Sarah Everard thread 2

[HangingOver]

Keep venting.

Original thread here www.mumsnet.com/Talk/_chat/4362028-Anyone-follow-the-coverage-of-the-Sarah-Everard-case-today-and-want-to-vent?pg=1

Sorry to ask I've not trawled all the threads but why is crssida to blame?
Yes she's top dog etc but isn't this just indicative of a wider problem... Of corruptions and self checking etc m

@Autumngoldleaf

Sorry to ask I've not trawled all the threads but why is crssida to blame? Yes she's top dog etc but isn't this just indicative of a wider problem... Of corruptions and self checking etc m

I suggest you “trawl through the threads”.

@Autumngoldleaf because she is in charge of the organisation that has the wider problem and corruption. She's top dog, so she's accountable, and it's up to her to instigate change in arguably the one institution where corruption, violence and injustice should not exist.

True I know but this sort of thing I think is bigger than her, I don't think the top person alone can bring it whether she stays or goes

If I'm lying... I was going to put a nb

Please no ridiculous, catty unnecessary remarks save your keyboard skills.

Autumngoldleaf CD should be in the lead on how to tackle misogyny in the police force, on how to keep women safe from predatory police men. She has come up with nothing in the months since Sarah's murder. She oversaw the policing of a vigil where women were manhandled. She needs to go. We need someone with integrity, vigour and courage to take on the job.

Whether she goes or not, police corruption has always been a huge problem.

Personally id focus on the wider picture.

Ie looking at it from every angle, the set up, how things work, financing, recruiting, and most importantly reports and complaints.

I dearly want Wayne Couzens to identify as a woman and request a transfer to a women's prison and for Sir Keir "that's not right" Starmer and Shadow Justice Secretary David "dinosaurs hoarding rights" Lammy to explain their position on this. I don't have it in for Labour - Lib Dem, Green and SNP politicians are the same. I just that I used to vote Labour.

Philip Allott, North Yorkshire police commissioner, has the answer. It’s for women to be more street wise, and to educate themselves on the law and their legal standing. If only Sarah had known her rights, Philip says, she wouldn’t have got into the car. So that’s alright then.

There’s more on this statement on BBC News.

@AdaColeman

Philip Allott, North Yorkshire police commissioner, has the answer. It’s for women to be more street wise, and to educate themselves on the law and their legal standing. If only Sarah had known her rights, Philip says, she wouldn’t have got into the car. So that’s alright then.

There’s more on this statement on BBC News.

This was a shocking and ignorant read. What a horrific man and point of view.

It seems like the sick satirists are in charge of the Met Police comms now.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58760933

"In the event someone believes they are in "real and imminent danger" the Met advised they "must seek assistance - shouting out to a passer-by, running into a house, knocking on a door, waving a bus down or if you are in the position to do so calling 999".

So if you're scared by the police, ask random strangers to help you, run into random houses, or call 999 where you'll get the same police who are scaring you and enabling bastards like WC and not bothering to suspend those officers who were in a whatsapp group with him.

"Five serving officers and one former officer are under investigation by the Independent Office for Police Conduct (IOPC) for allegedly distributing messages between March and October 2019 which were discovered during Ms Everard's murder investigation."

"Three of them, including the ex-officer, are subject to criminal investigation for offences under Section 127 of the Communications Act, which refers to material that is "grossly offensive or of an indecent, obscene or menacing character".

So why aren't they suspended? They say they're going to do something but they don't.

"As part of renewed efforts to ease fears in the capital, the Met will step-up "reassurance patrols" and treat indecent exposure allegations more seriously."

And yet they're not even suspending those officers who are subject to criminal investigation for "material that is "grossly offensive or of an indecent, obscene or menacing character"

I mean this really sums up the fact the police are doing nothing at all as far as I can tell, that is concrete, to stop this happening again.

"The London force faces questions over whether it missed chances to stop him, and has issued safety advice to women." So EVEN THOUGH it was their CLEAR FAILURE to stop him after his indecent exposure that enabled him to murder, they are not doing anything themselves, but issuing advice to women. And that apparently is all they are doing. And the advice is almost comically insane.

It seems like the sick satirists are in charge of the Met Police comms now.
I was reminded of a quote vaguely recalled from Catch-22, a novel often firmly agreed on as satire. Have now looked it up. Not coming close to satire today. Chilling.

“Help!' he shrieked shrilly in a voice strangling in its own emotion, as the policemen carried him to the open doors in the rear of the ambulance and threw him inside. 'Police! Help! Police!' The doors were shut and bolted, and the ambulance raced away. There was a humorless irony in the ludicrous panic of the man screaming for help to the police while policemen were all around him. Yossarian smiled wryly at the futile and ridiculous cry for aid, then saw with a start that the words were ambiguous, realized with alarm that they were not perhaps, intended as a call for police but as a heroic warning...to everyone who was not a policeman with a club and gun and a mob of other policemen with clubs and guns to back him up. 'Help! Police!' the man had cried, and he could have been shouting of danger.”

