of abhorrent views or practices. stop being dramatic. No one's justifying "abhorrent" views and practices. Merely pointing out that those views and practices aren't as abhorrent as you think.

[quote HerRoyalWitchyness]@biuyvoih of course there's a line. But everyone's line will be different and merely holding different views like PPs neighbour doesn't make them necessarily evil.[/quote]
If you accept there is a line, though, you can accept that some things should be universally considered evil? Was it okay for them to threaten to chop off the child's head, for example?

Was it okay for them to threaten to chop off the child's head

Not a single person has said that was OK.

@HerRoyalWitchyness

Was it okay for them to threaten to chop off the child's head

Not a single person has said that was OK.

Which proves the point that no, what is good and evil is not just down to an individual's interpretation. Is all I am trying to say.

Of course it is. We are influenced by society of course but we still have individual values and morals.

@HerRoyalWitchyness everything you’ve said x100

This has given me the proper creeps OP! I hope your son is okay. I'd report it to the police for the threatening. Threatening to cut a child head off combines with the creepy ritual does not scream sane behaviour. It's not like they told him to fuck off!

Interpretation Or justification of abhorrent views or practices. stop being dramatic. No one's justifying "abhorrent" views and practices. Merely pointing out that those views and practices aren't as abhorrent as you think.

🙄 or maybe they are & you just justify your own twisted views by minimising mine

But I suspect they are...,,, you’ve just missed the joke

No I haven’t, it’s just not that funny. It’s a bunch of confused Americans who’ve think they’ve founded a human rights movement using Satanic imagery.

They say they don’t believe in supernatural Satan, which is understandable, but they tried nonetheless to have a black mass at Harvard and performed a pentagram ritual in California.

The whole thing is dumb, misconceived and slightly boring.

or maybe they are & you just justify your own twisted views by minimising mine

Come on then as you seem to know it all, what twisted views do I hold?

@Elphame

So imagine a religion that every week takes part in ritual cannibalism under an image of a man being tortured to death.

Every week the participants confess a list of minor "transgressions" to a man behind a screen who may be raping small children.

He may be scourging himself or wearing a spiked band around his leg too.

How twisted is that?

@Elphame, I expect it won't have escaped your notice that blood sacrifice (including humans, commonly children) is a common feature within Pagan beliefs and practices. Cannibalism also was a common feature of warfare. Added to this the bodies of vanquished enemies were put on display.

The difference in Christianity is that God, taking on human form in his son Christ, Himself was a willing sacrifice for us. What is more, He came back to life after He died. And The Christian sacrament of Communion (consuming bread and wine) is in remembrance of this.

I maybe should have added historically with regard to Pagan beliefs and practices.

And unfortunately someone calling themselves Christian does not mean they are immune from wrong doing and committing crimes.

Human beings, generally, are capable of atrocities.

I looked at the video and there is definitelty something very strange going on

The POV of the person making the video showsclearly that they are filming the "ritual" from very close up. This is evidenced by the brief glimpse of a person who is shown between the filmer and the robed people. The brief glimpse shows that this person is very close to the filmer and the people doing the "ritual".

What I find very strange is that we are invited to believe that this is covert footage of a super secret ritual and yet the filmer is very close to the alleged ritual participants.

They continue with the "ritual", as evidenced by the participant holding their arms up, even though the filmer and friend/s are close by and, in daylight, clearly visible.

The very peculiar thing is the fact that there are dry leaves all over the ground, so it would be impossible for a covert filmer to get so close without alarming the people being filmed, without alerting them via the sound of crunchy leaves and breaking twigs.

So the video shows people engaged in a "ritual" who seem unconcerned about people nearby filming them.

This seems incongruent with the reports that they threatened to decapitate the people disturbing and filming them.

It does not seem probable that they threatened to decapitate the intruders and then just carried on while being filmed.

It also does not seem probable that they just carried on with a ritual while being observed and filmed and then went on to make threats (which would have presumably been captured on video).

All very strange

@JesusInTheCabbageVan

This is a parenting forum populated largely by frazzled, middle class premenopausal women. We've been excitedly arguing about a second hand changing bag in a charity shop for several weeks now. The chances of any of us having insider knowledge of satanic forest rituals are quite slim, tbh.

😂😂 Although you never know. I’ve heard some quiet surprisingly useful stuff on here.

Quite

Haven't watched the video because I don't want to but perhaps they zoomed in so it looks close but they were actually far away. Also, I think the threat would have come after the video or during filming, when they realised people were watching or filming.

I presumed the boys were threatened after filming, not before

Come on then as you seem to know it all, what twisted views do I hold?

I have absolutely no idea, but your insistence that it's just a different POV when I'm talking homophobia, child drugging & grooming, multiple rape & murder, doesn't sound so great tbh

Haven't watched the video because I don't want to

lol

but perhaps they zoomed in so it looks close but they were actually far away.

No. They scan downwards and up again clearly showing proximity. Also there is a brief capture of a person who is close to both the group and the intruders.

They are definitely filming from close proximity.

Also, I think the threat would have come after the video or during filming, when they realised people were watching or filming.

Think about it. Anytime I have encountered antisocial behaviour or violence it usually diminishes when people start filming, for obvious reasons.

It would make no sense for the group to threaten the boys on camera, especially not if they had tolerated the group standing near to them while hoding up a phone or video camera, as is evidenced in the video uploaded by the OP.

Of course if they did threaten the boys on camera then a) the OP should have uploaded that part as evidence to us of criminal activity or b) more appropriately, reported it to the police.

So OP, did the boys get threatened before, after or during the filming?