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Want a baby but fiance makes excuses not to

184 replies

Marison · 04/10/2020 19:14

So I've been with my partner now for 7.5 years, we were meant to be married in May this year but Covid put a stop to that. It's currently been postponed for 2021 however we have been told that we will need to postpone again if we want the numbers we have already. That in itself is fine.

I've wanted a baby for last 4 years and the OH has said that we could try after the wedding. But as its not going to be another 2 years away I've asked to have one now. We are in a good place and have our own home and he knows how much I want to be a mam.

But he keeps coming up with excuses to not try for a baby. Using covid, or that he needs to mentally prepare himself (not like we had been planning it and technically be trying at this point anyway) or cause I'm studying at uni (my masters from home, fully funded too). Just random excuses to not try until after the wedding which will be 2 years away.

I have the implant and have always promised to not take it out until he is ready but I feel like he is being so unfair. A wedding makes no difference at this point. He's asked me to wait 4 years already, even tho I'm only 25 I just don't know how he can expect me to wait another 2 years.

Am I just being dramatic? I don't want to take implant out with out him knowing cause he could hold it against me. I'm such a maternal person, only one of my siblings without a child. I don't know what to do now

OP posts:
Highfalutinlootin · 04/10/2020 21:29

Your boyfriend is being deceitful and unreasonable for lying to you and stringing you along with excuses instead of just telling you he doesn't want kids now (or maybe ever. Many men do this for years).

He is not being unreasonable for not wanting children now or potentially ever. That is a deeply personal decision, and there's no right answer.

You need to tell him his excuses and dishonesty are a deal breaker. Find a way to have an honest conversation about his desires and timelines. Be prepared to accept his real answers.

PickAChew · 04/10/2020 21:29

You're a teacher plus still studying? How the hell do you even have time to fit in a baby?

RaspberryHartleys · 04/10/2020 21:32

A bit off the point, but I was under the impression you needed a PhD to be a permanent lecturer not just a Masters?

I know a lot of Masters grads who do technically lecture but they have zero control over what modules they teach, when they are etc. They're also all on zero hour contracts.

Might be something else to consider in your timelines - it would be better financially to be in a permanent role with guaranteed hours/pay and/or ideally additional or occupational maternity pay.

Good luck

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about these subjects:

CityCommuter · 04/10/2020 22:01

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ShalomToYouJackie · 05/10/2020 08:14

@UnshakenNeedsStirring maybe have better goals in life? Yo are young how can just procreating be a goal

That's not fair. I'm not sure if you're deliberately being a knob or you just haven't RTFT.

OP clearly has other goals, she's studying a Masters degree and plans to be a lecturer, I'd say that's a pretty big goal. Even if someone's only goal in life is to have a baby, there's absolutely nothing wrong with that and it's none of your business.

LUZON · 05/10/2020 09:26

There seem to be a lot of nasty posters on MN at the moment OP. I wouldn't take their comments personally.

Valkadin · 05/10/2020 10:06

Currently HE is in turmoil due to covid. Every or certainly most Universities have offered voluntary redundancies. I have three ex colleagues who have taken the offer and one of DH closest friends has just accepted a deal. Getting a permanent lectureship in HE has always been exceptionally hard. Many end up on the hamster wheel of temp teaching contracts or rotating research fellowships while the Profs they work under try and find more funding to keep their slaves, sorry I mean research assistants.

If you want to be a lecturer as you are so young I would seriously wait to have dc. Academics appear well paid but the hours they actually work are pretty crazy especially when establishing themselves.

Sundries · 05/10/2020 10:13

@Valkadin

Currently HE is in turmoil due to covid. Every or certainly most Universities have offered voluntary redundancies. I have three ex colleagues who have taken the offer and one of DH closest friends has just accepted a deal. Getting a permanent lectureship in HE has always been exceptionally hard. Many end up on the hamster wheel of temp teaching contracts or rotating research fellowships while the Profs they work under try and find more funding to keep their slaves, sorry I mean research assistants.

If you want to be a lecturer as you are so young I would seriously wait to have dc. Academics appear well paid but the hours they actually work are pretty crazy especially when establishing themselves.

Absolutely this. Hold off and hold off for years if you are planning an academic career.
MissBetina · 05/10/2020 10:20

OP, I understand. I agree with pp in saying that most people on Mumsnet believe it's ridiculous to have a baby before 30, but in reality they don't know you, what you've achieved, your maturity or anything about you. I would prefer children young and would have them before 25, that's just my preference. The pp saying why is being a mum your goal in life are in my opinion so rude. They don't know your life and you've clearly achieved a lot! You're a grown woman fs!! The people I grew up with are getting engaged and are pregnant/have children now, and I'm 21! It's all about personal preference and how you wish for your life to go, not what society (or random women on Mumsnet) seems to think is right. Times are changing imo but I think a lot of older people don't see that.

