If the woman wants to keep the baby and the man doesn't, who, in your opinion takes precedence?

[bearfood]

Just that really. Wondering what people's opinions are. Woman wants to keep it, man doesn't, neither will change their mind. What's the solution? Just looking for peoples thoughts really. Am very fragile so please be kind. So as not to drip feed, relationship of 6 months, pregnancy unplanned, couple love each other but can't agree and will probably break up if she keeps it (from what he has said). Pregnancy is 8 weeks along. Man wanted the baby at first then changed his mind. Woman has always wanted it from day one.

Of course he should pay child maintenance. Why on earth should he be absolved of responsibility for a child he helped to create?

Those of you thinking the man is a prick...he has said he is definitely staying with her if they abort, he 'doesn't know' if he is staying with her if she keeps it. BUT. Says if she keeps it and they break up he still wants to be involved with the baby. Wtf is that about? I just don't get it.

Yeah that's quite strange.

It sounds as if it's more about control over the woman than anything else.

If this is you, take some time, decide what YOU want and then do it. The rest will fall into place.

Oh and it's not me...it's my DD and it's honestly breaking my heart watching her go through this. If she wanted an abortion I'd be 100% behind her. But she doesn't, so that's it isn't it? Am I right in thinking an abortion requires a counselling session? 10 seconds in her company and a chimp would be able to suss our how much she doesn't want to abort. But she loves that bloody boy.

Sounds like a prize prick.

Was there an explicit agreement that any accidental pregnancy through contraceptive failure would be aborted?

If so, then yes, he's being forced into parenthood that both parties agreed would never happen, and he can walk away with a clean conscience.

If not, that's a conversation that should have happened basically from day 1 and both parties are equally at fault for not discussing it before having a long term relationship together.

At the end of the day it's up to you, because your body etc, but don't expect him to stick around if you broke your word to him about how an accidental pregnancy would be dealt with.

Keep the baby if that’s what you want. He is playing stupid mind games and sounds really immature. Carry on, there will be support available. If he wises up that will be great, if not you will be fine too.

The woman. Always.

Man's view is that he is being forced to become a father against his will if woman keeps it. Does anyone agree with that?

Nope. Diddums to him. So he thinks forcing a woman to have a medical procedure she doesn't want on her body to suit him is the solution? He can jog on.

This is hard OP. If she lets him force her into this, she will regret it. You know this I'm sure but trying to tell her that in a way that isn't just piling more pressure into her must be really difficult.

She makes the decision and she does what is right for her. If he loves her he will be there and even if things don't work out now, he has a long time to come round to the idea once she makes her mind up.

The person willing to carry and look g after the baby takes precedence.

If he wants the baby and she doesn't, he doesn't take precedence as he doesn't have to carry and birth the baby.

Man's view is that he is being forced to become a father against his will if woman keeps it. Does anyone agree with that?

He isn't being forced against his will. No-one forced him to have sex, and he must have known the risks. If he had sex assuming that his girlfriend would have an abortion if she got pregnant, then he is both stupid and an arsehole.

Obviously 100% the woman's choice. No woman should go through an abortion not out of choice. The man's thoughts and opinions should definetely be taken on board, if both parties are undecided, but ultimately it's not his body, so not his choice. Imagine if it was the other way around and a woman was pregnant but wanted to end the pregnancy, the man didn't... Imagine if she was forced to continue with the pregnancy for his sake knowing that's not what she wanted. It's HER body, not his.

he has said he is definitely staying with her if they abort,

He might find that she doesn’t want to be with him if she is convinced to abort a baby she wants to keep. He is selfish, it isn’t all about him.

Show your daughter this post OP.

Always the woman's choice.

Nobody forced him to have sex. And that's ultimately where babies come from. It's the risk we all take, no contraception is 100%, assuming they were using something.

He's told your poor DD that he'll likely break up with her if she continues with the pregnancy. Top guy. Would she really want to stay with the little prick if he forced her into an abortion? The relationship is doomed either way. Tell her to stop thinking about him and his demands and focus on what she wants for her body and her life. He can either step up or fuck off.

