Why don't so many people marry here?

[thoughtsandstuff]

Hello, I'm creating this thread solely to understand more about the culture in the UK. I come from Pakistan where culturally and religiously marriage is celebrated very widely. I moved here about 2 years ago and have noticed that most (not all) people I come across are not married. They have children with their partners and they live with their partners but they just don't get married (or very less do) I'm not sure why that is. They are living life as a married couple but still don't marry. And I'm just wondering what's the motivation behind that for both men and women..

Again, I mean no offence to the people or the culture here. I just want to understand it better. Would love to hear everyone's thought and opinions..

DP & I have been together for 20+ years, we are not married and we have no plans to marry. We own a house together and we are childfree by choice.

We both dislike the traditional, patriarchal role models and gendered assumptions associated with marriage, for example I wouldn’t want to change my name and DP wouldn’t want to be with a woman who wanted to change her name. Ours is a partnership of equals, not a traditional marriage and it suits us both to be together because we want to be together, not because we are contractually tied to one another.

Marriage is fine for most people, but we are not most people, and we don’t want to be.

@whiterheg

It's a good question OP. I married because I wanted the protections/benefits (and liabilities) it created that for me where imperative when having children.

I'm divorced now with an adult son and would probably stand to lose if I married then divorced my current partner, however I wouldn't rule it out (though I would create a civil partnership rather than a marriage).

Some years ago a young chap I worked with had just become a father and was asked if he and his girlfriend were going to get married, he baulked at the thought and said not for ages, they weren't ready for that. He was repeatedly unfaithful to his partner so I guess in his head he equated marriage with fidelity and not much else.

That's an interesting perspective..equating marriage with faithfulness. It would make sense why many don't..

I know very very few families where the parents aren’t married. Maybe less than ten percent of people I know. Perhaps it’s just where you live?

@ILoveAllRainbowsx

As you say not getting married before you have children is financially precarious for the person who gives up work to look after the children.

Also if people haven't made wills then unmarried partners might not receive anything

Also they might have to pay inheritance tax if they are not married

I don't know if people don't know the problems with not being married or if they don't care.

Yes it could simply be that they don't care much for it..

@5zeds

I know very very few families where the parents aren’t married. Maybe less than ten percent of people I know. Perhaps it’s just where you live?

Probably. I suppose I was speaking in terms of people in their 30s/40s (coming across my colleagues etc)

@Chocolateteabag

A lot of people don't get married because of the cost - at least of what they think a "Wedding" should cost. You can get married at the nearest registry office to have the legal bit done, but to most people in the UK, a "wedding" = big dress, flowers, bells & whistles. So they wait and save, babies then come and it gets pushed down the priority list.

The sad thing is that for many women, being married offers a lot of protection once you have children.

Such as?

As a man, because men get utterly shafted in divorces and the social convention that once pretty much obligated you to get married is now broken so why take the risk?

Lack of social stigma. I met my second husband's parents when I was pregnant and unmarried. He was 39 and they'd given up hope of grandchildren. The welcome I got was fantastic!

Fear of a permanent commitment.

Finances. A friend of mine did eventually marry her partner after 25 years but she's a lot richer than him, is quite pissed off with him and angry that she was persuaded into a situation where her assets are half his.

Seeing a relationship as a private romance and not wanting the pressures of family involved. I remember on my wedding day the aunt of my new husband informing me it was now my job to look after his health and make him eat salad, as if he wasn't a fully grown adult.

50.4% of the population are married- so that's most adults.

35% of people are not married

8% are divorced

6.4% widowed

0.2% are in civil partnerships

Don't personally see the need to get married in my case. Have been with my partner for more than a decade, we've happy, expecting our first child. I wouldn't change my name, and we both earn a similar amount - I wouldn't need anything from him if we split and neither would he from me. We plan to take 50/50 shared parental leave and to be equal partners in doing the parenting, so that neither of our careers will be impacted over the others.

It just doesn't add anything to me, and I don't want a big day. He would probably quite like a big day, I'd prefer the honeymoon without the wedding 😅

Having said that, we're financially secure, good earners, own our own hone, and have a will. In different circumstances it might be better to be married

I have a DD with dp and been together 8 years. Marriage is really not a priority for us, why would it be? I'd much rather spend money on great holidays or having a nice family home. We may get around to eloping but again, not a massive priority.

@NewUser123456789

As a man, because men get utterly shafted in divorces and the social convention that once pretty much obligated you to get married is now broken so why take the risk?

But also I know some women who have done badly from a divorce and are having to support lower earning husbands and give over a big chunk of their combined equity way in excess of 50%, and share their pensions. Tends to be the full time or higher earner this happens to, and a lot of women are filling this role now

I also think part ( not all but some part) is that financially a number of people would be better off not married. Especially to do with tax credits benefits etc.
Also weddings are very expensive and most people pay for their own these days without family help and tend it use that money for buying a house deposit instead.

@Curioushorse

50.4% of the population are married- so that's most adults.

35% of people are not married

8% are divorced

6.4% widowed

0.2% are in civil partnerships

Well thanks for the statistics. Like I said, I was speaking in terms of people I had come across..

@A1b2c3d4e5f6g7

Don't personally see the need to get married in my case. Have been with my partner for more than a decade, we've happy, expecting our first child. I wouldn't change my name, and we both earn a similar amount - I wouldn't need anything from him if we split and neither would he from me. We plan to take 50/50 shared parental leave and to be equal partners in doing the parenting, so that neither of our careers will be impacted over the others.

