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See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Was the OW now the DW - AMA

661 replies

Ivgotasecretcanyoukeepit · 13/07/2018 20:29

I was the OW now the DW so AMA if you’re interested.

OP posts:
greenberet · 24/07/2018 11:20

Op I keep coming back to you I don't know why - I have to put this stuff on here before I get involved in day to day life otherwise it will be gone.

I've said I've posted my story on MN in the hope that it will save someone going from the hell ive been through - who knows maybe this is you - but when you first said you've been reading my posts I became defensive - this the the legacy of trust issues, of having people not believe what you are saying. Of people who are meant to love you treat you worse than the shit on their shoe. Of prossionals ripping you off when you are most vulnerable of parents who are meant to love their kids unconditionally not being able to.

Where I am talking from now is the heart - the paragraphs of crap you refer to - there are others on here doing the same I recognise them. Some people genuinely do want to help you but when this gets mixed with their own pain that they are still dealing with and which then gets triggered by stuff on here - well it gets lost!

I ask about your father because up u til 5 years ago I would have said I had a good realtionship with my DF - this started to change when my Dm died and has now changed to something I struggle to deal with. I chose my x because he was like my DF - he was in some ways - all the things I thought made a good DF - but I have seen my X put his own needs above those of his kids just like my own DF!

It's all documented on my threads. We all do things we think are for one reason - somewhere down the line it may be apparent that it was for a completely different reason - everything is a test a lesson to see where are strengths and weaknesses lie - can we remain"true" under stress under pressure under temptation. This takes great soul searching we have to look at our ugly parts and some are truly ugly but this is the only way we become free the only way to experience what true happiness is!

I can't post my who,e life story on here but looking back now there were times when my marriage could have collapsed - maybe I was not strong enough to deal with it - maybe I felt I always needed someone - maybe I felt I wouldn't cope maybe I felt I wasn't good enough! I suffer with depression - so does my DB my DM Also had MH issues - the only one who did not my DF - well not diagnosed anyway - he has to tell himself a story otherwise the truth will probably destroy him. I don't wish him I'll he is my DF I love him!

We all love as best we think we can - but we are capable of so Much more but our own pain gets in the way - we have to work on our own pain - no one else can take this away - no amount of material trappings can take this away - but it is tough and time consuming and takes courage!

My world got turned upside down - I have explored everything - but I'm still learning too - I want to be able to love unconditionally - to not have my own pain triggered- is this achievable - I know it's achievable if you remove yourself from day to day life but is it possible in the society we live in - I don't know I'll let you know.

You have a lot going for you - you have the outside indicators of a good life i.e. Financially independent a good job your looks but something is still missing - this is in you - your DH is not going to fulfill this part - don the let him destroy the rest of you!

We lose ourselves looking for love in the wrong places - so many women on here give there all and then get discarded - but we are not discarded we have been given a chance we are the lucky ones - I have to start learning to use the right words - words are so important use positive instead of negative - it influences your whole outlook on life!

I have a question for you now but it's for you to answer - do you think that someone who posts on here to the lengths I do would not have tried to communicate with their x when things were not right - or do you think I would have just brushed it under the carpet! I am incapable of ignoring stuff when it matters - someone referred to this as harassment I thinK - and yes my X accused me of harassing him too - but i think it could also be seen as persistence, not giving up, caring about something when there is no actual benefit to yourself!

Have you ever seen someone do this - an act of kindness when they have been through hell and a far worse hell than mine - a compliment to a Down syndrome girl that her hair looked nice died purple - most people shy away from this - don't know how to deal with people who are different - it made her day I can tell you and stopped me in my tracks.

We all make mistakes none of us are perfect - I've made mine - when you can see someone beyond their mistakes even though their pain triggers you you are getting somewhere!

The reason I've been on here so much - I learnt last week that someone who paid me an act of kindness when I needed it committed suicide - his funeral is this week. I don't know his full story but I know he was divorced and had two beautiful daughters - two grown up beautiful daughters - that you would think would give his life meaning - but it wasn't enough - why - if only we knew the answer to this - we all live behind masks - because we are all fragile, we are all hurting all we need is an act of kindness and it can change our whole outlook just in a second. Why this has to come from a complete stranger and not from someone who "loves" us again because our pain is greater when we are with someone who loves us - someone mentioned that we are supposed to encourage people help them grow even more so when you have made marriage vows - how many people can honestly say they are able to do this - not many because we are living in a fucked up world where our priorities are sqewed.

