Why are some Labour voters in denial about JCs endorsement of party wide anti-Semitism

[Rainbowhairdontcare]

I'm in a tactical vote group on FB. There was a fairly civilised discussion about JC when I said as a Jew I can't vote for him, nor any of the members of the small community where we live.

Then I got told off for buying the "fear mongering biased media".

I've read and heard what he's said. As a Jew I can clearly see it as anti-Semitism. It baffles me that people are still in denial about it.

Joyful that’s something I noticed - all the posters with Jewish Corbyn supporting friends. I don’t know one Jewish friend or acquaintance who supports him. There is anti-semitism within Labour and whether Corbyn Is or isn’t antisemitic himself, by failing to deal with it, he is clearly happy to not oust those members who are. Unforgivable. According to the tactical.vote website, as a Remainer I need to vote Labour. What a dilemma that is.

Same here joyful I'm very active in the local community and although we're tiny nobody would ever think of voting labour

another thread (or is it this one - I lose track) flags up a twitter feed with a long list of credible reports on Corbyn over many years.

I'm now convinced. If he isn't an antisemite, he certainly helps out when they are busy.

no Labour vote from me this time as no way will I give my support to him as PM.

it is this thread and here's the link:

threadreaderapp.com/thread/1169283105821249536.html

I don't accept this "he's not antisemitic himself but doesn't deal with it" argument. Dealing with it is part of his job. If I had loads of friends and political associates who were members of Britain First I would expect to be called out for it, irrespective of whether i considered myself not be be a racist personally.

The new labour candidate for Tower and Limehouse has posted anti-Semitic tweets and been investigated for them, yet remained on the shortlist and won.
I'm quite despondent about it and I'm atheist. I can imagine how fucked off and marginalised Jewish people are feeling.

normanfinkelstein.com/2019/02/26/that-labour-antisemitism-crisis-in-numbers/

I hope people will take the time to look at that and go further into Finkelstein JustAnotherPoster, he is fascinating on this subject and has a lifetime of knowledge.

That's in stark contrast to kneejerk reactions and shameful co-opting of the term anti-semitism for political ends by people who don't really give a shit about jews.

If you dig into even the first story on the twitter feed posted above, you will find that the conviction was, indeed, highly dodgy and it's no wonder Corbyn and others campaigned. If Corbyn is anti-Semitic, then so is Amnesty.

Thread:

threadreaderapp.com/thread/1169283105821249536.html

Other articles on the conviction:

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/shayler-was-right-over-bomb-at-israeli-embassy-634154.html

www.amnesty.org.uk/press-releases/united-kingdon-concerns-remain-convictions-two-palestinians-accused-connection

I believe there are nasty, anti-Semitic elements in the Labour party, just as there are anti-Islamic elements in the Tory party and I believe that ALL leaders need to do more to stamp this sort of thing out. I absolutely don't believe Corbyn himself is anti-Semitic.

Festered - it's just surprising how many of the people Corbyn campaigns for seem to approve of killing Jews.

The embassy bombers admitted being part of the PFLP, and they built bombs which were intended to be used to blow up civilians. When caught, one of them drew a gun on the police, who subsequently found an arsenal of weapons in a lock-up. She also produced a string of false alibis, which were disproved by CCTV. So even if the embassy conviction had been quashed, they would have been received long jail terms for explosives offences and membership of a designated terrorist group. These weren't random innocent passers-by.

Killing Jews, or any innocent person, is wrong.

That's why it's important that the right people are convicted, whether or not these two would have been convicted for other offences.

@ArseDarkly

“I'm of Jewish heritage and I support Corbyn. Presumably i'm not self-respecting in your opinion. hmm”

Unfortunately, yes, that’s my honest opinion 😬

Not one person in my wider family or community would agree with you right now.

You don’t need my permission or approval to be different to me tho! So sorry if it seems harsh.

Its because their point of view suits them.

Surely as well the ones who can decide if the actions are anti-Semitic is us Jews?

I find it very condescending that others can't aknowledge that

I don't know enough to comment about "party wide" but MIL went to the Labour Party conference this year. I've known her for 20 years and she's not anti Semitic but the crap she was spouting when she came back definitely was.

The Labour Party as a whole seems rather insular right now. It needs to pull its head out of its arse on this issue.

That list is shocking Glitch

Trouble is - what are Jewish remainers meant to do? Both BJ and JC are horrific. How can we decide who is the worst?

I don't know @BlueGingerale I'm up for tactical voting BUT how stubborn JC followers are and Labour in general makes it almost impossible for me to give them my vote. So even if my vote is wasted I think I'll vote LibDem

God, parts of this thread are depressing. There are now literally hundreds of documented instances of Corbyn's alliances with anti-Semites, Holocaust deniers. His speaking at rallies to crowds of people chanting 'gas the Jews'. His thinly disguised comments about 'Zionists' and their lack of irony. His approving comments on the most vile anti-semitic imagery. His support for Chris Williamson, Ken Livingstone, Jackie Walker and George Galloway.

The cartoon thing alone for him should have been the end of his political career. And if that cartoon had been about any other minority group, it would have been. Can you imagine - Boris Johnson gives his approval to a cartoon in which black people are represented as... I won't even say it because it's too offensive. But he would be out of a job the following day.

But it's Jews, so it can be passed off as 'all about Israel' and nobody cares.

I have been a Labour voter all of my life, but no more post-2015. I will never forgive the people who have voted for him, campaigned for him, and remained in the party. If you vote Labour this time, you are helping to put an anti-semite into number 10, and the Jewish community will never forgive you. And you can rely on the fact that he'll do his best to turn the rest of the country into his beloved Venezuela at the same time, so it's not just the Jews who will suffer...

Bloody well said joanneg36.

It's fine FlashesOfRage, it's a part of my heritage to be well used to disagreement! As such I have had many years arguing about Israel and the damaging effect of policy on the safety and respect of Jews worldwide - I have even, in the heat of an argument with extended family member - been accused of being anti-semitic myself!

I believe Corbyn is a decent and peaceful person and in no way 'endorses' anti-semitism. I am awaiting the outcome of the ehrc investigation with great interest.

I am also highly self-respecting which, by definition, does not require anyone else's validation.

Because I vote for a future not the past.

A lot of Labour voters are in denial about anti-semitism in the Labour Party because they just don’t recognise it.

Anti-semitism is different to other forms of racism because unlike racism against black people, where black people are seen as and treated as inferior to white people, anti-semitism sees Jewish people as more powerful than everyone else. ‘They have control of the media, the film industry, the money’, are common anti-Semitic tropes and now the complaint is that they’re trying to control British politics by smearing Jeremy Corbyn with accusations of anti-semitism. And the people peddling this line sometimes don’t even realise that by saying this, they are using anti-Semitic tropes.

The left is about class and power structures. If the Jews are really powerful and wealthy, then attacking them is punching up, taking down power structures and thus very seductive to the left. How can it be racism when they’re not seen as an oppressed minority? (The holocaust is an inconvenient fact here, hence holocaust denial being popular among anti-semites).

And you end up with the situation where people can say things like ‘I think Tom Watson is being paid by the Israel Lobby to undermine Jeremy Corbyn’ and people don’t recognise it as just another variation of the same old anti-Semitic tropes that have been around for centuries, in a shiny new package.