Help explain non-gendered clothes to DM & MIL?

[NewbieMumma]

Please can someone help me and DH formulate a neat phrase to explain to my mother and my MIL why my DH and I do not want gendered gifts and clothes for our new baby? We don't know the gender yet (due in a couple of days) and we have bought gender neutral baby grows and things. We want to maintain this once the baby is here, and not dress them in overtly blue dinosaurs or pink hearts, and slogans etc. This is all in line with our views and how we try to carry out our roles at home. Both MIL and DM are very old fashioned and were very 1950's style wives and mothers, which was their choice but not the way we live.

As generous as it is of the GPs to want to buy the baby clothes, we tried to casually say "nothing too gendered please" mainly so that it wasn't a waste of their money. However we have been met with constant resistance and questions. Eg "surely once you know the sex you'll be buying blue / pink"? "What if they are a girly girl" etc etc, "what is he loves trucks"? "It's so sad / cruel" etc!

I find it so time consuming to explain why I don't want to dress my child in "daddy's little princess" type stuff which only promotes gender role stereotypes in a tiny child who has no inclination towards any of this and no knowledge of patriarchy at first. I know there's only so much we can do and it won't be long before we start to see our child influenced by the patriarchal society is is immersed in, but I think it's reasonable for us to do what we can to balance the scales a little bit whilst the child is in their home environment, through books, toys, clothes, critical thinking and choice of language etc etc.

My mother and MIL just can't get it and say that we will struggle as the shops only sell girls clothes and boys clothes. DH answers his mum's comments with sensible rational reasons why our choice makes sense and tries to get her head around the concept, but she keeps on asking, or texting us photos of "cute" clothes, eg pink tutu dresses. We are also choosing not to dress the baby in "outfits" (dresses, jeans etc) mainly due to simplicity, and she's also questioning that alongside.

Anyway, does anyone have any ideas about something quick we can say that explains our pov and helps us make our point? Or do we just give up trying to explain?

I know I'm very probably way over thinking (tired and hormonal) and should just say a firm "that's our choice", but it irks me that they are trying to cajole us and that at this rate we will be gifted a bunch of stuff we don't want to give to our baby.

@senua

DH and I do not want gendered gifts and clothes for our new baby? We don't know the gender yet (due in a couple of days) Ahem. You won't know the gender for a few years yet. Did you mean to type biological sex?

You won't convince the parents if you yourself are getting confused over terminology.

😂

And for what it’s worth I actually think it’s harder as they get older. I got lovely bright clothing for my babies relatively easily (and yes i also had a mix of blues pinks etc mainly gifts but used). Now they are older it’s MUCH harder in places like sainsbury. The girls aisle not so much can get variety of clothing. Boys aisle is a mass of sludge colours mainly. (Obviously can buy from either aisle!)

What I think and worry more about is that society is actually going backwards. Why did they need “boy” and “girl” Lego for instance? (We both use both!) My Ds got a toy plastic activity table lovely bright primary colours used for dd later - I saw it recently in Argos when looking for something else and it comes in Pink version now! Why?! What was wrong with the Primary colour mix for BOTH. Why are they bringing out pink versions of things that were already primary colours for CHILDREN not for boys or for girls.

@chubbyhotchoc

Christ you sound like hard work

It's a shame you think that.

surely once you know the sex you'll be buying blue / pink"? "What if they are a girly girl" etc etc, "what is he loves trucks"? "It's so sad / cruel" etc!

What if she likes trucks, what if he likes pink? I'd just explain it that way. It's hardly cruel as the children have no idea what they are wearing for a few years and of course, girls like pink when they've been dressed head to toe and the cack for the first five years of their life.

Just explain very strongly, and mean it. That heavily gendered clothing won't be used adn will be given away. They will stop giving it to you because they don't want to waste their money.

You can also point out that you'd like to save clothes for the next child and how awful it would be if you had to dress a little boy up in a fairy costume

Also let them know that several shops have stopped gendering their clothes so there is no reason to worry they won't be able to find anything. Maybe find a quick article on why girls are less likely to go into stem careers and less likely to play with toys that build skills they will need as adults.

As important as it seems now, it's impossible to control other peoples choices when it comes to gifts and it might be easier to just let it go.

If the GP do want guided on what to buy show them the stuff you like e.g H&M has fab neutrals. My DM will always ask what we'd like so it's easier but I don't force my preference on my MIL - she bought blue and pink baby sets when each of our kids was born. And I was grateful for them when the clean clothes ran out after countless outfit changes, I couldn't have cared less if they were neon pink or blue at that stage! You can also exchange them.

Despite our best efforts my 2 year old boy loves everything stereotypical and insists that the pink section of the toy catalogue is for his sister

You sound like you'll be forcing your child to live an ungendered life.
I am the least girly girl I know off, honestly, yet my little girl loved pink and princesses since the moment she could. I will buy her her pink princess shit all day long because it's what she wants..if she was anything liek me she'd be playing football and trucks and live in jogging bottoms and hoodies but she isnt and that's OK!