When younger, much younger, I had unprotected sex a few times and then worried that I was pregnant as I didn't want to be. I wasn't but would have made a decision to suit me if I had been.
Then I met a guy who'd done the same - drunken unprotected sex and she got pregnant and had a baby - he hadn't wanted to be a father and hearing his story did hit home - what a HUGE thing to have no control over once conceived. I remember thinking that It was weird that guys were more casual about unprotected sex than women as actually, they have no control over the outcome whatsoever.
However, that IS how it is and how it must always be - OUR bodies, OUR choice.

How old are they?

IF they are as young as they sound then I would be even more sure she should do what she wants to do and to hell with him. Even a long and stable marriage can be broken by an unwanted pregnancy or forced termination. Very young couples rarely last very long anyway, with this on their shoulders I doubt they would make it to the baby's birth still together.

My friend was in a relationship with a man for years and fell pregnant. He basically gave her an ultimatum, to get rid of the baby or he would end things.

My friend has only ever wanted to be a mum, she was absolutely devastated but head over heels in love so she had a termination. She had depression and PTSD because it was not something she wanted.

4 months later he left her anyway. She has been single ever since, that was 12 years ago, she's just too traumatised and hurt to trust anyone again.

She should have kept her baby, fucked him off and she would have been happy now. That decision has honestly ruined her life, because she wanted the baby more than anything. Now she has to live with the guilt of ending its life, not because she thought it was what was best for her, but because she was forced into it.

I hope your daughter does what she knows is right for her.

Both suggesting staying if abortion happens, and staying ( to meddle ) involved in the child’s life are to exert control over the woman. Different circumstances, same outcome.

OP, unfortunately it is a no-win situation if the woman wants the baby AND the man. Of course it has to be her decision, no one should expect her to terminate her pregnancy if she wants to keep it. And very few women would find themselves happy in a relationship with a man who had pressured her to have an unwanted abortion.

It is his prerogative to leave the relationship, and at least that is honest and lets the woman know that her choice is be a single mother or else choose an abortion (and still be single because her relationship is unlikely to survive).

A decent man will know that ultimately the choice is the woman’s, and that he will need to take responsibility for the child in terms if financial support even if he does not want to be in a couple / family with the mother.

If you follow his logic to its conclusion, womens decisions arent their own. So mens shouldnt be. I should be able to force any man in a sexual relationship with me to have a vasectomy against their will, right? Because otherwise theyre risking my being pregnant against my will.

Utter bullshit. No one can force a medical procedure on me. Or any woman.

Does he think she tricked him ie pretended to be on pill but wasn’t, or let him down ie wasn’t taking it properly? Just guessing, based on you saying she always wanted the baby and his attitude that they’d split if she kept the baby but he’d still be an involved dad. Sounds like he might be angry at her.

Regardless though, still her decision 100%.

The relationship is going to end even if she aborts. In fact, especially if she aborts. After the first day or two of him being all lovey dovey relieved with her, she will start grieving, and her resentment of him will grow and grow. If she wants the baby as much as you say, she will almost certainly never be able to forgive him for blackmailing her (because that is what he is doing) into termination. Eventually he will get fed up that she isn't "over it" and she will hate and blame him for the abortion.

On the other hand if she keeps the baby, he may leave or he may step up and have to make amends for putting her through the pressure to abort. But whether he leaves or stays, she has her baby.

Women's choice, but also an easy one if she is sure she wants to continue the pregnancy. Show her this thread. And Good luck.

Woman. Always.

And if he decides to continue to grace her with his presence when the baby is born then he can jolly well be a proper father and partner all-in and not cherry pick the best bits. If he starts yapping "You're the one who wanted it" every time the baby cries/does a poonami/mother lapses into floods of exhausted tears with cracked nipples and a raging infant, or expects to just piss off to the golf/pub any time he fancies and she never gets time to herself because "she's the one who wanted it" then of course he will have been well warned in advance that instead of expecting grovelling gratitude for staying he ought to expect to be told to fuck off and be shown the door. If he can't do it reasonably properly then he can bugger off now and let her get on with it in peace.

He can't guarantee he'll stick around if she has an abortion. She might not want him to or the resentment and heartbreak will cause them to split or they'll just split up because that's what happens. In the ling term she'll regret giving up the child more than giving him up.