As someone who had to answer that suicide question during counselling - it doesn't come from a logical place - it comes from a place of despair - a place too many people get too but really shouldn't - just an act of kindness and the whole mood can evaporate!

As someone who had to take a telephone call from the school telling me that my Ds had googled how to kill yourself - I have been on both sides - my x dismissed this as a schoolboy prank - who is really going to admit to this - we are supposedly in an age where MH is understood yet people still do not talk freely about this! Suicide is seen as a weakness - the level of despair someone must be at to override our natural survival instinct must take immense strength. Not something that we think about often enough.

Well I have this week - we never know what we may say that may trigger someone else to this point - when we could say something completely different and save them. this is my aim going forward - I shall bear this in mind when my own pain is being triggered because somebody else may be on the point of despair hiding behind a mask.

If anything I have said has caused you pain I apologise! I think I said this before I wish you well as much as I am able to under these circumstances and I mean this because if you read my posts and it turns your life around and is far better than you can imagine right now then it will be worth it - its about the kids - always about the kids!

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726 · 24/07/2018 13:46

Excellent post, Ayn, that last one, and I agree with every word of it.

This thread needn't have gone this way.

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726 · 24/07/2018 13:50

greenberet, I have nothing useful to say other than that I read your last post carefully and I'm very sorry for what you're going through. Truly. Thanks

greenberet · 24/07/2018 15:16

Lying thank you x

CabinFeverShorts · 24/07/2018 19:29

Greenberet, I could almost taste your pain as I read your last post.
Despite your protests, you are not ok. Far from it, I'd say. Please try and get some help. With all sincerity, it drives me mad when the wife is left distraught, unable to trust and full of bitterness and loss whilst the bastard DH just bounces along.
You cannot let your DH ruin the rest of your life. Flowers

AynRandTheObjectivist · 24/07/2018 19:45

greenberet's pain (and other posters') is the kind that a thread like this was always going to dislodge. Doesn't mean these threads should never be started, but if they are, the OPs need to understand where and on what they're walking, and tread softly while they do.

Ivgotasecretcanyoukeepit · 24/07/2018 22:05

Shortstuff
I have taken one period of MAT leave - I didn’t take the full period of MAT leave either
why would I need my husbands money? I don’t my lifestyle would be the same
I never said I have lots of free time, far from it. I am organised and I am lucky enough to have flexibility to work from home and I have a lot of help!
I work Monday to Friday. Plenty of time to have my nails and toes done twice per month. My hairdresser comes to my home 3 times per week to blow dry my hair i then maintain this at home with rollers etc and style/wash my own hair if needed. I go to the gym for 6am 5 days per week and will have a PT session then. I have a spray time every week on a Thursday evening. Massages and facials are twice monthly easy to fit in. I don’t see how that is so hard.

As you live in the former matrimonial home (I know now it's your matrimonial home) did you redecorate and buy new furniture before you moved in? yes completely redecorated and new furniture.

If so, what did DSD think of the change to her home? she was fine.

Has EW commented on the changes? no

Did you not want to move and choose something together as a fresh new start? yes

What is it about your home you love the most? I hate it but I have made it the best home I can

Do you use the same Christmas decorations or did EW keep them? Haha no they went in the trash apart from the ones DSD has made

greenberet
I am on here late at night as I will be completing work at the same time. Yes sometime I will be feeding my babies.

Ayn
I certainly didn’t say I was gorgeous. Believe what you want to believe but if my life is devoid of excitement As you say I certainly wouldn’t be looking for it on the Internet. I also don’t have my face poly filled ShockAngry

GreenBeret
Firstly what a beautifully written post this brought tears to my eyes I am very sorry for everything you have been through and are still going through.

Secondly I would actually like to apologise, it won’t mean anything to you but my previous replies have been unnecessarily nasty.

What your husband has put you through is disgusting and I understand now why your posts have been worded the way they are. I would like to think it has been resolved and you have had the outcome you deserve (I don’t know this as couldn’t find any recent posts)

I do not think your paragraphs are crap and I should have never written that as I say you’re a beautiful writer and

My relationship with my dad is good we have always been close I am a daddy’s girl but he wouldn’t speak to my husband for months when we got together as he was disgusted and it strained our relationship for that period. I am sorry to read about your own father my parents are my biggest support system and they are everything to me which is why I do everything I possibly can to make sure my DSD doesn’t feel unloved or unwelcome.

Sorry to read about your son I cannot imagine what it would be like to recieve that phone call. I hope he is in a a good place now.

Again it is me who should apologise not you. I wish you well and hope you find peace Flowers

OP posts:
AynRandTheObjectivist · 25/07/2018 07:28

You what, OP?

