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To be baffled by and disappointed with the amount of transphobia on MN?

(1000 Posts)
ShutTheFuckUpBarbara Sun 26-Feb-17 11:02:22

I know I'll get flamed for voicing my opinion on this, but I don't care.

I just don't understand why there is so much hatred for trans people on here.

Yes, some trans activists are extremists and no I don't agree with them, but should all other trans people suffer because of them?

I get that there are issues that need to be addressed, as highlighted by recent items in the news and recent threads (which prison should trans people be sent to, can a MTW be a girl guide leader and various others). I don't have a solution for these, but I feel that as a society we should work together to make it work, rather than just spout hatred and insults.

It is especially disappointing as there are a lot of people in the trans community suffering mental health issues, often as the result of how they are being treated, and MN is usually a safe haven for people with MH issues.

I used to enjoy reading the Feminism chat (or most of it anyway), now almost every thread on there is transphobic sad

Most of us here are women, a lot of us are from ethnic minorities, or have a disability, a lot of us have been discriminated against, we know what it feels like so why do it to others??

Rugbyplayersarehot Sun 26-Feb-17 11:05:07

Is there though? I think mumsnetters are a tolerant bunch on the whole.

AlistairSim Sun 26-Feb-17 11:05:40

I don't think I've seen any actual transphobia on MN. Have you reported it? MNHQ are generally very good at deleting anything that breaches guidelines.

Lweji Sun 26-Feb-17 11:07:54

Perhaps you could address each specific case of transfobia on the threads instead of a vague accusation on a separate thread?

What do you classify as transphobia?

talidinozzo Sun 26-Feb-17 11:07:59

I broadly agree with you, there have been a number of offensive comments made on here towards the "trans community". That said, I do understand some of the concerns people have as well. It's difficult because I can see both sides of the debate and I'm not sure there's a perfect solution as to what rights different groups should have.

Elledouble Sun 26-Feb-17 11:08:23

Because a lot of transactivists are actively discriminating against women.

They want to wear dresses and use make up and call themselves female names (fine) so that means that "cis" women have to shut up, roll over and allow them access to female-only spaces (not fine). It's the epitome of male privelidge that, as usual, their desires trump our needs.

Anyway this is probably a TAAT so it'll be zapped soon.

formerbabe Sun 26-Feb-17 11:08:47

I don't think there's transphobia on here.

There's plenty of discussions though on the erosion of women's rights in relation to this issue.

PlayOnWurtz Sun 26-Feb-17 11:09:26

Trans actively encourages gender stereotyping
Trans movement is anti women

BevGoldbergsSister Sun 26-Feb-17 11:09:40

What you are reading is not an attack on transsexual people.

The only thing you will find is genuine sympathy for anyone suffering body dysmorphia.

But questioning the trans activists is interpreted, wrongly, as transphobia.

How do you feel about the new equalities legislation?

Are you happy that you will no longer be able to hire someone by sex? So your son could not request a male doctor for an intomate examination? A young girl could not hire female carers to bathe her, but instead would get someone who identifies as female.

How do you think this will affect women in refuges? Do you forsee it causing any problems if women fleeing violence can not go to a women only space?

Or is it transphobic to ask these questions?

ShutTheFuckUpBarbara Sun 26-Feb-17 11:11:15

It's not a TAAT, and yes I have been reporting.

This is mostly motivated by the Feminism chat today where the mood just isn't very friendly.

Amandahugandkisses Sun 26-Feb-17 11:11:23

I think this site is one of the rare places Women feel like they can express concern over trans issues without being shut down or threatened. It makes for interesting reading and I've learnt a lot. I've personally never read anything transphobic on here.

BeyondUnderthinking Sun 26-Feb-17 11:11:26

I don't believe in a scientifically unproven lady brain any more than I believe in god or the tooth fairy. I won't pretend I do simply to be "nice", when it is detrimental to both sexes.

BridgeRiverTower Sun 26-Feb-17 11:13:17

Please report transphobic posts. So far Ive never seen any but please do report.

Do you have specific examples? A "mood" is your impression and not necessarily transphobic.

