My childhood bully is a professional counsellor!!

[Missusblusky1]

Kind of lighthearted I guess, but I’ve just discovered through the world of Facebook that my secondary school bully who threatened to kill me for no reason is now an established counsellor / psychotherapist…. Probably the last person I would have thought who would ever help anybody!

I remember going on a trip abroad with our school and she threatened to kill me whilst out there, the teachers didn’t take it seriously and it was a horrendous experience! She was a bitchy gossip who constantly belittled others for no reason other than for entertainment. And now I see she does all sort of work for charity too. Probably the most vile human being I’ve ever met. Hope no one goes to her for help!!!!

Why are so many messed up people counsellors?! I know several who have so many skeletons in the closet and are not the people they portray Either that or they have had mental trauma themselves sand are udd St img if is an outlet. Better than that though there was an odeous bloke st college studying Theology Nasty bully who played tit tennis in the SU bar. Odeous, Bearded creep. Now a vicar!

When I was training as a counsellor, I was struck by how many people on the course had really serious problems. Including me, I suppose, although it's always easier to identify other people's issues than your own. One woman was asked to leave because she was a religious fanatic and totally lacking in empathy and another, a large and outspoken German lady, spoke forcefully about her desire to machine-gun her neighbours and their children. Even the tutor was lost for words. All in all, it was an unusual group of people.

I would be aghast if I had met my school bully in any professional capacity. Yes, Hazel, I'm looking at you...

@Slipperrr

But the other kind came from nice homes and were spoilt

How do you know? Do people in Nice homes who appear spoilt never have hardships growing up?

Because before they started bullying me they were “friends” and neighbours and I had been to their homes. They always had the latest gadgets and fashionable clothes, and their parents were pretty materialistic whereas they knew I was poor and used that as further ammunition. My own upbringing wasn’t always a barrel of laughs, there was constant arguments that tipped over into violence many times, it doesn’t turn everyone into a bully though, but I saw a lot of correlation between being spoilt and bullying, maybe to compensate for emotional neglect.

To be fair the OP said that she was a Counsellor/Therapist. That is not the same as a Psychotherapist and requires no therapy!

Counsellor, therapist and psychotherapist are used interchangeably by registering bodies - there’s no protected title or qualification requirement for any of those titles and so no requirement for therapy.

In saying that, all of the reputable courses I know of do have a significant therapy requirement as part of the qualification, regardless of whether they consider themselves to be training counsellors or psychotherapist.

So what other childhood/ teenage fuckwittery is absolutely unforgivable and a sign that you will be evil for the rest of your life?

I don’t think it’s impossible to change directions as a person ..

I think she might have empathy with things like , school bullies or abusers.

But I wouldn’t seek her counselling if I was a victim in a situation and yeh it’s worrying..

Some people do change and those attracted to counselling often are motivated by having issues in their own lives. To actually be employed as a counsellor is very different to qualifying as one. It is almost impossible to actually get a job - I remember our experienced counsellor of many years lost her funding. She applied to the local university and there were over 300 applications. It seems to be something lots of people go into for whatever reason but at best many remain volunteers for reputable charities. A few may get bits of funding, and these will be the ones with a track record, to work within a specific project, children's service. All funding limited.

@HeyGirlHeyBoy

That's good to know Annie Snap from someone really in the know!

The OP did mention psychotherapist in her first post.

Oops! Sorry, you’re quite right! Nevertheless, it was a bit non-specific. It’s only Psychodynamic Psychotherapists that are required to have their own therapy.

@Jellycatspyjamas

To be fair the OP said that she was a Counsellor/Therapist. That is not the same as a Psychotherapist and requires no therapy!

Counsellor, therapist and psychotherapist are used interchangeably by registering bodies - there’s no protected title or qualification requirement for any of those titles and so no requirement for therapy.

In saying that, all of the reputable courses I know of do have a significant therapy requirement as part of the qualification, regardless of whether they consider themselves to be training counsellors or psychotherapist.

They may be used interchangeably in some quarters, but they are not the same thing. As for the requirements for therapy (real therapy, not a little spot of Counselling) the UK, that requirement only applies to Psychodynamic Psychotherapists.

Actually what I meant to say is

I DO think you can change directions as a person. But yeh it’s hard to trust that she is in a position to deal with vulnerable individuals if she had bullied you..