I certainly didn’t say I was gorgeous.

Well, I saw this on Monday (and it still makes me cringe, la la la Ragu, brings the Italian out in yoooooooou....):

HAHA when my body is gone. Darling that is why I spend a fortune on personal training to ensure that doesn’t happen. I’m half Italian and by looking at my parents I will more than likely keep my looks thank you.

So this wasn't you boasting about how gorgeous you are? What was it then? What am I misinterpreting this time?

Believe what you want to believe

Why thank you.

but if my life is devoid of excitement As you say I certainly wouldn’t be looking for it on the Internet.

Well actually what I said, explicitly, more than once, was that you ARE seeking to relive this excitement on the internet...but this might be a punctuation fail on your part. It wouldn't be your first howling written error on here. Which again makes for dim viewing of your claims to be some sort of super career woman whose success is completely unaffected by being under 30 and having babies so young they still need night feeding. Indeed, being married to a director is apparently a hindrance to your progress.

Like I said, OP, if my life were as perfect as you claim yours is, I wouldn't be as brittle and defensive as you are about it. And I certainly wouldn't be stung into making such a serious denial to a comment about facial Polyfilla...

Fivelittleduckies · 25/07/2018 07:45

If a new, attractive, young and confident employee started at your work do you think you would be less inclined to work from home and more inclined to work from the office...

Surely after your own experience there is an area in which you would develop your own trust issues towards your DH?

If he starts to have increased work commitments for example.

Knowing what he’s capable of doing whilst at the workplace surely those seeds of doubt will begin to sprout as the time passes and differenrt life stresses emerge.

Question: when you were having the affair at work, did any other colleagues know about it/cover for you or him?

greenberet · 25/07/2018 08:35

ive - do you have twins?

Thank you for your apology - yes it does mean something - this is all I was looking for - not just for my benefit but to all those who have also been through this - I have chosen to post more or less everything on here - as normally depression is in full swing and it helps get it out my head. But I also have no qualms about my identity or what I post - I no longer feel the need to hide behind any mask - this is me warts and all!

Maybe others have been lees open with their information which they have every right to be - but they have still been through hell - some are still going through it and I think all we ask for is some recognition of this- most of us will never have got it from DH never mind OW - we are not all bitter ex wives _ we have been hurt in the most cruelest way - most of us will have found death of XH easier to deal with!

There are no recent posts as I am still not out the other side - still battling legal team that let me down, still dealing with uncommunicative x - just trying to gain some "space" whilst kids are on holiday before it will all kick of again come September.

I too was a daddy's girl - had tremendous support from my parents too - it all started to change as my DM died!

this is the first post that has shown a "human" side to you - I hope your DH is having some counselling to sort out his issues - he needs to work out the route of his pain!

Keep yourself strong - this needs to come from the inside out though - work on this too!

greenberet · 25/07/2018 09:20

To all the women who have been cheated on please look at this - we want to believe the fault is not with ourselves - we have to for our own sanity - but maybe deep down still have some doubts - this sums it up pretty much - recognise this - recognise that the pain is within him - not us - forgive the pain he caused to us for his suffering was greater than ours - the only person he really cheated on was himself - we have been set free - we have been given another chance - but to stand any chance of happiness we have to believe this fully!

Was the OW now the DW - AMA
Robin2323 · 25/07/2018 15:25

Fair is fair.
The op's last post was very open.
Thank you.

Graphista · 25/07/2018 16:08

Thank you op for finally acknowledging the pain we feel/felt.

Greenberet that was an excellent and very moving post.

I get why you like the poem on the pic you posted, but my experience has been different.

I don't need a man or anyone else to hold my crown, I'm perfectly capable of wearing it fully jewelled myself.

My ex stuck by his story that he and ow/2nd wife didn't sleep together until after I kicked him out for almost a decade! Despite me having seen text messages, emails and other evidence that made it clear what was going on. AND her having his child 7 months after we split (he tried to claim baby was premature although baby and mum went home day after birth etc).

I KNEW the truth - but him finally acknowledging the truth was still a sort of relief, confirmation, endorsement of all I'd said to him on the matter.

The irony was the REASON he told me - he wanted to get back together, he was feeling their marriage wasn't going well. I led him to believe I would consider it ONLY if he was completely honest about his side of things at the end of our marriage. It led to even more things falling into place in my mind and confirmed what I already knew. I then made clear to him I would NEVER consider taking him back, not only because of how he'd behaved and treated me, but mainly because of his behaviour regarding our daughter.