One thing that struck me was that he was an admitted user of prostitution, most probably trafficked girls from Eastern Europe given that cover story he tried to come up with when he was caught. Does anyone think for a moment that he treated any of those poor women with the faintest respect? I have a sickening feeling he used his police warrant card to get away with all sorts of unspeakable acts. And those women would never have been able to do anything about it. At least they now know he will never be released.

I cannot believe the Met haven’t suspended the WhatsApp officers. The ones serving in different forces have been suspended but not the Met. They’re in a different world, how can they not see the damage they are doing ? Why were they not suspended the minute they were under investigation?
Don’t worry ladies, if one of these officers tries to stop you ( obviously you won’t know it’s one of them) just run to the nearest house, whoever might live there. Jesus Christ I’m so angry.
As for “ask probing questions and ask to speak to control” yes I’m sure a kidnapper will stand quietly whilst you ask to blow his cover.

One of them is in my local constabulary - we’re a rural county, the chances of being able to flag down a bus are slim to diddly squat. If you’re lucky you may be able to flag down a tractor… and no guarantee you’d be near to a house either. Ugh.

@Spudlet

One of them is in my local constabulary - we’re a rural county, the chances of being able to flag down a bus are slim to diddly squat. If you’re lucky you may be able to flag down a tractor… and no guarantee you’d be near to a house either. Ugh.

Exactly. We don’t all live cities. As if the advice wasn’t horrible enough the lack of insight into what the country as a whole looks like is mind blowing. The quotes from North Yorkshire commissioner also failed to see this, and N Yorks is the biggest county, most of which is rural.

@Muselyforbreakfast

bbc.in/2Y8Rd7f?fbclid=IwAR3GNLEabMe-dGugWcNaCAtyBeJ8lTeHRQHwmFhqThPVtZnVJM6ze4-ROnw

Hope this link works. BBC report about the North Yorkshire Crime Commissioner victim blaming Sarah for going with WC and saying woman should have legal knowledge

No amount of FUCK YOUUUUUUS will be enough for my response to this

@limitedperiodonly.
There's an old name I havant seen around for a long time. .. Yes, that would really drive the message home wouldn't it.

"In the event someone believes they are in "real and imminent danger" the Met advised they "must seek assistance - shouting out to a passer-by, running into a house, knocking on a door, waving a bus down or if you are in the position to do so calling 999

This doesn’t make sense. I’m sure Sarah Everard didn’t think she was in imminent danger or she would have done those things. There are two problems here. Potential false arrest by non officers and also actual abuse of power by actual officers - remove the right for undercover officers to arrest alone and make that information very available so women don’t even stop if some random tries to ‘arrest’ them.

The 'waving a bus down' advice is especially ludicrous. I travel regularly on the bus; sometimes they don't even stop at a designated stop so no way is a bus going to stop for a random woman trying to wave it down. Anyway you can't wave if you are in handcuffs.

Hello @Autumngoldleaf. It would be interesting, wouldn't it? I was thinking of committing a crime today, Not anything violent, just walking out of Tiffany's with a great big diamond ring on. If the police confronted me I'd say anyone could fake an ID and hire a uniform from a fancy dress shop. Then I'd flag down a passing bus and go home. Apparently that's all women need to do these days. You could get away with murder.

The latest article in DM really makes me angry and saddened with how women are valued by those in parliament. It has now been confirmed that the murderer had some shifts in Parliament and now the headlines come that the Speaker is sickened and some MPs are outraged as they should be protected by a 'ring of steel'. They are furious this monster had an access all areas to parliament? Should we, every woman in this country, not have a right to be protected from him and is it not outrageous enough that he worked in any capacity for the Police regardless of where his shifts were at? Is it not sickening enough that he was able to be in possession of a warrant card that enabled him to carry out his vile act?

And I know it is the law but it is unbelievable that he was paid for four months whilst being investigated for this crime. Surely given his occupation, gravity of the situation and strength of evidence we now know they had this should never have been the case?!

It’s just another thing wrong with their disciplinary procedures. Everything seems to be in place to protect the Officers. The Police Federation protects and defends them no matter what.

Still being paid whilst on remand for Sarah’s murder with not a single element of doubt that he was guilty? Outrageous.

This is where you’d expect a genuine leader to say “I don’t care what the current policies say we are not going to be paying him and get on with changing the policy”.

@Noeuf

"In the event someone believes they are in "real and imminent danger" the Met advised they "must seek assistance - shouting out to a passer-by, running into a house, knocking on a door, waving a bus down or if you are in the position to do so calling 999

This doesn’t make sense. I’m sure Sarah Everard didn’t think she was in imminent danger or she would have done those things. There are two problems here. Potential false arrest by non officers and also actual abuse of power by actual officers - remove the right for undercover officers to arrest alone and make that information very available so women don’t even stop if some random tries to ‘arrest’ them.

Yes exactly! And the police knew this sentencing was coming up and this is what they come up with! Your solution is practical and makes much more sense.