ShelaghTurner Sun 26-Feb-17 11:13:39

Elledouble hear hear!

Shoxfordian Sun 26-Feb-17 11:13:46

I agree with the OP
I've seen several threads with a distinct lack of compassion or understanding for others about this issue

Keeptrudging Sun 26-Feb-17 11:14:05

Yes, it's about erosion of women's rights. I would defend to the hilt people's rights to choose how they live/dress/identify themselves, as long as it does not harm others' ability to do the same. Radical transactivism can be/is harmful to girls and women.

Secretspillernamechange Sun 26-Feb-17 11:14:29

YABU. What is ridiculous is that debates about women's rights and voices (or lack thereof) are called transphobic, and that attempts to raise other points of view on social media outlets cause a flood of abuse and hate towards the women who dare voice them.

ToastDemon Sun 26-Feb-17 11:14:37

Unfortunately it's impossible to "work together as a society" when even the mildest dissent from the transactivist dogma gets yoy branded as a transphobic bigot.

ShutTheFuckUpBarbara Sun 26-Feb-17 11:15:01

BevGoldbergsSister these are very valid concerns and I have been giving a lot of thought to these issues lately. I genuinely do not know where I stand on some of them.

I agree that there is a lot that needs addressing, and that it's not easy for anyone involved. I just wish more people discussed it in a civil manner like you have.

Soubriquet Sun 26-Feb-17 11:15:21

Any outright transphobic posts have been deleted like they should be

But most isn't transphobic

It's women challenging others to stop rolling over and accepting everything as fact

It's fighting for us to have our own space and not being taken over by everyone

Why do women's bathrooms have to make way for everyone and their dog but men's get to stay as men's?

OurBlanche Sun 26-Feb-17 11:16:31

I think what you are referring to is the headache inducing cognitive dissonance caused by the recent transactivist 'extremist' actions.

Feminism, most feminists, most posters, me included, do not have any issue at all with gender dimorphism, transgender as a 'thing'. Trite as it sounds I have a few trans friends and like to think I understand some of their issues.

But there is then there is the recent platforming that seems to demand that a man at any stage in his trans journey - from saying out loud "I am a woman" to full gender reassignment surgery - is to be considered "a woman" with all the female assumptions being taken as granted. Anyone who disagrees, tries to point out that there may be some issues with blindly accepting this as the truth, is immediately attacked, labelled TERF etc.

So you have the odd scenario where a man who has chosen to call him self a woman is, in some places, claiming, and being given, more of the sex discrimination protection and rights than the females it was written for.

That there seems to be no way, as a woman, to write or speak about this without sounding TERFy only compounds the issue. But, as I am sure you have gathered from even a cursory glance at the trans threads, some of the issues raised make the Gordean Knot seem like a child's game!

FishInAWetSuitAndFlippers Sun 26-Feb-17 11:16:36

There isn't a lot if transphobia on here at all.

The very few posts that are are zapped immediately and usually pop up from people who sign up and it's within their first few comments.

Yes, some trans activists are extremists and no I don't agree with them, but should all other trans people suffer because of them?

Transgender people are suffering because of them. There is now very little mental health help for transgender people because of them.

On a personal level the lovely people on the feminist boards have been supporting me for months and months and sending lots of information so I can support my transgender child. They have been neutral with their support, and have never once been insulting or transphobic at all.

It is possible to disagree with the transactivists agenda and not be transphobic.

NiceMoustache Sun 26-Feb-17 11:16:43

Hate isn't a different opinion luv.

AYankinSpanx Sun 26-Feb-17 11:17:05

They want to wear dresses and use make up and call themselves female names (fine) so that means that "cis" women have to shut up, roll over and allow them access to female-only spaces (not fine). It's the epitome of male privelidge that, as usual, their desires trump our needs

I think this probably encompasses what many people feel. I disagree that there is 'hatred for trans people.'

TiggyD Sun 26-Feb-17 11:17:08

There is no transphobia on Mumsnet. Lots of people who aren't trans will tell you that.

hmm

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