Update: Called to HR for behaviour at an after-work event.

[DrLoveHandles]

Morning MNers. I wanted to say a massive thank you to people who replied to my panicked thread on Tuesday about being called to HR. And thank you to people who DMed me as well. It was such a big help to get some perspective and to know how to prepare. Thank you!

Here’s the original thread: Page 40 | Called to HR for behaviour at an after-work event. Thoughts, please... | Mumsnet

Right, an update:
I had the meeting with HR this morning. It was a fact-finding meeting. I took a colleague from another department who made copious notes.

Basically, a complaint has been lodged against the guy who asked me “Why aren’t you drinking?” because he made inappropriate and unprofessional comments to a junior female member of staff after I’d left the drinks reception last week.

In response, he’s lodged a counter-complaint to say that he was ostracised and bullied at the event by several women. I am one of the women he's named, saying that I spoke unprofessionally and condescendingly, citing a couple of Respect At Work type policies. He hasn't lodged complaints about individual women but, I think, about the event and event organisers itself saying that they/it created a non-inclusive and hostile atmosphere for men, partly perpetrated by the women who were mean to him. The event itself was about a "woman's issue" so, yes, it was mostly of interest to women.

HR wanted to hear my side of the story which I told them as recommended by several posters (thank you again!). I told them he asked me an intrusive and unprofessional question which could raise issues re. several protected characteristics. I told them that I tried giving “soft no” answer as a social cue to avoid social awkwardness or embarrassment (i.e. the thing he’s accusing me of), then moved to be firm and clear (as taught on the leadership course) before I left the conversation.

I said that if my experience is anything to go by, his perception of being “ostracised” or “bullied” is very likely to be women setting professional boundaries – there are a few policies that talk about this which I cited.

HR said that its very unlikely his complaint will go anywhere, but they have to hear everything that happened that evening and fully investigate. I’m just waiting to hear back about that.

They’re going to use what happened to me (him persistently asking why I’m not drinking) as evidence of a pattern of his behaviour that evening in support of the original complaint about him.

Sounds like a very positive outcome @DrLoveHandles .

For you that is.

Not for Mr Big Balls.

@viques that made me chuckle 🤔😂.

Well done and thanks for the update.

Good to hear HR doing their job correctly and hopefully the arse will get correctly dealt with. Nice to know you were right !

These kinds are threads are so outing
multiple people involved in RL
Incredible detail provided by the OP

I've omitted lots of details.

They’re going to use what happened to me (him persistently asking why I’m not drinking) as evidence of a pattern of his behaviour that evening in support of the original complaint about him.

HR told you this?

Well unless you have actually fudged loads of details, it is incredibly outing

Well Hr shouldn’t have confided in the Op that going to use what happened to me (him persistently asking why I’m not drinking) as evidence of a pattern of his behaviour that evening in support of the original complaint about him.

Hmm… I’m surprised HR were so unprofessional by giving you so much information and also telling you things like “They’re going to use what happened to me (him persistently asking why I’m not drinking) as evidence of a pattern of his behaviour that evening in support of the original complaint about him”, very odd of them to divulge that.

He hasn't lodged complaints about individual women but, I think, about the event and event organisers itself

HR said that its very unlikely his complaint will go anywhere, but they have to hear everything that happened that evening and fully investigate. I’m just waiting to hear back about that.

It’s also very strange that they’re going to update you when you were seemingly brought in for a fact finding mission rather than a complaint specifically being made about you - very peculiar indeed but it’s very lucky as it all makes for a good update!

Me too. This HR sounds comprehensively unprofessional and… shit

“They’re going to use what happened to me (him persistently asking why I’m not drinking) as evidence of a pattern of his behaviour that evening in support of the original complaint about him” very odd of them to divulge that.

^ I was paraphrasing and summarising. This isn't verbatim what they said.

HR said that its very unlikely his complaint will go anywhere, but they have to hear everything that happened that evening and fully investigate. I’m just waiting to hear back about that. It’s also very strange that they’re going to update you when you were seemingly brought in for a fact finding mission rather than a complaint specifically being made about you - very peculiar indeed but it’s very lucky as it all makes for a good update!

^ He named me as someone contributing to a hostile and exclusionary work environment. If that goes somewhere, of course they'll update me because it'd potentially mean verbal warnings or training or whatever.

Its academia, they are.

Last year, they cleared a man of sexual misconduct despite four separate complaints which included explicit Teams meetings.

I would imagine that this could be literally any university.

confiding in you about their plans for a colleague is grossly incompetent

wouldn’t trust that kind of HR as far as I could throw them

With this situation going on as of right now? Unlikely

Serves him right for being a boundary-ignoring twunt who's tried to employ DARVO because his giant ego popped

Good news 😀

Thanks for the update OP and sounds like you handled it very well !

This is why AI is going to take jobs 🤣 what a massive waste of everyone’s time

Thank you for the update Op.

To be honest it’s irrelevant if you are paraphrasing or summarising - you shouldn’t have all this information to be able to do that.

First of all, they should never have told you about the complaint made against the guy nor who made it / what that complaint was about; especially since you’d already left before the incident and so had no information to add and it’s of no concern to you. The most they should have done is ask what comments he made to you / you witness him make to others without any mention of anything else.

Secondly, they should never have told you that they think he only made his complaint about a hostile work environment “in response” to the original complaint. His complaint should be treated and investigated independently as two things can be true at the same time even if they suspect it is retaliation; either way though it’s no business of yours and they shouldn’t have brought it up to you.

Thirdly, they shouldn’t be saying, hinting or alluding to any information which leads you to paraphrase or summarise everything you have such as they’re going to use what you said to them as evidence to uphold the original complaint. They should have brought you in, asked you what happened with you or if you noticed / witnessed anything - that’s it.

Finally, if there is a direct complaint about you then yes they should follow the correct procedure and not be informally telling you they’ll keep you updated.

Why did he think he had a right to question your choices?
And when proved wronged - complain?

Someone needs to complain about this dodgy HR

I wonder what they’re saying about the Op behind her back

They are being paid for it

We aren’t!

The fact that you used a male pronoun twice in your first sentence should answer the question!