He's still with wife 2 but repeatedly cheats on her, which she knows. One affair was with her supposed best friend and that blew up big style! They separated for a short time and then got back together. She had him on a very short leash for a while but then things went back to their normal.

She has her own way of dealing with it which I wouldn't choose. I have it on good authority both are miserable, which actually makes things worse - because that means he destroyed our marriage for no good reason.

Some cheats 'only' cheat once and get together with that person and that's that. But others like my ex, and I suspect op's dh (given his history) are serial cheats and never change.

I've a few friends my age who have parents that are/were serial cheats, and that's why they are children of divorce. They're all now late 60's/early 70's - and alone. They no longer have looks or status to trade for a relationship, their children (in some cases a fair number of children) have little to do with them because of the hurt they've caused which of course means they've missed out on relationships with grandchildren too.

Actions have consequences.

I'm off to wear my bejewelled crown with dignity Smile

Periwinklethekittycat · 25/07/2018 17:34

Graphista I think that was an excellent post, and thank you for acknowledging that sometimes people just cheat once and that’s it. I think that’s something people lose the sight of.

I also agree that we definitely don’t need any man to be complete. Happiness is within ourselves not found in someone else :)

DaisyTwirl · 25/07/2018 18:02

Happiness is within ourselves not found in someone else :)

YY to this!

Mytwistedimagination · 25/07/2018 22:17

Believe what you want to believe

This is not a personal attack directed or you OP, but every single time someone has said this to me, it has been dismissive and arrogant. Basically saying they have given their version of events (whether true of not) and don't care if it's believable or not. Funnily enough, it's also what the pos OW told me when I asked her a q about dh, and she turned out to be lying.

A small point perhaps, but this phrase doesn't encourage trust in your (or anyone's) words, appearing to come from a very self centered place.

greenberet I admire you for being so eloquent and open about the devastation affairs and associated lies have on the betrayed partner. You are obviously much further along in the healing process than I. Good for you, you deserve all happiness. Flowers

Ivgotasecretcanyoukeepit · 25/07/2018 22:49

If a new, attractive, young and confident employee started at your work do you think you would be less inclined to work from home and more inclined to work from the office...
I won’t change my work pattern as it fits in with my babies. I know what you’re are getting at and it is definitely a fair question but if my husband wants to look elsewhere then I cannot stop that and I will not put my self in a position where I am watching his every move. It would drive me crackers

Surely after your own experience there is an area in which you would develop your own trust issues towards your DH?
Absolutely. I don’t think he would cheat however do I hand on heart 100% trust him? No I don’t.

If he starts to have increased work commitments for example.
He wouldn’t get away with that as we work for the same company.

Knowing what he’s capable of doing whilst at the workplace surely those seeds of doubt will begin to sprout as the time passes and differenrt life stresses emerge.

Question: when you were having the affair at work, did any other colleagues know about it/cover for you or him?
to my knowledge no they didn’t know at the time but I would have thought they would have put two and two together once they knew we were together

OP posts:
blueshoes · 25/07/2018 23:19

OP, I agree you cannot trust your dh 100%.

He made the first move on you. He by then already had at least one long term affair behind him whilst married. The only difference was that he married you, but that could be due to timing as much as love.

There would be less risk of history repeating itself if he did not make the first move, if he did not have an affair before you, and if that affair was just a roll in the hay, as opposed to a long term affair.

The fact is, once you become like his ex-wife (which you will, if not already, like a comfortable pair of socks) and start to lose your looks, there is very little to stop history from repeating itself. Your dh has form writ large. Your whole raison d'être is based on why you won't make the same mistake as his ex-wife.

I think you know that. That is why you keep up your looks and career and stay financially independent. That is probably why you also stay in the same company as him even though the marriage has hindered your career. Is it to keep an eye on him? Unfortunately, men can easily find ways to hide an affair. Does he travel for work? How did he hide his affair with you and your predecessor from his wife?

It cannot be easy always having to look over your shoulder at the next hot new intern. Your battle with time is I am afraid a losing battle, as other women on here who are now later in life knows what age does to looks and sexual attractiveness no matter how much time or money you throw at it.

You are on the right track. Look after yourself. The world will become ever less and less your oyster.

Ivgotasecretcanyoukeepit · 25/07/2018 23:21

@GreenBeret

yes I have twins.

There are no recent posts as I am still not out the other side - still battling legal team that let me down, still dealing with uncommunicative x - just trying to gain some "space" whilst kids are on holiday before it will all kick of again come September.

