The ‘phenomenon’ of younger men approaching older women in the street. Is this an organised scam and what do they want?

[azar]

I am 47 years old, married with 4 DC. In recent weeks (this is on Fulham Road), I’ve been approached on two separate occasions by two men who are both maybe early 30s and both have the same kind of “patter” (if you can call it that). There was also another one this morning, who I didn’t engage with at all because I suspected the same thing. They ask you “Excuse me, do you live round here?” So you stop because you think they need directions, etc. At this point, they tell you they have just moved to the area from another (nearby) part of London and they ask you again if you are local. They are British with British accents. They say something about how they want to meet people and would you like to go for coffee / lunch with them there and then . They are reasonably good-looking men by average standards and would not strike you as odd if you walked past them in the street. A similar thing has also happened to a friend last week.

I’m sure this is some kind of scam, but I wonder what it is they actually want? Are they just trying to get a free lunch? Are they expecting you to take them to your home and then they will rob you or worse? (They are very interested in whether you are local). What do they actually think is going to happen and why would they think an older woman would be interested in someone their age?

Has anyone else experienced this?

If it's a class, there will be a group of them filming

Is it legal to film someone without her consent?

I really think this is worth reporting if they're being persistent. And as JackieWeaver reminds tone deaf in the current climate. This is the sort of thing which helps build up a useful picture for police.

What's a PUA?

X post thanks FGS

I think they are probably scammers or escorts trying to finesse older women into parting with their cash.

PUA = pick up artist

Empress that's fab and we should absolutely all do it

You do sound as though you were a bit too polite OP but next time you will know to tell them to fuck off to to leave you alone straight away.

My guess would be a money scam of some sort.

Is it legal to film someone without her consent?

I don't think Pick Up Artists are too bothered about consent, on the whole.

When they ask what you do:

"I'm a super recogniser for the met. There's no way I could forget your handsome face." (Say nothing further and stare unnervingly at them until they bugger off).

How unsettling Op, thanks for sharing, I'm not in London but will still bear in mind. My response would probably be 'Move away from me!' With a very hard stare.

There's probably a thread on Reddit saying 'be nice to the wimmin'

I know others have mentioned it already but I instantly thought PUA (pick up artist) training too.

For people fortunate enough to have not encountered this:- it's all over reddit amongst other places. They have this backward caveman idea about how "real men" should be - assertive/pushy, arrogant, and definitely IN CHARGE. Women are there to service them and need to basically be handled like domestic animals... or "pumped and dumped" to coin one oft-used charming phrase.
Actual love and connection are disparaged as "one-itis", and should be overcome as quickly as possible.

They take groups of themselves out with the aim of overcoming their fear of failure/approach by basically approaching any/all women they see and being persistent for as long as possible (or until police are called).

Many of them think it's a numbers game and you just need to keep making that play over and over again. Others just want to do it so repeatedly that they no longer feel nervous about it - hoping this translates into approaching in other situations.

Look up "red pill" or "PUA" on reddit if you want to read more about it, but it will open your eyes to a whole new hideous "masculinity" (or rather an old one repackaged) - where manipulation and abuse are taught openly as the 'proper' ways to conduct a relationship.

If you want to take it a level darker, there's MGTOW ("men going their own way" - by complaining continuously about women), and incels (involuntary celibates). These are all self-labels, and there are multiple groups out there.

I had this with a man in the street (handsome, well dressed in
a Suit etc) asking can he take me to lunch after asking directions, when I said no sorry I have an appointment, he then said “please can you give me ten pounds as I haven’t got any money”. The daft thing is (out of shock) I did but he’d obviously expected me to say yes and then do the “I forgot my wallet” spiel

@hoodathunkit

women should learn PUA techniques so as to be able to spot them IMO

Seriously wish these blokes would come to Hull and try it on some random woman here... :)

I encountered something like this while walking along Oxford St after being out. The man looked harmless but honestly I just got the vibe he was sussing out if I was drunk, while trying to walk beside me and making it look like we were friends before doing something really horrible. He would not leaving me alone-I had to run in the end, was shit. In your case It is ether a romance scam, or they want to rob your house, it would be easy to if they locate it while you are still out-esp if you look like you have money or one of those saddo pick up artists. I think we would all be saddened at how many people actually fall for this stuff.