It just doesn't add anything to me, and I don't want a big day. He would probably quite like a big day, I'd prefer the honeymoon without the wedding 😅

Having said that, we're financially secure, good earners, own our own hone, and have a will. In different circumstances it might be better to be married

So are you saying that marriage is viewed as something that causes the husband and wife to be unequal?

@Bluesheep8

DP and I aren't married. Been together 26 years. Just never got round to it really. Plus I hate the idea of a big wedding.

You don't have to have a big wedding, you can just go to the registrar and have two witnesses.

I’m talking about couples who love together long term and have kids here - not couples who live together for a short time as a precursor to marriage / CP, to find out if they are compatible.

I’m also talking about MOST couples - where then women earns less than the man and the women is the one who takes family leave, goes PT and does the most unpaid labour . Im not talking about multi millionaire women married to bin men ( who are very rare in RL but apparently very common on MN).

Lots of men do it because it allows them to have many of the advantages of marriage without any of the ( to them ) disadvantages.

They can keep control of all their assets and walk away any time they like, without having to give their partner any share of what she has often contributed to ( like his career success, his mortgage , pensions and savings ).

Men like having a woman to do their domestic labour and their share of child care without having to commit financially and legally to her. It allows them to build their carers, earn more money and have more leisure time.

Women have been persuaded that if they live with a man and have his children , legal marriage will follow.

Some women believe that an engagement is binding in some way aka “put a ring on it”.

Commercialism and an increasingly secular society has persuaded women that a very expensive wedding party is essential and more important than legal protection for her and her children. So they decide to “ wait and do it properly”.

Once they have children m many men are reluctant to marry as they don’t see any benefit in it for them ( and they are right ).

Just my opinion.

Weirdly, all of my close friends who have DCs are married.

@IM0GEN

I’m talking about couples who love together long term and have kids here - not couples who live together for a short time as a precursor to marriage / CP, to find out if they are compatible.

I’m also talking about MOST couples - where then women earns less than the man and the women is the one who takes family leave, goes PT and does the most unpaid labour . Im not talking about multi millionaire women married to bin men ( who are very rare in RL but apparently very common on MN).

Lots of men do it because it allows them to have many of the advantages of marriage without any of the ( to them ) disadvantages.

They can keep control of all their assets and walk away any time they like, without having to give their partner any share of what she has often contributed to ( like his career success, his mortgage , pensions and savings ).

Men like having a woman to do their domestic labour and their share of child care without having to commit financially and legally to her. It allows them to build their carers, earn more money and have more leisure time.

Women have been persuaded that if they live with a man and have his children , legal marriage will follow.

Some women believe that an engagement is binding in some way aka “put a ring on it”.

Commercialism and an increasingly secular society has persuaded women that a very expensive wedding party is essential and more important than legal protection for her and her children. So they decide to “ wait and do it properly”.

Once they have children m many men are reluctant to marry as they don’t see any benefit in it for them ( and they are right ).

Just my opinion.

It's definitely a win-win for men but why would women keep putting up with it..

I forgot to add - many women are convinced that their partner will be an equal parent once they have children and therefore the financial, time, pension and career costs of parenthood will be shared.

Sadly most of them are disappointed. Many end up doing 90% of childcare, wife work and housework as well as working FT and they burn out quickly . Their partners complain that they are not getting enough attention / sex.

The men are then keen to say “ well quit your job / go PT if it’s too much for you”. This hurts their pride as they believe that they should be able to do everything ( that’s what they have been told ) and they feel inadequate. So they keep trying to do better.

Of course something has to give - often their mental health. Then they feel more guilty for being a burden. Many rely on pills for anxiety or depression to help them tolerate and intolerable situation.

( of course I’m talking in general . Of course this doesn't apply to all cohabiting couples . Many middle class, well paid couples are able to buy enough household help to make it feasible. Other rely on the unpaid labour of female relatives to make it work. ).

Not religious. In no rush. No kids. Very comfortable and secure without marriage. Might just go off and do it someday if we feel the need as neither of us want the fuss. We have a financial commitment together with the mortgage.

It's definitely a win-win for men but why would women keep putting up with it

Welcome to the patriarchy, western style. It looks different from the patriarchy elsewhere but it’s the same thing in different clothing. Designed by men for men to benefit men.

Women think that not getting married allows them to leave a bad relationship. But it’s not Marriage that traps them, it’s poverty and the huge costs of childcare.

It’s ok to leave if you have resources - family support , somewhere to live and money.

It’s almost impossible if you have shit insecure housing, no family support and depend on benefits. These women then get blamed for not leaving bad men. Understandably they lose their health or become addicted to substances that numb the pain. They are scared to ask for help in case they lose their kids. They feel trapped and helpless.

There is no public support for prosecuting violent and abusive men. Most get away Scott free.

The Uk is not good at making non resident parents pay for their kids. Many single mums are poor.

We don’t have good access to social housing.

We don’t have good services for children with special needs. Many mums of SN kids are trapped in poverty. They want to work but there’s no appropriate care for their children.

@BabyMoonPie

I assume it's because there is no longer a cultural stigma in living with a partner / having children outside marriage and a lot of people aren't religious so that doesn't influence them either like it would in the past

Exactly. They don't get married because they don't have to. Those who want to still do, of course.

OP you should come to where I live. Even fewer couples seem to be married and the reason is because where I am, unmarried couples have more or less the same rights as married ones, which is not the case in the UK.

"although as not everyone changes their name on marriage in some cases you don't know "

Many married people wear rings though. In my parents' time it was mainly women, but seems to be both men and women now.