Mumsnet has become so nasty and full of nasty people on every thread so don't take any of their opinions personally

Teacaketotty · 05/10/2020 10:27

It’s very difficult when you get that strong broody feeling- and hard to shake off! You are entitled to feel the way you do, and so is he. I think my concern would be that he is going to stall indefinitely.

Why not get married sooner and have a big wedding later? There’s a difference between getting married and having a wedding.

I had my first child at 27 and don’t feel that young, plus it took nearly a year to conceive. Of course he has to be on board but a compromise is needed. Finish your studies and have a smaller wedding next year then try?

Also yes babies really effect the things you can do etc but also doesn’t stop us having fun or enjoying life. We weren’t married when we had our DD, and I haven’t had to reregister her - don’t know where a PP got that from!

VenusClapTrap · 05/10/2020 10:34

It doesn’t sound to me like he’s stringing you along. He’s clearly committed. I think his reasons for wanting to wait are valid and sensible. The issue seems to boil down to his preference for a large wedding versus your preference for starting ttc immediately, and which should take priority. All you can do is have an honest discussion about it and work out who is the one willing to compromise.

Personally I agree with him; it sounds sensible to me for you to finish your studies first and have the wedding you’d planned with all your family there. It’s only two years in the scheme of things, and then you both get what you want. If you have a small wedding now, he never gets to have his extended family at his wedding. If you have a child before getting married, he never gets to have that pre-children wedding that is obviously important to him. You can’t get those things back.

(And I’m sorry but I did snort at 'having a baby doesn't stop you from living a life and having fun' - I said the same thing. How wrong was I!)

GracieLouFreebushh · 05/10/2020 17:16

I agree with a couple of previous posters, can you not marry legally alone or with a few people then have a full ceremony in a year, or 2 years, or 3 years, or however long it is going to take for the amount of people he would like to attend, to be able to attend. I suppose you really need to understand the reason for holding of for another 4 years - is it the legal
Implications of being married (sorted as above), is it wanting more fun holidays, more time to enjoy being young and having time and money to himself or is it that he's not sure you're the person he wants to have kids with? I think you mentioned having children doesn't stop fun and holidays etc - actually it changes everything and massively reduces types of holidays - you have to think about extra vaccinations for little ones, you have to be back to hotel at reasonable time, make sure you stay in shade, reduces trips you can do safely, someone has to stay sober, it actually does reduce the amount of selfish fun you can have so make sure you have it out of your system!!

I also query whether completing a masters is going to guarantee a permanent lecturing job. Are we talking about university lecturing? Most uni lecturers I know have doctorates/PhDs.

Also you don't know if you'll enjoy lecturing and if the hours are suited to having children - I know several lecturers with who work 50-60 hours per week with ever increasing pressures. I know it's your life but career security does make it easier in my experience. I had first child at 28 and was still younger than a lot of others around me.

katy1213 · 05/10/2020 17:25

He sounds more mature than you are.

MsEllany · 05/10/2020 17:44

I don’t think there’s anything wrong with wanting a baby, but I also think you’re being heavily influenced by your hormones (I was exactly the same at your age).

I think as the situation has meant two postponements, it wouldn’t be out of order to say ghat by the time you turn 28 you want to be pregnant, wedding or no wedding. Or whatever age is acceptable to you.

Honestly though, you’re so young. Babies are wonderful but your life changes so much, especially for those in academia.

LolaSmiles · 05/10/2020 17:49

OP, I understand. I agree with pp in saying that most people on Mumsnet believe it's ridiculous to have a baby before 30, but in reality they don't know you, what you've achieved, your maturity or anything about you.
I disagree.

On this post the OP's age is only part of the picture and had a different 24/25 written about wanting children I think they'd have got different opinions.

Overall the OP comes across as immature, not because of her age, but because of her overall attitude, although her age may also account for how naïve she is in some areas.

For example, she's still studying and working as a teacher but thinks she's a year away from being a lecturer.

In reality most lecturers have a PhD and a track record of publications. If she's looking at lecturing in education then there may be more flexibility for a strong candidate with extensive experience but she's been teaching maximum 4 years so won't have that. She seems naively confident she'll be getting this job though.

Then getting into academia usually means low job security, some teaching positions are zero hours contracts and tend to be delivered by PhD students and postdoctoral researchers with little autonomy on content etc. There's also an expectation of long hours, short term contracts and being willing to move around based on where the funding is. Those terms and conditions are unlikely to provide financial stability for starting a family. If she leaves her teaching job then she won't be able to keep the occupational element of maternity pay unless she returns to work for 13 weeks full time, assuming she is full time now.Has she actually considered how she'll manage financially in those situations? Is her DP involved in these discussions, or should he suck it up?
She also appears to greatly underestimate the impact of bringing a baby into the world. It's easy to say 'you can still have fun with a baby' and she's right, but that's going to look very different depending on your finances, work pattern and other chil related logistics.