But I guess we can’t judge people based on what they did in the teens . Empathy completes for some people by age 24. She must’ve had things going on in the background.

An awful school mum (thankfully at another school now) is now some sort of therapist. You may as well burn fivers than give her money to fix your problems.

There have actually been quite a number of threads on here over the past few years of horrible bullying women becoming counsellors!It's quite scary - as if they want to 'pay back'. But it's of course another way of control.

There was an awful mum at my DCs junior school who literally took over the PTA. She was great at rallying round for funds but very obnoxious and dividing, especially on social media, dissing this and that child, which I found abhorrent.

She eventually became a counsellor for teens with mental health problems 😱 And then swiftly moved to the US when her DH got a highly paid job there. The way the social dynamics fell apart and reformed after she left was seismic. I really started to think then that a lot of people had seriously weak moral compasses!

I'm glad to say now that they've split up and she's gone completely mental...

I've just been looking at the research and I now think bullies can change but they need early intervention.

Bullies have traits such as a lack of empathy, remorse, and guilt. There is some research to suggest these antisocial behaviours are 80% inherited - so it's mostly not due to upbringing but how they were born (Stephen Scott - British Psychiatrist).

Early intervention with high levels of parental training and involvement is vital with a huge focus on developing empathy.

I don't thing most bullies get the help they need.

Bully wasnt a child she was old enough to get married, go to war, get drunk. Evil spiteful dangerous bully and 18 not a kid

That might explain why the therapist I went to, has zero empathy and literally scolded my one year old boy as a way to passive aggressively usher us out of the room.

Apparently she was trying to teach me that I must manage my emotions better. Yet she told my one year old (who she told me to bring), that she doesn’t want him in the room anymore and literally barked at him. Because he poked a plant in the room.

They may be used interchangeably in some quarters, but they are not the same thing. As for the requirements for therapy (real therapy, not a little spot of Counselling) the UK, that requirement only applies to Psychodynamic Psychotherapists.

Given that neither counsellor or psychotherapist is a protected title, it’s literally up to training organisations to decide what, if any, personal therapy someone does as part of their training. Registering bodies decide criteria to register with them, but you can practice perfectly legally without being registered - someone could call themselves a psychotherapist (of any modality) after 5 years of training and 200 hours of therapy, or a one year diploma with 10 hours therapy. There’s literally nothing to stop them.

A reputable therapist will have had extensive therapy and it’s certainly something I’d ask about if I was looking for a therapist.

In terms of the OP, there’s no way of knowing whether she’s undertaken any therapy as part of her training, which might challenge her or bring about change.

@Jellycatspyjamas

They may be used interchangeably in some quarters, but they are not the same thing. As for the requirements for therapy (real therapy, not a little spot of Counselling) the UK, that requirement only applies to Psychodynamic Psychotherapists.

Given that neither counsellor or psychotherapist is a protected title, it’s literally up to training organisations to decide what, if any, personal therapy someone does as part of their training. Registering bodies decide criteria to register with them, but you can practice perfectly legally without being registered - someone could call themselves a psychotherapist (of any modality) after 5 years of training and 200 hours of therapy, or a one year diploma with 10 hours therapy. There’s literally nothing to stop them.

A reputable therapist will have had extensive therapy and it’s certainly something I’d ask about if I was looking for a therapist.

In terms of the OP, there’s no way of knowing whether she’s undertaken any therapy as part of her training, which might challenge her or bring about change.

I agree that a reputable therapist would do that. My point is only that Psychodynamic Psychotherapy requires it, whilst other therapy and counselling training does not.

My daughter is a highly qualified psychotherapist, she met her boyfriend whilst doing her psychotherapy degree. He was doing the same degree. They both qualified together. Cut a long story short he gas lighted her and turned her into a nervous wreck. Thank God she had a good supervisor who saw what was going on and advised her to get out of the relationship. We found out later that he had done the same to two previous girlfriends. Hes still a psychotherapist.......God help his clients.

I would hope that it's because she has changed and wants to make amends, but we never can tell.

A member of my extended family is a highly regarded therapist. Also supervises other therapists. She is the most controlling and manipulative person I've ever met. All three of her now adult children have mental health issues. One of them moved abroad as soon as she could to get away from her.

