I’m a grown arse woman who spent the whole of dinner feeling bullied and did nothing about it

[Parcelle]

And I’m fucking furious with myself

I’m not a shrinking violet by any means and I KNOW I need to let it go but I was so confused I didn’t do or say a thing and now I’m kicking myself I let my meal be ruined by two absolute pricks.

DP booked a table at a lovely “posh” restaurant in London for our anniversary. I was veering on the side of caution re my outfit so dressed up rather than down and felt comfortable but also hoped I looked nice.

We were seated at a table next to two men. One slouched in what I presume he thought was some kind of insouciant manner all over his chair and the other gave me the most obvious up and down bitchy look as I was being seated.

I took my coat off and had it next to me on the seat and one of the men leans over and says “oh you do know this is the kind of place that has hangers hunny, you don’t need to leave it there”. I just smiled and thought right ok and asked the lovely waitress to hang it for me when she came back.

The second man then did the most obvious wide eyed stare at his friend, looked sideways at me and grimaced and started giggling like a teenage girl. Then then openly giggled and spoke behind their hands for the next 5 mins. It was so clear they were talking about me, my face was burning I just wanted the floor to open up. DP asked me if I was ok but hadn’t noticed what was going on.

I got on with eating my starter and the “leaning” man was pretty much lying down on the bench seat now about 6 inches from me scoffing and talking openly about everyone who walked past his table with his friend giggling and laughing. Someone they knew stopped by their table and again the side eye and up and down look from the first man at me and more grimacing and giggling.

I just wanted to leave. I don’t know why the fuck I didn’t just ask him what his fucking problem was, I’m so angry at myself.

They left after their mains and gave me a “oh by the way lovely dress sweetie” as their parting shot. DP had cottoned on my this point and just looked at me like WTF.

I’m so upset with myself for letting myself be made to feel 2 inches tall by two complete pricks

To be fair its been clear from the outset that this was indeed a ‘bitchy gay men’ thread and what with the name change and all it was highly likely it was in bad faith.

No, that’s not being fair at all.

You must have looked bloody amazing to warrant that amount of attention. When was the last time anybody looked at either of them?

Its so annoying though sorry you had your meal spoiled.

If this thread is determined to go down the labelling rabbit-hole, gay men are very much like other categories of men. Some are lovely, warm, delightful human beings who love their Mums. Some can be very misogynistic, hate women, and are none-too-shy about showing it.

Unfortunately OP happened to cross paths with the latter variety. It isn't 'homophobic' to point that out. People know NAGMALT.

Not everything needs a confrontation, sometimes the smart thing is to ignore. They are absolute wankers and sad losers. As soon as i read your op i could imagine the sort of anti women type they are. It doesn't matter whether op changed her name 🙄

If anything be glad you did nothing, they wanted a reaction to add to their pathetic fun and you not giving it to them was the best option.

I think misogyny amongst gay men is a serious issue that we cant avoid talking about.

What a pair of utter bastards. I’m sorry they ruined your meal OP.

@TooTrueToBeGood

Their sexual orientation is irrelevent. Being rude and obnoxious is not a result of sexuality nor should the sexuality of rude and obnoxious people influence how you deal with them.

So I get why you're annoyed with their behaviour OP but making it anything whatsoever to do with them being gay somewhat undermines your moral high ground.

I agree with you but the OP never once made it about them being gay, in fact she didn't even mention it until people started bringing it up...

@user1471565182

I think misogyny amongst gay men is a serious issue that we cant avoid talking about.

Misogyny is an issue we should be able to talk about for sure. Is the sex/sexual orientation of the perpetrator material?

Don’t know that the op is female , to be fair

Doesn't the title kind of give away whether OP is a woman or not?

@MintyMabel

Yes they were gay for people implying I was trying to insinuate anything.

Ahh, I get it - it’s a “bitchy gay men” thread.

Does the fact that they were gay mean it was untrue? Did it not happen?
The OP did not originally say they were gay but recounted an evening of two men being nasty to her and acting like bullies.

She did not post because they were gay.

She posted because of what they did and that she feels anger at the fact she didn't stand up for herself (which I'm glad she didn't as it would not have improved the evening)

@nearertonature

Again, no one can make anyone feel anything

So untrue. And quite damaging as it tells people who are being bullied that their unhappiness is due to their own weakness.