I am very sorry to hear that you are still having to fight for what is rightfully yours. Someone up thread asked how is it that women either suffer or they sacrifice the most when a man cheats, this really resonated with me and I thought of that today when I read your post. It’s cruel that you are left fighting for what is rightfully yours when your husband is the one that that should be held accountable. I hope you don’t find this hypocritical coming from me but I was shocked when I read what you had been through. How you can be so forgiving is a testament to you and your own strength

I certainly do not think you’re a bitter ex wife. I am ashamed that I wrote that, I get very defensive when I feel judged and I do come across cold when I write. I definitely need some lessons from you.

OP posts:
otterturk · 26/07/2018 00:16

OP, this has nothing to do with your situ, just my own two penneth. For what it's worth I'm glad that from such pain has come real love.

I was the OW. I fell in love with my university tutor at 21. He left his wife, who was in her early 40s. No kids.

I felt victorious and proud. God I loved him. It took my until two years ago (30 now) to get over him, finally, after him dipping in and out of my life without a second thought for my broken soul. My shame kicked in four years before my pain faded.

In retrospect, I was an arrogant, messed up idiot. I lost a paren young, went to boarding school. I just wanted to be adored and loved. We had much in common, he even helped with my MA and then PHD scholarship application. I thought he was everything. In return he broke me; the minute I wasn't exciting he moved on. It broke me, I can't express how much.

I would never, ever do anything like it again. I feel shame, but glad that I've grown up and become smarter, kinder.

Affairs are awful. You're doing well to salvage good from awful. But Christ, they can ruin every9ne.

SantaClauseMightWork · 26/07/2018 01:39

She doesn't believe children can be affected long term by this - that takes a special kind of myopia

This is why bothered me too. If you don't get even this, what else have you missed potentially?

Greenberet
I think it was me who wrote the point about spouses growing together by helping their OHs every single day in the best possible ways. This was then connected to the point I wrote asking OP how she respects a man who didn't do that? OP completely missed the point. I do believe that a lot of marriages ail because people don't put in enough time and efforts to grow together. They divide their lives according to the logistics or convenience and end up growing apart. It takes efforts and very hard work to align everything to the point where people respect their spouse enough to make it their ambition to grow together, no matter what.
That is why I don't buy that OP respects her husband because he stayed in a loveless marriage apparently.

greenberet · 26/07/2018 09:56

My stress is at an all time high today I'm blubbing writing this - I also feel like I could go into full on panic attack - I know why this is I have too many things going in at once - the funeral is today - I have a hospital appointment to find out why I'm in pain from hips down my legs - I expect it is strass - its always stress - I don't know why I'm writing here - normally I would have started my own thread but these days all I get is a bashing - funny how I end up feeling I get more understanding on here than anywhere else - I realised last night I haven't spoken to my DF since Father's Day - he doesn't phone to see how I am - cue more blubbing last night - Dd who had just returned from holiday couldn't work out what the fuck was going on

The planets are all over the show at the moment culminating in a blood moon today with an eclipse - this is significant!

I will come back later sometime to explain myself right now I'm preparing to run away for a bit - last minute break - feels like I'm saying fuck it I've had enough - why can't I see this as positive?

ive I saw the bit that said twins I knew this - I have twins too - and I refer to them as " my babies" - are you me? - this thread could freak me out - it seems too coincidental to be true - lots of similarities - lots of freaky stuff - I do believe in this stuff or you are one very clever troll! See I can't even take this at face value anymore can't take anything at face value anymore cos when I'm like this I feel someone is waiting to stab me in the back again

I read somewhere the other day that depression is a form of brain damage - too fuck it is - I haven't looked into what causes it - I have something going on in my head telling me it is to do with the developing brains of children - that when they do not get unconditional love - this is the resulting consequences - if this is anywhere near right we are all fucked - we need to change big time - so many fucked up nonsense going in in the world! we have to love that's all very fucking simple if we get it right - fucking disasterous when we don't !

Ok ive spilled my guts now need to pick up and carry on x

AynRandTheObjectivist · 26/07/2018 12:42

I wish I could do something to help you, greenberet . Please know that your pain is acknowledged and known, and people do care.

SantaClauseMightWork · 26/07/2018 14:48

Greenberet
Write away! Writing always helps.
Don't be so hard on yourself. You have done your bit of hard work. I really hope you have good things coming your way. Look at it this way: if this is rock bottom, the only way is up after this, isn't it?

fizzthecat1 · 29/07/2018 00:57

OP he's just going to cheat on you / leave you for a younger model eventually. People like him don't change.

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