SS's stance on reconciling after DV *trigger warning*

[allshakenup1]

Obviously name changed for this. Apologies if this is the wrong location - please let me know if there is a better place.

I fled with my baby (10.5 months) after a DV incident a month or so ago. Although completely and utterly wrong, it was a minor incident (pushing, shoving) and I felt compelled to report it because I was so shaken up.

I had a call from SS, which naively, I didn't expect and it completely terrified me - they advised me in no uncertain terms that my baby could be taken if I resumed the relationship.

At the time I had absolutely no intention to, however, I do trust that it won't happen again. My husband is devastated and is seeking help for his actions. I'm missing him dreadfully and so is my DD. I want to keep my family together but I'm so terrified that if I do, my DD could be taken away from me. She's breastfed and has never, ever been away from me before. She's an awful sleeper and has co-slept, practically in my arms, since she was 3 days old. I'm so devastated. I don't know what to do for the best.

Obviously there is absolutely no chance I would do anything at all to jeopardise my DDs welfare - however, I want my family. It was a horrid row that went awfully wrong. He's a fantastic father and generally a fantastic husband. I feel I acted rash in going to the Police and I feel like I've failed DD by separating her from her father.

If I was to go back, could SS take her? Surely they'd want to keep families together and work with them? I'm terrified.

Just to add - my husband is in no way controlling or coercive. I do not feel pressured to go back and this is 100% my independent thought.

If you go back the chances are high that things will escalate. Every domestic violence situation starts with a first assault, usually a fairly minor one. And every abuser says they're sorry and begs for forgiveness and says they're devastated and they'll never do it again, and they're depressed and anxious and they can't help themselves and they'll only be able to change with your support. After all, if they said it was the first of many, wouldn't women just leave after the first one?

By going to the effort of leaving and then returning, you'd be giving the sign that you're ok with it. That's why social services are concerned. They're not trying to punish you, they're interested in protecting your child. If you go back, you're indicating to them that you might be willing to tolerate an abusive relationship.

Also, in practical terms, you'd be giving your husband the green light for much more serious abuse because it's a certainty that even if he inflicted serious injury on you, he'd warn you not to report it out of fear of losing your child. Do you want to back yourself into that corner?

So you’ve admitted that he had been short and snappy, which resulted in you walking on egg shells. Well that sounds like emotional abuse right there. He’s then proceeded to push and shove you, so he’s been physically abusive. I’m quite sure if you looked at his behaviour, then he’ll have been abusive in other ways as well.

Now, things are calmer you are looking at the situation with rose tinted glasses. You are minimising what happened and are actually annoyed at the wrong people.

Instead of trying to get reassurance about what would happen if you went back, you need to contact WA and other domestic violence services to get counselling and therapy yourself. To really explore your relationship.

@NoCureForLove honestly, I must be living under a rock because all mother's that I know would do anything to protect their children.

@PandemicAtTheDisco I'm sorry you experienced that and I'm so glad that you're safe and healing now 

@wellthatsunusual that's a good perspective and probably what I needed to give my head a wobble. Same to you @REignbow.

[quote allshakenup1]@scotsllb they didn't say they would, they said they could. I honestly can't remember the exact wording, I felt like I was being punished for his crime by receiving the phone call from them, not realising it was a process. I do remember them saying they'd do an assessment if I did go back. In hindsight I should've asked what that entails but I didn't.
I absolutely would not be scared to call the police if it happened again. The Police have advised me that they've put a flag on our home address, should anything happen.

@AnaisNun I completely appreciate why you'd pick up on that. My point was that I've worked so bloody hard to provide a beautiful home and be in a place financially where I could afford to give DC a wonderful lifestyle. My home is my home and it's DDs home. I'm sad that I'm not there. My point is that, as a single mum, I would not be able to afford the home and the lifestyle that H and I would be able to provide together. It goes without saying that it would be better for me and DD to live safely away from a violent person.[/quote]
Out of interest, why is it you and your baby that had to leave the lovely home you had worked so hard for? I can understand why you would be the one to leave straight away - the important thing if you are scared is to get away to safety. But, once the dust had settled and he was telling you how devestated he was, did he ever offer to move out so that you and the baby could move back in? Surely if he is that sorry he would be prepared to do everything he could financially to support the two of you, even if he understood you were never going back to him.

OP why are you being so vague about the incident that led to you fleeing and going to the police? Why were you arguing?

pushing and shoving is NOT a minor incident. if you said he called you a wiggly worm-yeah..youd be EXTREME. pushing and shoving is not a minor incident.