If someone has a great store of resilience due to having a good and loving family, a good childhood, good friendships, well respected at work - yes that person is very likely to shrug off the occasional arsehole.

Someone whose life has not given them a great store of resilience is likely to be much more affected by arsiness.

And even people who are strong can be broken down by persistent and ongoing bullying.

We are social mammals, we live our lives through others. Yes, others do affect how we feel. Even when we can shrug off arseholes, that is often because we have love and regard from other people, and that love and regard causes us to feel good enough to shrug off the areshole.

The statement “no one can make you feel anything” comes from the Stoic philosophers. It is a principle used in many psychotherapy approaches such as Rational Emotive Behavioural Therapy. Essentially it’s the view that it’s not what happens to you that causes your “disturbance” but the view you take of it; your attitudes and beliefs and thinking are the moderators of how you respond to a situation. If it was the situation that created our responses we would all respond in the same way to a situation, that doesn’t happen. Generally it is true that in a negative situation how we respond is within our control even if the situation isn’t. Logically nothing or no one can “make” us feel a certain way.

You could have worn a sack and still been prettier than ugly personalities like that.
A dress can be changed but it takes work to clean unpleasantness from inside.

Hear, hear!

For those saying others can’t make you feel anything, wake up! This is why so many people, young to old, feel bullied on social media and self harm. I was dealing with a youngster today who was falling apart over something that someone had said over Whatsapp. If you can’t understand that some people simply cannot cope with what is said to them, then you have little understanding of the human psyche of may people.

It’s like telling an inveterate worrier that there’s no point in worrying. Telling them this does not stop them lying awake all night.

MyPersona I would say in this case and similar others yes. Likewise in drag culture there is a definite sort of misogyny seperate from the usual macho sort. The term 'fishes' for a start

And im into other women myself

@Shizzlestix feel sad, go on, feel sad because I told you to.

You can’t, because no one can make anyone feel anything. Events can evoke feelings but no one can make anyone else feel a certain way.

I’m sorry this happened to you OP.
I know just how it feels to be slated by some blokes who feel they are gorgeous and enjoy belittling someone else.
In my case a group of 3 young lads at work who thought they would slag off the way I look whilst walking behind me up the stairs. I’d just come back to work after being off sick for a month feeling at a very low ebb and I literally scuttled away from them feeling like utter shit. I just couldn’t find the emotional strength to say anything to the weasel bastards at the time. Wish I could turn back the clock and call them out on it.

I hope you realise it is them who has the problem not you. They were out at a nice restaurant and instead of enjoying the moment it makes them feel good to criticise everyone else. They must have very sad and bitter lives. It has nothing to do with their sexual orientation or anything else and anyone with any sense can see you weren’t saying that it was to do with that at all.
For you OP, leave it behind you and hold your head up high.

Sorry for derailing but I read this and I immediately got a gay/Jedwood vibe and now I feel like a homophobic arsehole, do people really start threads to cause this ?

@user1471565182

MyPersona I would say in this case and similar others yes. Likewise in drag culture there is a definite sort of misogyny seperate from the usual macho sort. The term 'fishes' for a start

I agree that is a disgusting term and I despise drag. I think it’s potentially an interesting discussion (maybe for the feminism board), but it’s still just another form of misogyny. My discomfort with this thread arose from the way the OP lead the reader to form certain conclusions by the use of cheap stereotypes, in what was a very odd and quite unbelievable scenario to begin with. To me it had a distinct whiff of a thread started to provoke unpleasantness, and indeed a number of homophobic comments have had to be removed even if it wasn’t intended to be a ‘bitchy gay men’ bashing thread.

Didn't happen.

@Doingtheboxerbeat

Sorry for derailing but I read this and I immediately got a gay/Jedwood vibe and now I feel like a homophobic arsehole, do people really start threads to cause this ?

People start threads to cause all sorts of nastiness. The disingenuous ‘was this racist’ ones are particularly popular.

Are you a gay man @MyPersona

They were on drugs, and bitches to boot.
You looked smashing, and totally 'owned' the situation by not rising to their bait.
Good on you.