DD wants to move in with her Dad. Very sad.

[Worried234]

Hi.

My DD is 12 and splits her time 50/50 with me and XH. We have tow other children who live with me full time, and go to XH at the weekends. The 50/50 was DDs choice and we started it in October.
Last night XH contacted me to say that DD wants to live with him full time.
I really don't want her to
I'm heartbroken. She is 12.
Has anyone any suggestions? I'd never drag it through court.
Her brothers are 15 and 8.
All children are XHs.

@Paddling654

If she moves out to return a day a week someone else will be mothering that child (and knowing what's going with them) most of the time. Probably the ex's partner who as nice as she might be, is not her mother. Not the one to show how tampons work, discuss Ucas forms at 2am, make tactful suggestions about friendships, shrewdly take the measure of a new boy and silently get tissues ready for the inevitable calamity. Someone else will be doing most of this. If I were the OP, I'd have enough faith in my role as a mother to be certain that needed to be me, because mothers are there for a reason.

The someone else doing these things will probably be her father. Or her mum who is ten minutes away and who she would still see regularly.

I know people who grew up with two dads, or with single dads. They all turned out fine.

@Paddling654

If she moves out to return a day a week someone else will be mothering that child (and knowing what's going with them) most of the time. Probably the ex's partner who as nice as she might be, is not her mother. Not the one to show how tampons work, discuss Ucas forms at 2am, make tactful suggestions about friendships, shrewdly take the measure of a new boy and silently get tissues ready for the inevitable calamity. Someone else will be doing most of this. If I were the OP, I'd have enough faith in my role as a mother to be certain that needed to be me, because mothers are there for a reason.

She’s not going to the far side of the moon! She’ll be ten minutes walk away, close enough to pop in any time she fancies.

@Paddling654

If she moves out to return a day a week someone else will be mothering that child (and knowing what's going with them) most of the time. Probably the ex's partner who as nice as she might be, is not her mother. Not the one to show how tampons work, discuss Ucas forms at 2am, make tactful suggestions about friendships, shrewdly take the measure of a new boy and silently get tissues ready for the inevitable calamity. Someone else will be doing most of this. If I were the OP, I'd have enough faith in my role as a mother to be certain that needed to be me, because mothers are there for a reason.

What a load of shite

My ex did this to his Mum when he was a similar age. It was because his Dad had a better sky TV package so absolutely nothing to do with caring about his Dad more than Mum. Could it be something as silly as that?

I’d be heartbroken in your position OP. You need to take her out for a while and have a chat with her.

@Paddling654

If she moves out to return a day a week someone else will be mothering that child (and knowing what's going with them) most of the time. Probably the ex's partner who as nice as she might be, is not her mother. Not the one to show how tampons work, discuss Ucas forms at 2am, make tactful suggestions about friendships, shrewdly take the measure of a new boy and silently get tissues ready for the inevitable calamity. Someone else will be doing most of this. If I were the OP, I'd have enough faith in my role as a mother to be certain that needed to be me, because mothers are there for a reason.

I get the sentiment but this girl already lives for a whole month at her dads before returning to her mums for the next month. There is every chance any of these things could already be happening there? Also, the same could be said about the 2 boys who live with their mum the majority of the time.....they need their dad to show them how to shave, talk to them about girls etc etc. It's nonsense.

I'm sure DD doesn't not see the other parent for the whole month she's staying elsewhere either, she must pop over and spend time at her other house?

FWIW I understand OP's upset and at 12 I'd be speaking to her to see what could change so she would still be spending time with both parents before agreeing to this move, but I don't think that she'd be worse off living with her dad.

Just think at that age it's best to still have a lot of contact with both parents, but obviously in the end it's best to let her try it out than ban it and have her resent you.

@Youdiditanyway

My ex did this to his Mum when he was a similar age. It was because his Dad had a better sky TV package so absolutely nothing to do with caring about his Dad more than Mum. Could it be something as silly as that?

I’d be heartbroken in your position OP. You need to take her out for a while and have a chat with her.

I also wondered if it might be that sort of thing.

Better room/more bathrooms?

Could be anything!

@Paddling654 I could not agree with you more.

I also disagree with the popular opinion on here that the OP should by no account show she's upset, or that her DD needs to consider what she wants in any way. Parents are allowed to have feelings and children sometimes have to face that their decisions are upsetting for other people. That's how they grow up to be considerate human beings.

[quote RadandMad]@Paddling654 I could not agree with you more.

