I have zero authority

[ChiaWatermelon]

Hi,

Mum of two boys here, aged 8 & 18. Looking for some help and advice on how I can become a stronger mother with some authority in my house.

I love both of my sons to bits, and I wouldn’t change them for the world, but sometimes I feel bullied and manipulated, DS (18) isn’t too bad, DS (8) is the problem, I have tried to ignore it hoping that he will grow out of it.

He is very well behaved at school, but at home he is a completely different person

He is miserable, he is always moaning about something.

He is an extremely fussy eater, take this morning for an example, he asked for a salmon cream cheese bagel once out in front of him he decided he didn’t want it.

Since being off school he has refused to join in on the online classes (at the start of the pandemic, the school ordered for every child to get dressed and attend online assembly, he did it the first day then decided that he wasn’t going to do it again)

It’s been a struggle to get him out of the house for daily exercise and supermarket trips, he just sulks the whole time I find myself bribing him with amazon credit.

The list goes on.

Depends. The only way is to phone and ask. Be clear you don't necessarily need a diagnosis - you have that. You're asking for parenting support and advice on behaviour management in the first instance

OP, you have my sympathy. I am naturally a very soft mum and don't like the discipline side of parenting. I don't want to be anyone's boss. But children really hate having no boundaries. It actually puts them in charge and they are too young and terrified (even though probably not aware that's why they are playing up.)

There's a brilliant book called Positive Discipline which helps you be in charge without confrontation. Might be worth a look.

OCD and being disobedient are not mutually exclusive! Of course there might be things you need to support him with rather than tell him off for (eg forget about him helping in the garden and taking the bins out, given the cleanliness stuff). But there’s also going to be typical 8-year-old with loose boundaries messing you about.

Have a clear discussion with both sons “lockdown is hard, we need to work together to make sure we’re all happy” etc. Then with specifics, that your DS also agrees to.

With food, make it clear that you (and older DS), will make meals and snacks, BUT expect them to be eaten with gratitude. If not eaten then nothing else instead. Ask both DS if there are things that are reasonably healthy that he’d particularly like, say what meals you like, and come up with some ideas. If things are going well, see if you can cobble together a meal plan between the three of you.

With wanting to do something (eg screen time), then insisting that he does x amount of school work, and y amount of exercise and z amount of chores first is also fair: “once we’ve done x, y and z you can game for 2 hrs until dinner, but then it’s washing up, family time/Lego/whatever, then bed” - chose a schedule you can tolerate with whatever works for you.

Make it clear that any defiant behaviour gets time taken away.

Then stick with it!

He’s 8, you can pull it round and of course you’ll all be fine.

@Saz12 Hi, I speak to them everyday about being in lockdown, I ask them if there’s anything I can do to make staying in the house a bit better.

At the beginning of lockdown, we went out and did a big shop and bought things that would keep us occupied. Hopefully lockdown comes to an end soon.

DS(8) had his bagel and some salad for dinner, but I had to make him a fresh one, I did this to avoid what would come next.

Tomorrow, I will give him a choice of two things per meal, whatever he chooses will be what he has to eat.

I’m so tired and emotionally drained.

You sound like a family friend of mine, OP. She didn't want to parent (discipline) her children, she wanted to be their best friend, which was a disaster. They were totally out of control, rude, demanding, non compliant to her feeble requests. You may find JorisBonson's comment horrible but what she said is the reality of what your son will become if you do nothing.

Check out past episodes of SuperNanny !

As the parent of an anxious child, I find it helpful to remember that firm boundaries doesn't mean you can't be nurturing and caring. Firm boundaries make my DC feel infinitely safer, so help a lot with their anxiety.

At the moment this feels the wrong way round - his behaviour is taking up a huge amount of your energy but very little of his This doesn't need to be super-complicated. I find natural consequences are the simplest approach. Flat refusal to get up and dressed for (online) school? That's a shame, because with all the time it will take me to explain to school, there won't be time for us to do (X nice thing). Reward systems don't work brilliantly for us because the anxiety about getting the star or whatever tends to cause the behaviour I was trying to avoid! But very clear expectations, for small chunks of time so there's a structured feel to the day, help us a lot.

You might also find the behaviour is a way of struggling to express feelings. There are some good resources around for activities to help children show current worries, when asking them directly is too much for them.

Thanks for all your help today. I have managed to get him settled for bed, I will put some new rules in place tomorrow.

Wish me luck x

Hawkin, what I meant was that Day 1 of New Boundaries Task 1 shouldn’t involve something he’d find “yuk” (eg bins, soil, etc). Not that no one with OCD can learn to cope with these things. Apologies for confusion!

Good luck tomorrow OP. Stick with the new boundaries.

