Is there anywhere where women don't get pestered and harassed by men?

[FrangipaniDeLaSqueegeeMop]

I feel like in every single environment, public space, workplace etc theres men standing in the wings waiting to harass, peste and intimidate women. I'm nearly 40 and I remember dealing with this shit as a teenager and expecting it to get better - but it hasn't.

We know what it's like for women being harassed on the street and where that leads to - 2 out of 3 girls aged 14 to 21 have experienced harassment but I'm actually surprised it's not higher (it probably is in real life I don't know a single woman who's never experienced harassment) source: https://plan-uk.org/act-for-girls/street-harassment

My niece, who is 18, works at a fast food restaurant and was telling me yesterday that she has to deal with creeps on every single shift. Not just male colleagues invading her personal space, touching her back etc - but she has had to get her manager on more than one occasion to ask a drive thru customer to leave the premises because he won't drive away until she gave him her phone number. She's handed her notice in because the harassment has got so bad and is looking to do factory work where she doesn't have to deal with the public.

I am 20 years older than her and deal with it too even now. I have a game on my phone that I play thats a community based game - eg you can interact with others, swap items, go into each others 'worlds' etc. It's linked to my Facebook so a tiny version of my profile picture comes up next to my username, so people can see I'm female. I get about 15 messages from men a day ranging from explicit, which I report, to "hi lovely can we chat". I just want to play the fucking game without having to sift through creepy messages.

Where the fuck do men get off behaving like this? Who told them it was ok? The above are just 2 examples but it seems to be everywhere.

I feel like the onus is on all women to change too - change jobs, change our profile pictures, don't walk down certain streets, don't walk alone at night etc. No one ever talks about the onus being on all men

And yes NAMALT, but far too many are and it seems to be normalised, and maybe the "men who arent like that" should do their bit to help women and start calling out the men who are?

Honestly the only place I do not get harassed is where I train Brazilian juijitsu, I am seen as an equal and truly one of the lads

Everywhere else though, it's rife. I run daily and get beeped at, jeered and commented daily

At work I get compliments and non stop man splaining

Drives me mental, I can not even get into my car (I live rurally on a main road) without. Getting beeped at)

It is so depressing

Geographically i think it's the same wherever you go, I live in a nice village in rural cheshire- it's daily.

I went to London recently- it's was constant (including being followed)

@Letsallscreamatthesistene I didn't call women naive or silly. Please don't make things up

Oh gosh, I am now fat and must say that whilst the sexual harassment directed at me has mostly stopped. Men still like to point out how unattractive i am

But that IS harrasment!

I think there is some confusion on here about the definition of harassment.
Men look at me in the street, I’ve also been told I look lovely, that I have a beautiful smile etc. I wouldn’t call that harassment, but some women would. It isn’t sexual and it isn’t creepy and it’s done in a nice way. I don’t find it threatening.
If a man were to approach me and make a lewd comment, that would be different, but I can honestly say this doesn’t happen to me. I have been beeped at and had my personal space invaded etc and that is horrible - it’s usually designed to make you jump and/or feel uncomfortable. That’s harassment.

I wouldn’t call the experience the PP had in the optician’s harassment. She sounds slightly hysterical tbh, so no wonder the poor man was confused. He was just trying to do an eye test!

Harassment DOES happen, but I think sometimes some women are so busy looking for it that they take some things the wrong way.

You have also dismissed their observations regarding changes in harassment levels in response to aging or weight instead insisting that this has no bearing on how and why women are harassed

@korawick12345 erm, no I didn't. Again - please don't make things up

I used to get regular harrassment passing a grim pub when I lived in a city. (I couldn't avoid it - my bus from work stopped outside)

I regularly heard comments like 'I'd need a lot of drugs to shag her'. I was well over 60!

[quote FrangipaniDeLaSqueegeeMop]@Letsallscreamatthesistene I didn't call women naive or silly. Please don't make things up[/quote]
Its very much implied in what you write.

Body cams - what a great idea! Handed out free to any woman/girl who wants them. I'll vote for any party who offers that!

Really sad to hear the regularity of some of these experiences.

"I wouldn’t call the experience the PP had in the optician’s harassment. She sounds slightly hysterical tbh, so no wonder the poor man was confused. He was just trying to do an eye test!"

I did wonder if there was some back story there, but I think the issue is that the poster said she didn't want an eye test and he tried to impose it on her, which is not right obviously.

@FrangipaniDeLaSqueegeeMop

You have also dismissed their observations regarding changes in harassment levels in response to aging or weight instead insisting that this has no bearing on how and why women are harassed

@korawick12345 erm, no I didn't. Again - please don't make things up

Your post of 15.19 does exactly that IMO, if that was not what you intended to communicate with that post you may need to be clearer.

I don’t think it matters if it’s a daily occurrence or weekly/monthly/once in a blue moon. It shouldn’t be happening. Women and girls should be able to go about their business without getting harassed or assaulted/worrying they’re going to be harassed or assaulted imminently.