@yetanothernamitynamechange he has nowhere to go and I am really lucky that I have my parents, with an annexe.
His home office, which requires a server host in addition to his PC, is not so easy to move. We have discussed me moving back and him renting somewhere for the time being.

@Summerdayshaze @ScottishStottie I'm not being vague or obtuse. It's outing, and I really don't want to be recognised.
The argument itself was really over nothing and a build up of tension after 2 periods of isolation in 5.5 weeks, which with a wobbly toddling baby, 2 dogs and a business - both of us with teams to manage remotely, is difficult, to say the least.
DD was in bed when it happened and was obviously none the wiser. I reported it the next day, because a. I thought it was the right thing to do and of course I was shaken up, no one had ever laid a finger on me before and it was unexpected and b. my thought process was that if we were to separate, which I 99% intended on doing at the time (98.5% now) custody would swing in my favour.
He shoved me backwards twice and pushed me into a closed door which opened and I fell. He immediately apologised, went to help me up but I told him to fuck off, grabbed DD and locked myself in our room with her and cried myself to sleep.

@tolerable I completely agree. It's obviously more serious than being called a poo-head, for example, which is why I was so shaken and shocked. I referenced minor in comparison to serious which I would describe as being beaten black and blue.

And just to clarify, I locked the door not because I was scared of him hurting me, but because I didn't want to hear his bullshit apologies. It didn't actually physically really hurt me, it just shocked me.

I have to say OP depending on the circumstances of the argument - what was said - how both parties behaved - one isolated incident of a shove wouldn't have had me running to the police? But whose to know if it was a one off or the start of a pattern of behaviour?

But you have and a process has been put in place now. All you can do is talk to the social worker about what this means long term? I suppose you could get back together and unless they carry out regular home visits how would they know but it's a pretty risky move?

Did he shove and push you when you had your DD in your hands?

SS would not threaten to remove your dc over one isolated incident, be honest.

OP, I've not suffered DV personally, so I'm not going to come from that point of view, but another possible one.

My children are much older now, but that first year with them was without question the hardest and most miserable of my life, and I think my DH's too. We had next to no sleep, were constantly stressed, and I can say honestly that neither of us behaved as we normally would - if I now saw the person I was then, I wouldn't recognise myself. The emotions, the crying, the arguments, the frankly weird behaviour from lack of sleep and, in my case, hormones - it was awful and I'm so glad it's over.

None of that would excuse DV, but if you can see yourselves at all in what I've described above, then you might think that your DH isn't deep down an abuser, it's just the new situation at home that made him crazy and act in a way he normally wouldn't - but on the other hand, if the situation at home, with a baby (who you admit barely sleeps) hasn't changed, then no matter how remorseful he is I can't see things changing there for you, and it's quite possible it could happen again if he came back.

It may be a more practical way to look at your next steps. He can have all the regrets he likes, but it may be that it was easier for him to have them because he's away from home, and is getting lots of sleep, IYSWIM.

I wish ss was quicker to remove children from
Dv situations. My childhood would have been very different.

If you really think he won’t ever do it again, give him a chance to prove it. Live separately for now. Make sure he follows up on therapy. Make sure he doesn’t drink too much. Make sure he lives every day like his soul purpose in life is to prove he can be a good father. If he does that for a year, consider going back, as long as you have an exit fund set aside just in case.

Op. Zero tolerance = zero.none....I panicked the next day? Over what .suits me to now.to reflect that a grown adult mal e slamming me into a door,causing me to hit the deck isn't THAT bad?!? And I feel guilty bout the baby,the dogs,some carp computer scene lockdown ,poor him No place to go?.I don't want to be mean op but from the outside looking in...your being a text book dick.Not black n blue, no blood from ear?no hospital,ambulance,24/7 police guard?no traumatised children who can't beat to look at you OR leave your side?no walking back n realising you don't know who that is in mir ror?no first name terms with local cops. ?? Cos it wasn't THAT bad you can what?move on? .Zero tolerance.

Sorry cross posted seen your update OP.

He could ask for access and harm your child. Speak to WA to see what you could do to protect your child.

[quote allshakenup1]@tolerable I completely agree. It's obviously more serious than being called a poo-head, for example, which is why I was so shaken and shocked. I referenced minor in comparison to serious which I would describe as being beaten black and blue.[/quote]
DA starts slowly then gradually ramps up. You become almost immune to it and stop recognising how bad it is. It becomes your daily life. You minimalize and blames yourself for it, believing what your partner is telling you - that if you were less stubborn and difficult then it wouldn't happen.