Just go with the flow and dont be disappointed when your child is a aboy and likes 'boy'stuff or is a girl and likes 'girl'stuff

If you get things dont want return them for somethign you do want. No big deal. Lots of baby girls get presents of dresses they never get around to wearing. Baby arriving summer will prob just have a white vest on for first two months.

Think you should remember this issue as child gets older, now you want GP to respect your decisions you must in turn respect the childs wishes.
From a very young age children like to pick their own clothes. I have boys and girls somtimes the boys want to wear pink princess dress, I've even had a situation where a 3 year old wanted to wear 2 different shoes to shop. Three people stopped to tell me "your child is wearing two different shoes" ! (now I know two different shoes may not a great idea for muscles ect but not wearing them very long ) but I let them pick what to wear each day as I like idea that they can express themselves amd make decisions from a young age.

From expierence in my house kids do tend to prefer clothes with characters or their interests e.g animals,trucks, butterflies, peppa pig. You may find your child does not like clothes you want to buy as they get older.

@CodenameVillanelle I completely agree.

Both MIL and DM are very old fashioned and were very 1950's style wives and mothers, which was their choice but not the way we live

Actually this is so condescending. They didn't have a 'choice' it was what a patriarchal society imposed on most women of their generation. They can't help that indoctrination, so your attitude to their attitudes should be less judgemental.

Seriously? Just how old do you think these women are, 103?

As for the comments on some girls preferring girly stuff etc, fair enough except that we're talking about a newborn here - they don't prefer anything, they just wear what their parents put them in.

@BwanaMakubwa

I had boys first. They had a dolls house, baby dolls, you kitchen etc. My daughter is my youngest and I am afraid she is different. Right about 3 she flipped into swishy, sparkly clothes, princesses, unicorns etc and was far more into doll play than the boys had been. I felt that since I had bought trains for the boys when they had gone through their train mad phase, I should buy a Frozen doll for DD if that was her hearts desire - in other words, I felt that to deny her her interests because I didn't personally like them was really unfair. I didn't make her into princesses, she did it herself.

The same thing has happened to my sister who was always more radical than me and I think secretly thought I had pushed my DD "girly" after my 2 boys. Her DD had no pink baby clothes. No sooner had she turned 3 then she was putting on the fairy skirt and wings at nursery and twirling around.

I hear what you are saying. To be fair though, I don't think I had commented about restricting the child's choices as they get older. The post was about inflicting gender stereotypes on a newborn baby.

We were the same and have continued with it, it is not PFB, it's sane parenting.

We have three children none of whom fall into the "little men just love diggers" and "precious pink pretty girl" category [puke] We stick to bright colours and buy from either side of the aisle for all of them. Rainbows and sequins are loved by all as are dinosaurs etc. Those things are fun for children.

The word you want is unisex.

Tell your family you want unisex toys / clothes that are suitable for a boy or a girl.

They will understand that perfect well. It’s your gender shit that’s confusing them.

The same thing has happened to my sister who was always more radical than me and I think secretly thought I had pushed my DD "girly" after my 2 boys. Her DD had no pink baby clothes. No sooner had she turned 3 then she was putting on the fairy skirt and wings at nursery and twirling around.

Hmm three. what happens at that magical age? Yes, nursery. And Cebeebes

Children aren't stupid these things filter down even if you avoid them. That's precisely why it should be avoided. You're not denying a child princesshood if they should so wish, just not forcing them in to it.

Whats the plan then if you don’t want outfits, that you’ll dress the baby in babygros until 3? While yes I agree that gendered clothing isn’t exactly progressive, banning all complete outfits like jeans / dresses / leggings etc just seems weird. And besides I think all you are doing really is buying into the stereotype of social misogyny that girls stuff is gendered but boys stuff can be unisex which is bullshit.

Honestly I'd let them buy what they want and as pp have said, take a quick pic to send to them with a 'thank you' message and then you can forget about them. We have 2 boys and I totally agree that clothes are way too gendered - I've often bought them clothes from the girls section and no one has even noticed - but imo it's not worth falling out with people about it. We've been given frankly ridiculous outfits (stiff white shirt with a collar and jeans for a newborn, trousers with dinosaur spikes sticking out that are totally impractical, many pairs of trainers and shoes in 0-3 size which have never ever been worn) and we just say thank you. It's really important to have support from your family - having a newborn can be overwhelming and stressful at times and you want family to be able to come and help, not staying away for fear of offending you.

For the first year the baby will vomit, drool, and shit her/his way through so much clothing you'll end up not caring what style it is. It's just an endless conveyor belt of washing. Buy clothing in green/yellow or neutrals or whatever you like, and gratefully accept gifts. Blue/pink can be kept for at home days or sleep outfits if you don't want them seen in public.

