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Original poster

Death Penalty?

204 replies

Ifailed · 27/12/2020 09:52

Just seen a post on FB suggesting Priti Patel has asked for a paper on the restoration of the death penalty, now we have left the EU. Of course it could be completely false, but if true would you support the idea?

I wouldn't, simply because we know that innocent people in the past have been killed.

OP posts:
CharityEscapeGoat · 27/12/2020 10:17

Seems unlikely. Lots of countries still have the death penalty, & high crime rates. The USA for example. It's not an effective deterrent. Plus, of course, there's the risk of wrongful sentencing being carried out, as in the case of Timothy Evans.

Giggorata · 27/12/2020 10:17

No. It is barbaric.

Original poster
Ifailed · 27/12/2020 10:19

Even if we left Council of Europe, we're not leaving the UN

Both China and the USA have permanent seats on the UN's Security Council, doesn't stop them killing prisoners.

OP posts:
Neveranynamesleft · 27/12/2020 10:19

But do we live in a civilised society - a stage of social and cultural development considered to be more advanced ?

What is the real meaning of 'justice' ?
Along with the death penalty debate you may as well throw in the ' let the punishment fit the crime ' argument.
I want my children and grandchildren etc to grow up in a safe society. The world today saddens me.

Aahotep · 27/12/2020 10:21

Could never, ever support this. Absolutely not. It's barbaric and I don't believe it's ever justified.
Prison needs reform, decent funding and better sentencing guidelines.
Locking people up in a cell for 23 hours a day is not rehabilitation in my view. Prisons need highly trained, professional officers and access to education and training. Also psychological therapy should be available for those who need it.
Also less inequality and poverty in society as a whole.

motorcyclenumptiness · 27/12/2020 10:21

it cant make binding laws
Does anyone in the UK (Bozo and Patel included) have even the vaguest understanding of how international law works??

donquixotedelamancha · 27/12/2020 10:22

If I was pushed, I would have to admit I would vote for it, but for 1000% sure guilty murder cases.

I would bring back the death penalty for those who assign a percentage greater than 100% in scenarios where 100% represents a probability of 1.

In all other scenarios I'm 110% against it.

SebastianTheCrab · 27/12/2020 10:24

What a jolly (stupid) thread.

We're still signed up the European Human Rights Act which exists separately from the EU - no chance it could be reintroduced while we're signed up to that.

Personally I'm for it in limited circumstances where there is irrefutable evidence (eg video/ multiple witnesses etc). I don't know why a murderer gets to choose who live and dies but they get the benefit of human rights. Their victims didn't.

ivfbeenbusy · 27/12/2020 10:25

Yes absolutely for peadophiles, rapists, mass murderers like serial killers and terrorists.

Prison is too good for them

Hazelnutlatteplease · 27/12/2020 10:25

I'd vote for it.

The opportunities for miscarriages of justice are far more limited with the advent of DNA evidence.

We know for those who kill or rape they do not stop unless they are prevented from doing so. Rehabilitation is not a realistic option.

No I don't see why we keep them alive indefinitely at public expense. Or worse start releasing them "early" for "good behaviour".

Tbf I don't know how possible it is with international law. Etc

MaudTheInvincible · 27/12/2020 10:26

@donquixotedelamancha

If I was pushed, I would have to admit I would vote for it, but for 1000% sure guilty murder cases.

I would bring back the death penalty for those who assign a percentage greater than 100% in scenarios where 100% represents a probability of 1.

In all other scenarios I'm 110% against it.

Grin
Neveranynamesleft · 27/12/2020 10:27

I have to admit that those who are saying the death penalty is barbaric confuse me.
Isn't murder itself barbaric??

donquixotedelamancha · 27/12/2020 10:29

I'm surprised Priti Patel wants to bring back the death penalty since surely the most likely crime it would apply for would be treason.

I can't really think of any examples of treason in recent years, except for one case involving the then international development secretary.

tara66 · 27/12/2020 10:30

It is not about the punishment of the individual it's about what the state does.

OnlyFoolsnMothers · 27/12/2020 10:31

Nope not even for the worst criminals, the state has no right to take a life!

Fizzgigg · 27/12/2020 10:31

Priti Patel is certainly in the record as being in favour of it - there's a good clip on YouTube of her and Ian Hislop debating it (Justine Mumsnet gets the last word Grin ). Don't know where this latest info about attempting to introduce it is from though

But no. Not in favour. Completely barbaric and deters no one from committing violent crime.

Orf1abc · 27/12/2020 10:32

We know for those who kill or rape they do not stop unless they are prevented from doing so.

You've just made up your own 'alternative fact' there.

Fizzgigg · 27/12/2020 10:33

@Hazelnutlatteplease

I'd vote for it.

The opportunities for miscarriages of justice are far more limited with the advent of DNA evidence.

We know for those who kill or rape they do not stop unless they are prevented from doing so. Rehabilitation is not a realistic option.

No I don't see why we keep them alive indefinitely at public expense. Or worse start releasing them "early" for "good behaviour".

Tbf I don't know how possible it is with international law. Etc

I don't think the state should kill people because it can't fix the justice system.
ClutchingMyPearlsAppropriately · 27/12/2020 10:38

I don't think it's about it being a deterrent - Being caught by the police isn't a deterrent, prison isn't a deterrent. People will do what they want to do regardless - death penalty or not.

I think the death penalty is more about ending the lives of people believed to no longer deserve to live (and wasting tax payer's money by keeping them).

Not really in favour of the death penalty anyway (because I believe it's an easier way out for ), although I take on board the point a PP made above.

AwaAnBileYerHeid · 27/12/2020 10:39

I'd vote for it. Too many paedophiles, rapists, murderers getting paltry sentences then out again to live their lives.

FuckeryOmbudsman · 27/12/2020 10:41

Don't know where this latest info about attempting to introduce it is from though

OP's seen a FB posting.

So it has to be true

Fizzgigg · 27/12/2020 10:48

*I don't think it's about it being a deterrent - Being caught by the police isn't a deterrent, prison isn't a deterrent. People will do what they want to do regardless - death penalty or not.

I think the death penalty is more about ending the lives of people believed to no longer deserve to live (and wasting tax payer's money by keeping them).*

Patel's position is about it being a deterrent though.

Fizzgigg · 27/12/2020 10:48

@FuckeryOmbudsman

Don't know where this latest info about attempting to introduce it is from though

OP's seen a FB posting.

So it has to be true

Oh yeah! Grin
Overtime2019 · 27/12/2020 10:49

I’m for it the way I see it is if you take a life your life should be taken

AlohaMolly · 27/12/2020 10:53

I agree with the PP that said the whole system doesn’t work. Prison doesn’t work. Reactive policing and imprisonment doesn’t work. The U.K. needs a complete overhaul (which wil obviously never happen) and we need preventative measures for our country, I think. Community support, village policeman, higher minimum wage, obligatory child support from absent parents, better funding for schools and community based social initiatives.