I also disagree with the popular opinion on here that the OP should by no account show she's upset, or that her DD needs to consider what she wants in any way. Parents are allowed to have feelings and children sometimes have to face that their decisions are upsetting for other people. That's how they grow up to be considerate human beings.[/quote]
Do you really think that a child should be made to feel guilty for living with one parent though?

It's hard for children with separated parents and I think it's good that DD feels secure enough in her parental relationships to suggest this, even if it doesn't end up happening.

Would you feel the same way if DD was saying she'd prefer to live full-time with her mum and it was her dad telling her he didn't want her to and that he'd be sad if she made that choice? I think that would be seen as quite manipulative and unfair.

Again, I think it's fine for mum and dad to talk about it privately and agree to turn down this request, so not saying DD should necessarily have total control here at only 12. But if it's a no, it should be a no and not a guilt trip.

@Bibidy I think there's a huge difference between a guilt trip and having a normal reaction to something that's deeply hurtful. I do not think that a mother or father being honest about their feelings is the same as saying to their DD 'you're a bad person for doing this'. I think there's something slightly creepy and disorienting when adults pretend they're feeling the exact opposite of what they are really feeling. Kids know it's inauthentic, and it just confuses them. I think it's perfectly acceptable for a mother in OPs position to simply state that she feels upset about it, but that she won't stand in her daughter's way - if that's the decision she comes to.

Would you feel the same way if DD was saying she'd prefer to live full-time with her mum and it was her dad telling her he didn't want her to and that he'd be sad if she made that choice? I think that would be seen as quite manipulative and unfair.

@Bibidy Yes, I would. There would be nothing wrong with the dad saying he felt a bit upset about it. There's a kind of double-think going on here - people are arguing that DD is old enough to make her own decisions, but somehow not old enough to accept that other people might find them upsetting.

@RadandMad

See I just think that kids need to feel able to grow up and away from their parents without their parents making them feel bad about it. Decisions should be made based primarily on their welfare, not on the adults' potential for hurt feelings. I do agree it would be fine for OP to say "I'd prefer if you didn't and I'll miss you, but it's up to you" but don't think it should be more than that

That said though, in OP's shoes, I would speak to ex and agree to say no to this request at this moment in time, but look at switching up the month-on, month-off thing so she could have more/more frequent time at her dad's.

12 is still very young and I think completely cutting one parent out of your daily life is not ideal, when there is another option available. At the very least, she needs a set routine of time she spends with each parent, even if it does move to more in favour of her dad. A 12yo's time with her parents shouldn't depend on her choosing when she wants to drop round.

@Bibidy Again, there's a massive difference between being honest about your feelings and deliberately 'making someone feel bad' about something. If the OP pretended she was totally okay about it - as several people on this thread have said she should do, cheerfully, with a smile on her face - it's not hard to imagine how that might effect DD ten years down the line. There's no way that kid would be better off thinking her mother had no negative feelings about her decision.

But I do agree with your solution. Sometimes I think parents should take a longer view, and foresee the potential for damage/guilt further down the line.

[quote RadandMad]@Bibidy Again, there's a massive difference between being honest about your feelings and deliberately 'making someone feel bad' about something. If the OP pretended she was totally okay about it - as several people on this thread have said she should do, cheerfully, with a smile on her face - it's not hard to imagine how that might effect DD ten years down the line. There's no way that kid would be better off thinking her mother had no negative feelings about her decision.

But I do agree with your solution. Sometimes I think parents should take a longer view, and foresee the potential for damage/guilt further down the line.[/quote]
Yeah, tbf I do agree that it's best if DD knows her mum cares about her moving out, on second thoughts.

I guess I am just conscious that there is likely a lot of guilt for children from separated families already because they might worry about not being with one parent for Christmas, not seeing the other on their birthday etc etc. It's not their fault that they always have to be with one and not the other, so I feel like they shouldn't be having to not do what they want to do for fear of making their parent upset. Most children don't have to deal with that until they are much older, and certainly not in a mum vs dad scenario.

But yes, do think it's important that DD knows her mum is not delighted to see the back of her!!

