Racist manager

[tothem]

My glasses are broken, so please forgive any mistakes—everything is blurry.

I’ve been working for a local council for about four months now. My team is small, consisting of seven members: six of us on the same level and one manager, let’s call him John. John’s manager is Karen.

Most of the team, especially Karen, works from home. I still work full-time in the office since I’m still in training. I’m also the only Black person on the team.

I’ve noticed that whenever Karen comes to the office for meetings (which is rare), she never acknowledges my greetings. If I mention something to her, like, “Oh, that desk isn’t working,” she just stares at me without responding. She has never engaged with me at all.

This made me wonder why.

Out of the blue, I received an invitation to a meeting from Karen. I was puzzled, as I wasn’t sure what it was about, and I was a bit concerned. Eventually, I found out the meeting was sent to the whole team.

Unfortunately, I missed the meeting, but my colleagues told me she announced that she was leaving due to redundancy and was visibly upset.

I felt sorry for her and struggled internally about whether to reach out. I eventually sent her a lighthearted, heartfelt message apologizing for missing the meeting and acknowledging her redundancy. She read it but never replied.

A few days later, she came to the office again. This time, I chose to ignore her entirely—I refuse to allow myself to be ignored as she has done to me in the past. I overheard a colleague talking to her about her redundancy, but I didn’t engage.

Her behavior disgusts me, and I’ve been contemplating the right time to bring this up with John or even Karen herself.

Now, I suspect there may be plans for a send-off party for her. My initial thought is to tell John and the team that while I’m available, I won’t be attending because I find Karen rude, unpleasant, and possibly even racist. Alternatively, I could raise this issue with John or HR when the opportunity arises, though I don’t feel inclined to formally call John into a meeting.

What do you think? Should I simply express my reasons for not attending the send-off, or should I file an official complaint with John or HR? She leaving soon but then it will be on record 🤷🏽‍♀️

I believe you, op, but as she is leaving its not worth making a record for her. One thing I would do when she leaves is mention that she never spoke to you, but spoke to everyone else on the team and other people may well work out rgw the root cause of that behaviour difference and want to publicly denounce it. Can you talk to John? I'd just hope you weren't left in a team which had some prejudical elements to it.
Also shame on the majority of other posters for not even trying to understand how unconscious bias looks in the workplace.

@tothem you say you didn't explicitly call her racist.
Your title is 'racist manager'

A colleague accused me and rest of her team for unconscious bias last year. A black woman who felt she was overlooked for promotions and then went to HR complaining. She didn’t get the promotion because someone else was a much stronger performer. She also complained that we didn’t support her enough or talk to her as much as we did each other. I was baffled and quite upset as had always been friendly, but was friendlier to others in the team (including other non whites) as I just found this lady a bit boring and not my type. Not because she wasn’t black. Not everything is unconscious bias.

Completely agree with Lorem’s advice OP,

And perhaps start engaging with the useful advice like this and don’t bother trying to argue with people who don’t believe it’s racism. Why are you spending so much energy on them? Why did you spend so much energy trying to engage with this (most likely) racist white manager who ignored you? Learn your lesson for next time : don’t tolerate their BS right from the outset. I give the same energy I am getting and don’t pander to people who don’t bother engaging with me.

Your first post wasn’t that clear but your follow up posts have made it clear to any decent reasonable person that there is a good chance it’s racism.

You would absolutely have enough to go on in terms of taking it to HR. I know this based on my own research into UK employment discrimination laws while having successfully raised a grievance (and was given ACAS compensation for racism) before.

Personally I think in this instance you just leave it only because she’s leaving but don’t attend her leaving do.

If anyone asks why just keep it as “ I don’t like the way she’s ignored me”. People can draw their own conclusions on why she did that!

Sorry but it's impossible to decide whether this is racist when only hearing half of it. The woman is leaving. Move on

So as a white person I have to get on with and like every single black person or else I’m a racist? Karen doesn’t like you, stop making it about race.

You’re correct.

The exact same thing happened to me in terms of a white colleague starting after me being treated differently (and actually that’s when it started clicking for me too, that the team I was in was racist seeing how they immediately embraced her compared to me - before she even said two words! ).