I wouldn't argue about this stuff yet. If you have an open mind your child will choose what they want to play with and have an interest in, and then presumably GP's will not refuse to buy dinosaur stuff for a girl, etc.

Unisex can be used by both sexes but gender-neutral means exactly that. It means there are no additional gender trappings on the sexless inanimate object.

The OP referred to the baby's sex as gender but using gender to describe things that are gendered isn't incorrect.

I just wouldn't buy you anything tbh. I was bought lots of clothes when my baby was born, some I would never have bought myself for her but I was so grateful for the people who spent their money on my child. Why don't you just say you have enough clothes and don't want any more. Gosh people are so unappreciative.

@AllStartedWithUSA

You sound pretty condescending and dismissive if your DM and DMIL. Don’t burn bridges over baby clothes - you’ll need them once the baby is here!!!

I also think you’re making this into too “big” a deal. You’re trying to explain a whole parenting concept to them and they (rightly!) are probably thinking you’re naive given that you don’t actually have a child as yet! Just say you’d prefer unisex clothing now (and that’s the term!L not non gendered!) and that you aren’t a fan of slogan clothing but would prefer bright patterns spots whatever it is you actually like. You could add that you aren’t going to be using outfits as believe it’s more comfortable and practical for
Baby to be in sleepsuits over say frilly dresses or mini jeans so please don’t buy too many outfits you’d much prefer nicely Onsies (or whatever you actually want with link for examples).

That approach is clearer and has some common sense. Whereas saying your unborn child won’t be wearing pink blue or having dollies or trucks or dinosaurs....well it all just sounds a bit “woke” and eyerolly.

For what it’s worth I also think clothing for a young baby is the least of your worries in this area. I didn’t buy blue pink etc but didn’t go so far as to put ds in a dress for the sake of it (if he’s wanted no issue). Yet after starting school he came out with “but pink is for girls” “girls can’t do that” No one in our family friends extended family talk like that it’s come from school mixing etc and they are quite a open school and area (one boy DOES where a skirt sometimes none of the children care). So that took some gentle rearranging his brain and showing that wasn’t correct. On the other hand my dd has been in brothers hand me downs, never wears dresses because i find them completely impractical for younger children, did get dolls but also trucks dinosaurs trains, had pink tops, blue tops yellow tops etc etc. She’s almost 5 and LOVES pink And unicorns yet trains are her favourite toy. I personal cannot stand pink (or green) and I’m not a girlie girl. Point is you actually have little influence sometimes.

You’d be far better focusing on the attitude you want your child to have and demonstrating those. Boys and girls can be anything etx. Mum or dad can do the washing take the bin out etc etc. That will have more impact that forcing an excitable grandma to buy “gender neutral clothing”..

Finally...you don’t need to use gifts!! Say thank you and return or charity shop it. I got clothes I wouldn’t use. Sifff trousers Dungarees shorts for ds and overly frilly dresses for dd. I never used as never had opportunity for them to wear given our life style. I didn’t say “actually I hate those don’t buy” I just never used. Distant relatives for baby gifts one off didn’t matter closer like grandparents...well they soon saw how I dressed my children and started changing their purchases accordingly.

Honestly relax a little

Please read the content of my post before making these assumptions about what I value. I have already remarked on mine and DH's values and our thoughts on books, emphasis on critical thinking and how we manage our own roles in our home, which will of course be modelled to the child. These are indeed way more important to me, but they are not the things being challenged by the GP's at the moment (probably because they are less "obvious" / haven't arisen at this stage). The clothes are the specific thing they are focussing on at present.

The post was about inflicting gender stereotypes on a newborn baby.

your newborn baby won't care.
And won't remotely be affected by your choice as long as you keep them in comfortable fabric and style.

And don't tell them the result of the gender scan. It just makes more work for you. Tell them you're keeping it to yourselves.

*sex scan, not gender

I have already remarked on mine and DH's values and our thoughts on books, emphasis on critical thinking and how we manage our own roles in our home

Fair enough to have values, but you really need to chill!
Your baby is not even born yet, and you are VERY HEAVY in your convictions.

Just relax a bit...

I seriously doubt the OP's mother and mIL are struggling t understand what gender neutral means when the OP has explained what she wants exactly and why.

It's quite an ageist and sexist implication actually.

Hi op ,
I think Pandora has hit the nail on the head , keep it simple and dont get into the politics of it all .
The grandparents are just excited and want to contribute which is lovely.
I too , disliked all the slogans for my ds clothes when he was a baby ( " lock up your daughters" wtf)
I dressed him in plain white when he was tiny and bright colours as he got bigger because they suited him . He had a red pram and people would say what a lovely baby , but I cant tell of he is a boy or s girl because the pram is red lol how strange.
His cousin was born 6 months after and we could pass everything down and she would wear things with buses on and " boy" colours too .
Your DM and mil are a bit old fashioned but that will be you one day !