In the nicest possible way, you don’t sound like a very strong person. You sound like you spend most of your time pussy footing around your children so that you don’t upset them. This is exactly the opposite of what children need, they need the security of firm, consistent boundaries.

With regards to the school work, there should be no choice. It’s time to get dressed and go on his video call. That’s it, no choices. Then it’s on to whatever activity he needs to do next.

With regards to the breakfast, he’s totally playing you there and trying to establish control, which he completely has. He’s chosen the salmon bagel and he therefore needs to eat it, or that’s it, no other options.

You also need to stop asking if there’s anything you can do to make lockdown better for them. It is what it is and we all need to get on with it.

If he refuses to do as he’s asked then yes, physically take away his technology, or you know full well that he’ll just go on it anyway and then what will you do?

Good luck, OP! What are you planning for the rules?

@Saz12 - Thanks
@CoronaIsComing - I am not a strong person and I can admit it. I don’t know what I will do.
@Charlotte

1. He will have to eat what he has asked for, no making me prepare it for him and once it’s in front of him, him not wanting to eat it.
2. We need to go out for exercise (I’m sick and tired of staying in the house)
3. No sulking
4. Less screen time, and more interaction time with mummy e.g puzzles, Lego, dvd together.

You say you made a fresh bagel to avoid what would come next. What did you think would happen if you didn't make a fresh bagel?

Start afresh. Tomorrow is a new day.

and the school work?

Excellent! I feel much better when we've all got out of the house, too.

Expect him to be annoyed by it all for a few days, but persist calmly and ignoring the "tantrums" as much as possible. Remove yourself from the room if you feel the calmness going or if he hits. (Yes I'm speaking from experience!) Hopefully you'll have some really nice moments in the day.

I also suggest planning a treat for yourself at the end of the day. Raising kids on your own is hard work: be kind to yourself.

I suggest adapting 1 to "if he doesn't eat it there's no alternative", so you're not trying to force him to eat. That's a bad battle to get into.

2: suggestion: either let him decide on the exercise or give some choice: "do you want to go out at 11 or 2?" for example. Makes it easier for him to go along with it if it's not something he's keen on.

@Oswin - He would have started sulking and probably not ate anything at all. Like I said before he is so miserable, and I don’t know the reason behind it.
@LIZS - It’s going to be difficult to get him to do some school work, but I will try. I’m going to ask for a helping hand from DS(18)
@Charlotte - Thank you, I will keep that in mind

My DCs have 2 or 3 blocks of tech time per day and are adjusted around behaviour. I use an app (subscription) called Boomerang to control their tablets from my phone, which is useful as it depersonalises it when thetablets shut off, and I don't have to get physically involved.

DS1 (9) has ASD so displays anxious behaviour. Sometimes it is full on out of control meltdown. Sometimes he's just being a stroppy prat! We've had a stroppy prat evening this evening... he didn't want to go for a walk (not making him walk yesterday was an error, every time he's missed a day, we've known about it the following day...). He was dawdling along, mucking about with his stick and was menacing with it a few times. The stick ended up being hidden in a bush so I can find it again and because of his mood when he got in, he ended up being sent to his room. By the time he calmed down sufficiently, there were 3 minutes before the tech allowence cut off. I can fetch the stick tomorrow if he's being more pleasant and reasonable.

We recently had a stand off about cleaning the toilet as he leaves it in a gross state. Each DC is now responsible for a toilet each (so he can't blame his brother) and if I have to clean a seat, I confiscate it for a few days. DS1's was in a state that required Toilet Duck, and he tripped into anxious mode. We talked about what will happen if... e.g. if he drops it, I fish the bottle out and clean it. He was still reluctant because he'd worked himself into panic mode, but we did get there in the end. It takes patience though.

You can listen and still hold firm or make reasonable compromises half-way, but anxious children still need the boundaries, probably even more so as they like to kniw what to anticipate. (Prior warning and counting down helps a lot too).

I think babies & children like a routine & boundaries.
So work with him to find a routine that he feels can work. I don't think he has to do school assembly. Instead he could start the day with BBC bite size.
Then boys respond really well to a reward chart - so get him to work with you to agree on what gets a reward & what the reward would be.
For example he completes 40 mins of work gets a point/star/marble in a jar. Find different rewards such as amazon voucher/time on device/sweets from shop etc....
It sounds like I'm stereotyping boys but they do seem to respond to this sort of thing.
Try to make it fun & stick to it. So don't just give rewards unless he's earned the points.

And today was one of those evenings where it was a case of "We are going out at 6pm, and if you are not ready, you will be put outside the front door in whatever state you are in"
They were ready.
DS2 has not forgotten that he ended up brushing his teeth in the school playground in front of the headteacher because he was pratting around and I was not letting DS1 be late while we battled over the toothbrush, so the toothbrush came to school too.