It's insidious and that's the danger. Dismissing that first incidence is a huge mistake.

Your child then becomes immersed in making sure daddy is always kept happy, not doing anything to upset him, daddy's needs come first. They tell you years later they heard and saw things and they are fixed in that pattern of behaviour - trying to keep the men in their life happy at all cost.

In the freedom programme there is a part where it looks at how children are affected. It was clear that people on the course were refusing to accept their children were exposed and harmed by the DA or minimalizing how much they'd been exposed to.

Your child then becomes immersed in making sure daddy is always kept happy, not doing anything to upset him, daddy's needs come first. They tell you years later they heard and saw things and they are fixed in that pattern of behaviour - trying to keep the men in their life happy at all cost.

Believe me when I say this is my worst fear. This absolutely will not happen to my daughter.

I really appreciate all posts and viewpoints. I've managed to get a couple of hours sleep (DD actually slept quite well last night, it was just me who couldn't switch off) and I feel stronger again today, albeit a bit poorly but that's probably just feeling run down.
I don't want to go back - but I'm sure I'm not the only person who has thought about it, however fleetingly - I just want my old life back. My life before all this happened. I need to accept that this is a new beginning, I have my lovely, beautiful, clever, funny DD and I am capable of giving her the most wonderful childhood.

It's really common when there has been an incident of physical violence for it to be brushed off that the child(ren) were in bed or at school so not affected. This just isn't true. Your DD will have picked up on the period when he was snappy and you were walking on eggshells, she will have picked up on the aftermath and the impact on you. Domestic abuse is not a one off moment even if there is only one incident of physical abuse. This is one of the things social services will be worried about, as well of course about future violence.

Just also to note that there had been a couple of mentions of anger management on this thread. Domestic abuse is not about anger or losing it, if it was then abusive men would be getting angry and assaulting colleagues at work, friends etc, but the majority don't. It is about control. I would check what kind of counselling he's having and not rely on this to change his behaviour as many counsellors aren't experts in domestic abuse dynamics.

It would also be worth considering some counselling yourself to have some space to explore these issues, but if you do this I would suggest getting a recommendation from your local domestic abuse service as again not all counsellors understand this area

His abusive actions clearly scared you at the time ( as they would anyone). Bear in mind that now you know he is capable of this the relationship is likely to change as you now know this could happen again. Many women change their behaviour eg trying not to 'upset' their partner and this is where control can come in without you even realising it. Second guessing a partner in case he is abusive is exhausting.

Just seen your latest post OP, glad you're feeling stronger today.

@FrancesHaHa your post was both insightful and helpful, thank you. I have considered counselling but I'd much prefer to wait for an opportunity to have this face to face than over the phone/zoom.

I feel so embarrassed by all of this. I have two degrees, I'm a strong, capable, educated woman. If any of my friends, if my daughter came to me with this situation, I'd point them to the hills, yet I'm reduced to jelly. I feel as if my life has just stopped and is going too fast all at the same time. I can't sleep. I'm not eating properly. I have no interest in anything or anyone (except my DD and dogs).

I think it comes under willful neglect OP, you would be failing to protect your child by knowingly letting them live with a violent person.
'Just a shove' if you trip over and smack the baby's head against a table isnt just a shove.

I feel for you but you have to stop believing the trope that a man completes your family. You and your dd are a family, traditional or not.

I think you need to ask yourself what would have happened if dd had been twiddling behind you, or been on the other side of the door

@Rainedere

He could ask for access and harm your child. Speak to WA to see what you could do to protect your child.

This is exactly the kind of comment we don't need on a thread like this. Why have you said this? What do you hope to achieve?

This is how it starts though, you've already started thinking 'it'a not that bad', 'it waa only a shove', 'it's better for the family to be together', 'I wouldn't let it happen again'. You don't have the control to stop it from happening again, your huaband does. You cannot stop him from being violent - you can prevent it from happening again by keeping yourself and your child well away. SS don't have the funding or the resourcea to remove every child in that situation, but the reason they want to is because they know hpw damaging it is for a child to witness that - and there is no hiding it, children always know. I witnessed my mum being beaten black and blue when I was tiny and she always said its not that bad, it could be worse, I provoked him, he said it won't happen again and every time it got worse it was still never enough to leave. That started out as an argument gone wrong, just a shove. You probably won't listen to this, but once someone lays a hand on you for the first time, there is nothing to stop them doing a hundred times more.