Fwiw I don’t really get much shit from men when out and about these days but my young teenage daughter does and that infuriates me more than when it has happened to me. The cycle keeps going and generation after generation of men and boys believe this behaviour to be acceptable.

"I’ve also been told I look lovely, that I have a beautiful smile etc. I wouldn’t call that harassment"

It depends how it's done, doesn't it?

@2LostSoulsSwimmingInAFishBowl

I don’t think it matters if it’s a daily occurrence or weekly/monthly/once in a blue moon. It shouldn’t be happening. Women and girls should be able to go about their business without getting harassed or assaulted/worrying they’re going to be harassed or assaulted imminently.

Fwiw I don’t really get much shit from men when out and about these days but my young teenage daughter does and that infuriates me more than when it has happened to me. The cycle keeps going and generation after generation of men and boys believe this behaviour to be acceptable.

I don’t think anyone would disagree with that. I don’t think anyone has suggested that men should be allowed to harass women.

@korawick12345 oh dear, you seem to have misunderstood me completely.

My point in saying "it's about power" is that men don't harass women because they genuinely think they have a chance at getting their number/getting a shag etc, it's about the power and enjoyment of upsetting them.

I mean I thought that was blatantly obvious and I don't know how you came to think that meant me saying "older and overweight women all get harassed"

Body cams - what a great idea! Handed out free to any woman/girl who wants them. I'll vote for any party who offers that!

It would be desperately sad if it has to come to this.

@Gwenhwyfar

"I’ve also been told I look lovely, that I have a beautiful smile etc. I wouldn’t call that harassment"

It depends how it's done, doesn't it?

See I would call that harrasment. And it's happened to me too.

I'm walking down the fucking street, going somewhere, and hat makes these men think it's a good time to say this?! It's beyond objectifying

Well I guess it isn't sexist if these men also tell other men about their lovely smile.

Or assume that another man doesn't know whether he had an eye test or not.

But yeah, hysterical, that misogynistic word used throughout history to denigrate women with genuine concerns.

[quote FrangipaniDeLaSqueegeeMop]@korawick12345 oh dear, you seem to have misunderstood me completely.

My point in saying "it's about power" is that men don't harass women because they genuinely think they have a chance at getting their number/getting a shag etc, it's about the power and enjoyment of upsetting them.

I mean I thought that was blatantly obvious and I don't know how you came to think that meant me saying "older and overweight women all get harassed"[/quote]
That’s not what your post said or implied but I am glad you have corrected yourself. I am sure you didn’t mean to dismiss so many women’s experiences.

@ilovesooty

It's not my experience. It happens occasionally but I don't find it's an everyday thing. I'm sorry to hear of your experience though.

I tend to get at least one man a week DMing me on Twitter asking me to fuck them, show them my feet or sell them my dirty pants.

It's constant.

@Megasausagehead

Well I guess it isn't sexist if these men also tell other men about their lovely smile.

Or assume that another man doesn't know whether he had an eye test or not.

But yeah, hysterical, that misogynistic word used throughout history to denigrate women with genuine concerns.

I regret using the word hysterical for that very reason! Sorry.

I meant that it seemed a rather extreme reaction. Why not just explain calmly and clearly that you’ve already had one, but if another test needed to be done then ok? I wonder whether she had genuine issues with proximity to a man.

I don’t think it’s objectifying at all. It’s a compliment and NOT the same as some of the genuinely degrading experiences on here.

Yes, it does depend on how it’s done, but in my experience it is usually quite charming and polite. I say ‘thank you’ and move on.

@korawick12345 i have no idea what you're going on about. What have I supposedly 'corrected myself' about? I clarified a point that YOU misunderstood. Again, that was pretty obvious and it's a really pathetic attempt to wrongfoot me. And I haven't dismissed anyone's experiences.

You say you don't k ow why I started this thread but why are you even posting?! My question was about spaces that are harassment free and you're on a rampage to talk about how many women allegedly experience no harassment. Why? What's your agenda? Are you a man or woman? Why are you so insistent on changing the narrative from women who experience sexual harassment to calling posters misogynists who simply said many women don't recognise harassment?

I was stopped by a lady yesterday who politely told me my dress was pretty and I looked beautiful, I did not feel harassed because she said it in a non threatening manner and was genuinely complimentary.

If a man complimented me in this way I do not think I would feel harassed

I meant that it seemed a rather extreme reaction. Why not just explain calmly and clearly that you’ve already had one, but if another test needed to be done then ok?

@BoPeeple I think what you've said is really unfair.

She DID say she didn't want another eye test and he insisted anyway against her will. Why should she just accept that? And eye tests involves an optician - in this case a man who made that poster feel very uncomfortable and disrespected her wishes - with their face being extremely close to your face at times. Can you maybe consider in that context how that reaction wasn't extreme at all but a HCP pushing personal boundaries with a patient?