After my divorce I was chatting to her at a family do. The first thing she said to me was that she never liked my ex and always thought I had made a huge mistake in marrying him. What a lovely thing to say to a grieving person still recovering from trauma.

So.... there might be something in people's suspicions that the profession may well attract a bully.

@DeepThinkingGirl

Actually what I meant to say is

I DO think you can change directions as a person. But yeh it’s hard to trust that she is in a position to deal with vulnerable individuals if she had bullied you..

But I guess we can’t judge people based on what they did in the teens . Empathy completes for some people by age 24. She must’ve had things going on in the background.

Well if we are going to judge people then surely judging them on what we know about them is normal? How else would we judge them.

As a qualified professional counsellor myself, I had a client in her twenties who absolutely despised herself for things she had done to others when she was young. Without going into too many details, one of her victims had been hospitalized. She genuinely wanted to track down and make a heartfelt apology to this person. Having been bullied myself, I was well aware of the potential to re-traumatise and we looked at who would gain what from her doing this. She was already working in a care environment, and wanted to become a counsellor. All I can say is that by the end of our time together, I truly believed that she could do so, and indeed be very good at it.

Counsellors are often referred to as "wounded healers" and while she was not bullied by her peers, she had become a self-loathing bully in response to her upbringing. Not to excuse what she did, or what was done to you, but you almost certainly do not have the full picture.

I was reading the stuff about Chrissy Teigen and things she had said on social media, and been reminded of my own bullies - there were several different groups. One girl has since apologised to me, and I'd go so far as to say we are loose 'friends', but I could not bring myself to attend her wedding when invited, knowing that some of the rest of her group, and one girl who had physically attacked me, would be there. I just felt that it was a step too close to making it all okay for them, when in truth it never was and never will be okay by me. 40 years later, I recently had a nightmare about one incident.

I totally understand why someone's victim and anyone who knew the 'old' version would be sceptical, but truly believe that sometimes having been to "the dark side" and seen what you are capable of in those moments, enables you to better manage your responses later in life. That fear of yourself somehow keeps you in check. If she can help someone else manage their baggage/emotions better than she did at that time, then she earns the right to forgive herself, even if others find it hard.

I'm sorry for what she put you through, but if she is a BACP accredited counsellor, then she will have had a lot of therapy of her own, and had regular feedback throughout her training to help her identify any residual potential for manipulative/bullying behaviour. It's not 100% failsafe, but she will have spent a great deal of money to achieve the position, and had to face up to her past behaviour. It doesn't help you, but she may be able to help others, and as a changed person, I know for a fact that she also lives with what she did every single day.

Just another observation from reading comments, it is not for a counsellor to 'fix' people or advise them. The aim is to help people understand what is going on for them in terms of thought/behaviour patterns and how they relate to others. In essence it's about helping someone learn to receive the World/events and process it based solely on the here and now/experience of that person, without allowing any unrelated "baggage" to take over. To give a considered response rather than a heartfelt reaction. Only the client decides the 'fix' based on what they want to change.

I think some of these replies are a bit unfair. The school bully I experienced picked on me because I have a disability and looked different. She said and did some vile things but she looked me up years later and asked to meet up so she could explain and apologise properly. We talked things over and during the conversation I found out that she was being physically abused by a family member throughout our schooldays - she didn’t offer it up as an excuse for what she did, but IMO it was a contributing factor.

Surely it’s good to be able to change and grow as a human being. After being battered about by life, I don’t believe any of us end up the same person we were when we were younger and if you’ve not been a particularly nice person at some stage and you want to make up for it, then probably one of the best ways to ‘atone’ is to enter a profession where you can help others.

Anniesnap if you've never met a clinical psychologist who is a narc bully then you have led a charmed work career!

There was a very sad thread on the relationship board years ago that was taken down from a woman who was being horribly gaslit and emotionally abused by her clin psy husband. This husband also constantly derided his female colleagues to her, calling them "the flappy skirt brigade". I remember how trapped she felt with this man who outwardly was Mr Helper. I hope she got away. Not that I have any proof this was a real story and maybe it is impossible that a clin psy (who have no personal therapy as part of their training) could be a narc bully?

IME all caring professions have their quota of people who are doing it for the wrong reasons, and they are often the ones who climb to senior levels or fame, but the majority are caring and professional. The poster who says they would never trust a therapist and use only self help and youtube - those people presumably do work in the professions so it can't be all bad?