Today 09:38Paddling654
If she moves out to return a day a week someone else will be mothering that child (and knowing what's going with them) most of the time. Probably the ex's partner who as nice as she might be, is not her mother. Not the one to show how tampons work, discuss Ucas forms at 2am, make tactful suggestions about friendships, shrewdly take the measure of a new boy and silently get tissues ready for the inevitable calamity. Someone else will be doing most of this. If I were the OP, I'd have enough faith in my role as a mother to be certain that needed to be me, because mothers are there for a reason

As a stepmum whose 2 DSS lived with us full time, I was absolutely there for 2am UCAS conversations, parents evenings, going round universities with DSS2, talking for hours about girls and life, and taking care of their washing, food and general requirements. All of this at their preference, DSS2 in particular valued my input as his parents hadn't ever completed UCAS forms or even considered uni. Their mum saw them once a month when they were older teens (and not at all before that) so the situation is slightly different, but I take exception to the suggestion that stepmums don't care. Most of us do.

Good plan to all sit down and talk about it. Be sure to leave enough space for DD to actually talk about why she wants to move. FWIW I’m another who thinks a month at a time isn’t a sensible choice. As soon as she feels settled it’s time to move again!! No wonder she wants a proper base to call home. My DCs objected to going to their dads one night a week due to having to remember their stuff, PE kit, iPads etc and they always left something behind. They’ve been a lot happier since he’s moved further away. Obvs they miss him and keep in touch several times a week, but they are settled at home and only go to stay with him a couple of times a year. Doesn’t mean they love him any less, they just like being at home.

I think it’s only fair that if she moves out that your DS gets the room he wants. If he’s there most of the time and she’s not then he should get the better room. But maybe wait a little while until you’re sure she’s ok with the move. I’d make that part of the convo though - she doesn’t get to call all the shots, the other DCs are important in this decision too.

@Paddling654

If she moves out to return a day a week someone else will be mothering that child (and knowing what's going with them) most of the time. Probably the ex's partner who as nice as she might be, is not her mother. Not the one to show how tampons work, discuss Ucas forms at 2am, make tactful suggestions about friendships, shrewdly take the measure of a new boy and silently get tissues ready for the inevitable calamity. Someone else will be doing most of this. If I were the OP, I'd have enough faith in my role as a mother to be certain that needed to be me, because mothers are there for a reason.

My mother didn't show me how tampons work 🤷🏽‍♀️, she wasn't some sort of 'confidante' and I'm very close with my mother, I just didn't want to share every aspect of my life with her. Not everyone remains attached at the cord-- relies heavily on their mothers.

Well that strike through published differently to how it was typed! My emphasis is that not every has, wants, or needs that deep relationship with their mother that you describe, I much preferred to discuss most of those things with my friends.

20VienneseWhirligig

I'm not for a second suggesting you don't care or that you wouldn't have a significant role to play. But if it was my DD, you wouldn't be doing those things because you're not her mum.

I moved in with my Dad when I was 12. Ours was a sticky situation though.
My Mum moved us Scotland, my Dad lived in England.

I told my Dad I wanted to live with him, he came to collect me without the knowledge of my Mum. Once we hit the English boarder my Dad hired me a lawyer. It didn't even get finalised in court, they said I was old enough to decide.

@Paddling654

20VienneseWhirligig

I'm not for a second suggesting you don't care or that you wouldn't have a significant role to play. But if it was my DD, you wouldn't be doing those things because you're not her mum.

Mums aren't the only ones who can do those things.

overtherainbo take it your relationship with your mum didnt recover after that

If your dd is like my dd, she knows her own mind and has done forever! At the age of your dd, my dd's wishes would have been taken very very seriously. I wouldn't want her to go, I would make sure she knew that I would miss her hugely, and that I was sorry she felt like that, but that if that was what she wanted.... I would also repeat and repeat and repeat that there will always always be room for her wherever I was.

@Paddling654

20VienneseWhirligig

I'm not for a second suggesting you don't care or that you wouldn't have a significant role to play. But if it was my DD, you wouldn't be doing those things because you're not her mum.

That sounds incredibly possessive. Surely you want the best for your child, and if that’s having even more people around her who could support and care for her, that’s no bad thing?

Often when a child visits the ‘other’ parent the visit or stay over is made as nice as possible because that parent/family want to make the most of seeing that child so they might do special things or have nice treats etc.

I don’t mean spoiling the child just the general wanting to have a nice time with their child and making sure the child is happy.

If the child goes go live there on a permanent basic then it’s entirely possible that things will be not unalike as they were back home, a set routine and a more mundane type of life.

Personally if you are on good terms with the father and his partner I would allow a trial run making it clear that she can come back anytime.

I also think it’s important that the father and stepmother are on the same page as you and you all agree basic rules about age appropriate things, internet time/social media etc.

I think a month at w time at either home is too long. A month back with you and she might feel the same about staying at yours. I'd ask to switch to weekly change arounds for a bit and see how she feels about that.