Thanks for all this. To be honest, I hadn’t thought about PUAs. I did see a programme in it once a while ago but I’d forgotten about it. There was a bald man who thought he was god’s gift and I think he’s written books about how he could make women do anything. He was training other men and sending them out in the streets to refine their techniques. They were doing it on Oxford Street, if I remember. Just approaching women of all ages and trying to gets dates, phone numbers or whatever. They had paid a lot for this “training.”

My friend also experienced something similar locally and was later annoyed with herself for engaging at all. This one kept asking her if she lived locally too. It sounds stupid, but they are hard to shake off and they walk with you so you don’t know which way to go to get rid. All we could think of was they were hoping to be invited back to our houses (as if) and then god only knows. The streets are getting weirder and weirder, that’s all I can say.,

I once lived in an area where there was some sort of PUA guy who ran courses and they’d go out in groups to practice what they’d learned, seeing how many phone numbers they could get in one session. They’d sometimes have a mate filming at a distance and they’d post their successes on YouTube to advertise the courses

PUA was my immediate first thought.

Interesting - I haven't had this (mainly because I've hardly left the house the past year!) but what I have had recently is random Facebook requests from goodlooking men of about my age, which I suspect to be a scam of some sorts too. I get a couple a week.

I tend to keep my FB to actual friends and people I know in real life that I'd like to stay in touch with, so the invite gets zapped straight away, particularly as I don't appear to have any friends in common with them. I'm also a member of a few FB groups so I suspect I'm being targetted via the membership of one of those.

@MarinPrime

My London Suspicion Filter is now so highly tuned that I'd deny living in the area even if the person asking had just knocked on my front door

I always lie when someone knocks on the door and asks if I'm the owner. I tell them I'm the dog sitter or the cleaner.
Probably just double glazing salesmen but you never know.

I lie too, I'm either a visitor, a friend, cleaner, side, or if they want to fix my drive, new windows/doors then its rented mate. You need to ask the landlord. I've not had a PUA but then ive a really good resting bitch face.

@azar

Thanks for all this. To be honest, I hadn’t thought about PUAs. I did see a programme in it once a while ago but I’d forgotten about it. There was a bald man who thought he was god’s gift and I think he’s written books about how he could make women do anything. He was training other men and sending them out in the streets to refine their techniques. They were doing it on Oxford Street, if I remember. Just approaching women of all ages and trying to gets dates, phone numbers or whatever. They had paid a lot for this “training.”

My friend also experienced something similar locally and was later annoyed with herself for engaging at all. This one kept asking her if she lived locally too. It sounds stupid, but they are hard to shake off and they walk with you so you don’t know which way to go to get rid. All we could think of was they were hoping to be invited back to our houses (as if) and then god only knows. The streets are getting weirder and weirder, that’s all I can say.,

I once did a self defense course and the trainer said women are usually too scared of making a fuss in public; that's what these people prey on. He recommended that, as soon as someone approaches you, put your hands up in front of you and loudly say "GET AWAY FROM ME! LEAVE ME ALONE!". Most predators want easy, quiet prey, if you start turning heads then they'll slope off. We spent an hour of the course screaming at each other to practice, it was harder than you'd expect, the conditioning runs deep.

Another woman posted about this same issue some time ago when some random young guy tried to befriend her.
Definitely sounds dodgy and most likely aimed at trying to reel in older women with the intention of getting them to part with their money!

I live reasonably close to you OP and I’ve never experienced this. I’ll keep an eye out for it. I’d find it very hard to tell anyone to fuck off though. I might try Empress’s line.
Might go and hang around the corner of Beaufort St this weekend and see if I can spot any of these guys. Don’t have many other plans at the moment. Perhaps I could practice my assertive skills by telling people to Fuck Off. Just as long as I don’t get barred from M&S 🤭

Yet another thing to watch out for.

I guess if this is now a thing in “desirable” Fulham now it will spread to other areas.

Over 2 years ago, so when places were open, I was crossing a road and the man walking past me in the opposite direction, said 'Oh a woman, do you want to go for a coffee' He looked about 60s, I was so shocked I ignored him. And this was in Lewisham High Street, in broad daylight.