The OP seems to think life is one big tick list and being ambitious to tick things off is enough, which is why she's getting annoyed at her DP for having a more sensible and measured approach. If she is serious about building a career in academia and having a family then she needs to have a reality check and both her and her DP need to really clear what would be required for this to happen.

Graphista · 05/10/2020 18:20

Listening to people who are already parents/mothers and have experience with academic professions is much more sensible and mature than ONLY listening to those who agree with you who aren't yet mothers themselves and don't have any knowledge of academic careers.

I had dd at 28 after 5 years of obstacles BUT I have endometriosis which although it was undx at the start of that 5 years, I had a long history of Gynae symptoms inc a mc at 18 (unplanned pregnancy) so I was genuinely concerned that I'd likely have difficulty conceiving, staying pregnant and birthing a healthy child - and I was right. I suffered 2 ovarian torsions and another mc which was partly ectopic (twins, this is incredibly rare) in this time and the endo was dx/found during the initial surgery for the mc, I had to have more surgeries+medical treatment bad careful monitoring in the year between that and getting pregnant with Dd, then was very carefully monitored while pregnant with dd, put on complete bed rest from 7 months then a traumatic and dangerous birth during which we both almost died then I was told I would literally be risking my life if I were EVER to become pregnant again. (Not the endo something else came up)

In addition I was working as a nanny and had a LOT of experience caring for babies and young children and knew the cons as well as the pros and even so also knew it would be even more exhausting and demanding when it was 24/7 - which tbh even with the most supportive and involved partner/spouse in the early years it really is utterly relentless!

Yes you can still have fun and do things with a child BUT it's a lot harder practically, more expensive and takes a LOT of organisation. It's hugely different to how things are before a child

I'd done a lot before having dd, uni, career stuff (I'd been a nurse), travelling, living abroad...

It doesn't sound as if you've done much at all especially as you've been in this committed relationship since you were...17.5?! Tbh that's crazy young to "settle down" you haven't even really experienced dating!

In my opinion you barely know who you are!

Plus people change a LOT in their 20's, not just emotionally but bio-physically speaking, neurologically we're still "teens" until around your age! I think that shows in you in your narrow focus on this one desire! It's a very teenage thought pattern and approach - the overgrown toddler attitude "this is what I want and I want it NOW" barely able to consider even slightly (and 2 years over a lifetime really IS slightly) delaying gratifying that desire.

You also seem (worryingly considering it's your stated career goal) very ill informed as to how academic careers work.

I have several friends who are lecturers/professors, college and university level and even before covid with all the cuts further and higher education was really struggling! Very very few have permanent posts for the first 5 or so years, they're effectively (as pps have said) zero hours contracts

To get a permanent post in this area you generally need at least a phd, a good publication history and several years experience. It certainly won't happen as soon as you attain a masters!

It's a very male dominated career still too unfortunately, and while legally they cannot be open about this, the reality is they're pretty poor on equality and maternity rights generally speaking. My friends in these jobs who are mothers, especially when the dc are very young (not the same for fathers quelle surprise!) have found they miss out on jobs, promotions etc again it's not overt discrimination but it's definitely there especially in the older unis.

Academia is demanding, exhausting and requires employees to put in crazy hours to have a chance of doing well - this is not generally very compatible with early motherhood.

In fact your attitude suggests to me you might even have thought this was a good job to go into as someone who wants to be a mother soon because you've only focused on contact time with the students and think you'll have a lot of free time and long holidays?

I've lived with (as flatmates/me as a lodger) teachers and lecturers and I can assure you that outside of classroom time they had a LOT of prep, marking and research to do.

To be perfectly honest if you're a secondary teacher now I'd have thought you'd have more insight there.

Take a step back, learn more about what it takes to become a lecturer, learn more about early motherhood and juggling such a career from those who have/are doing it and LISTEN to them, LISTEN to your fiance.

Another thing - marriage is all about compromise and you don't seem very good at that, your fiancé has perfectly good REASONS not excuses for not wanting to ttc right now. You need to think about why you are so resistant to considering that his feelings and thoughts are valid too? Is his job secure? Maybe that's something he's worried about? Very few jobs are in these strange cuts/covid/brexit times

Having a child is a HUGE life changing choice, it really should not be done lightly and without full consideration of all the physical, practical, health, financial and emotional ramifications.

2 years really is no time at all, and you can even use that time to:

Get as healthy as possible (both of you)
Save for the first few YEARS of baby's life because to be honest childcare alone can be very expensive - have you even looked into this in your locale?
Get your home ready
Figure out the career stuff PROPERLY - not this vague idealised notion you seem to have at the moment

And I bet the time would zip by!

Personally with everything that's going on at the moment I would totally understand anyone who's at child bearing stage/age being wary at the moment and possibly wanting to wait until:

We see how Brexit goes
There's a covid vaccine or covid wise things are MUCH more settled

At the very least,

FourPlasticRings · 05/10/2020 18:26

Great post by @Graphista. I really hope you take it on board, OP.

Standrewsschool · 05/10/2020 18:29

Can you have a small wedding now, and a big family renewal of vows at a later date. We don’t know when big weddings will be allowed - could be 2021, it maybe 2025. How long are you prepared to wait?

What happens in two years time if he is still not ready? There’s been threads on mn on that exact scenario.

Maybe a life plan needs to be discussed and mapped.
Ie. 2020 = Covid
2021 - baby
2922 - wedding

It’s not uncommon for the baby to come before the wedding nowadays.

Also, I think your age is fine.

Graphista · 05/10/2020 18:30

Overall the OP comes across as immature, not because of her age, but because of her overall attitude,

I would agree with this, and I wonder if it's at least partly because she's been in the same relationship since she was 17 and I suspect this means she's led as an adult at least an incredibly narrow, even sheltered life.

being willing to move around based on where the funding is

Yes I forgot to include this in my post too. Op is limited to unis/colleges in her immediate/commutable area unless the fiancé has a job that's flexible/moveable which is unlikely in these tumultuous times, add a baby into that and the difficulties of finding good childcare and most people when they do find good childcare are understandably reluctant to move/disrupt the child unless absolutely necessary

Unless the op lives somewhere like oxford or Cambridge where there's a ton of colleges there's going to be very few academic positions and even if she does live somewhere like that these are unis that can and do demand far higher qualifications and experience than op will have for many years. I've lived in one of those areas (hence living with people in those professions) and even for researcher posts and similar a phd is a MINIMUM and it better be a damn impressive one!

Note also they couldn't afford their own places as they were sharing with me!

The OP seems to think life is one big tick list and being ambitious to tick things off is enough

And also seems in a massive rush to tick them off! Seems to be aiming to tick most off before she's 30!

Life is a marathon not a sprint!

You carry on like this op and you'll burn out!

longwayoff · 05/10/2020 18:43

Don't have a child with a man who doesn't want one. Just horrible for everyone concerned.

Graphista · 05/10/2020 18:46

@FourPlasticRings thank you

I understand the broodiness, following the mc at 18 even though that pregnancy was unplanned and the timing the worst (found I was pregnant after splitting from the father and it was an incredibly acrimonious split) I was SO broody right until I had dd.

But I knew I needed to wait for a whole load of reasons.

I met dds dad not long after the mc, we dated for 3 years then he proposed and we married within the year. He was young too with a career he was very much wanting to succeed in (army) but both of us understood that trying to rush things isn't sensible.

jessstan1 · 05/10/2020 19:02

Why so desperate? I'd understand if you were older but not at your age. Enjoy your life, you're only young once.

brockerknocker · 05/10/2020 19:23

I think it's a bad idea to have children with someone who doesn't want or isn't ready for children, but I don't think there's anything wrong at all with having children at 25. It doesn't make her "desperate", anymore than a 35 year old mother would be "desperate". People want different things at different times, and I don't think there's a blanket statement of "if you have kids before x age, you're desperate / rushing it / too young / naive" etc.

Graphista · 05/10/2020 20:25

I don't think the "desperate" assessment is coming purely from ops age, but their attitude throughout the thread.

brockerknocker · 05/10/2020 20:35

A collection of presumptious / not particularly nice comments about OP's age:

  1. "You're 25, why is this the be all and end all for you? It seems you have something missing in your life that you think a baby will fill. I'm not surprised your partner doesn't want a baby, youre coming across as desperate."
  1. "Is your partner 25 too? If so, I think he's being really sensible, I don't know any 25 year olds ready to have children, with good reason"
  1. "Maybe have better goals in life? Yo are young, how can just procreating be a goal?"
  1. "It doesn't sound as if you've done much at all especially as you've been in this committed relationship since you were...17.5?! Tbh that's crazy young to "settle down" you haven't even really experienced dating! In my opinion you barely know who you are!"
  1. "I would agree with this, and I wonder if it's at least partly because she's been in the same relationship since she was 17 and I suspect this means she's led as an adult at least an incredibly narrow, even sheltered life."
  1. "Why so desperate? I'd understand if you were older but not at your age. Enjoy your life, you're only young once."

If anyone said anything judgemental about women having children over 40 for example (which isn't even comparable, because 25 doesn't have additional health risks) the place would be up in arms.

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