It was considered a critical piece of info by HR when I shared this in my grievance which was upheld. That and the fact I was the only black person on the team. There were other evidence too, I wrote a lengthy statement but just agreeing that this particular detail is important.

@lunar1 how do you know Karen doesn’t like op as she is black? Karen might not like her as she parked in her spot, or OP might be editing all the spreadsheets, or Karen’s friend might have worked with OP and told her something etc we don’t know. Why is it racist for Karen to not like OP? Thinking it’s racism is more racist than the original scenario.

No one has to like everyone, but dismissing concerns about racism without considering the context is part of the problem. If Karen’s behavior shows a pattern that aligns with racial bias, it’s not unreasonable to question it. This isn’t about Karen liking me personally—it’s about addressing a bigger issue.

and I’m not suggesting Karen has to like me because I’m Black. But there’s something called being civil and professional. It’s fine not to like me, but it’s not okay to ignore my greetings, fail to respond when I speak to her, or when I sent her a message about her redundancy. In a professional work environment, basic manners and civility are expected. All she has to do is acknowledge me when I speak to her—especially the greetings—even if she doesn’t like me. That’s not about personal feelings; it’s about professionalism.

It’s the way you use those terms - ‘the whites’ for example. It smacks of racism in itself. Can’t you see that? You chose to name this person with a name that is highly charged in the current climate. I doubt that was done consciously but it does indicate a degree of bias against a certain demographic.
There could be many reasons why you feel slighted by the person, there could be many reasons why she does not acknowledge you in the way you’d like to be acknowledged. We don’t know - context is everything. You failed to turn up to a meeting you should have attended, but haven’t explained the context. So she may well see you as rude or insolent by not attending unless she knows the context, Does your failure to attend a meeting called by a white woman make you racist?

The point isn’t that Karen not liking me is inherently racist—it’s about her behavior and whether it aligns with professional standards. Karen is entitled to her personal opinions, but ignoring my greetings, not responding to direct communication, and being dismissive crosses the line of basic workplace civility. These actions can feel targeted, and given the broader context of how race sometimes influences dynamics, it’s reasonable to question whether bias might play a role.

This isn’t about Karen liking me—it’s about her acting professionally. Even if she’s heard something from a friend of hers who used to work with me, that shouldn’t cloud her judgment or reasoning in the workplace. At the end of the day, our roles don’t cross paths, so any personal opinions or biases shouldn’t come into play. For the 1001st time, all she needed to do was act civil, professional, and respectful by simply acknowledging greetings, responding to messages, and engaging when spoken to directly. That’s the bare minimum in a professional work environment.

You've only been there for 4 months and she's rarely in the office, I think you could be right and she may be racist. Or she could have been going through a redundancy process for 12 weeks and has more on her mind than speaking to people she doesn't know. The fact she has spoken to another individual doesn't mean anything. Your language though OP, whites/blacks/Karen, your mind is made up.

@Soontobe60

Thank you for your response. Let me clarify. When I mentioned race, it was to provide necessary context to the dynamics I’ve observed. It’s not about generalizing or vilifying anyone but highlighting a potential factor that could be influencing the situation.

Naming the person was simply to identify who I was referring to, not to evoke any unnecessary controversy. While I am not asserting that her behavior is definitively driven by bias, repeated actions like ignoring greetings or messages do raise reasonable questions. These behaviors go beyond personal dislike and point to a lack of basic professionalism and civility in the workplace.

As for the meeting I missed, context does matter. I had a valid reason for not attending and communicated this at the time. Her response, if rooted in that incident alone, seems disproportionate. This isn’t about accusing anyone of racism; it’s about addressing unprofessional conduct in a work environment.

I also can’t help but wonder why you seem dismissive and are looking for ways to diminish the true context and content of my experience. Is there more to this? I shared my perspective honestly, and I believe it deserves to be considered with the seriousness and respect it warrants—not twisted into accusations of racism or used to invalidate my experience. Standing up for an outrightly rude, prejudiced, and most likely racist manager makes me question if there’s something you both have in common.

Thank you for your response. I understand that someone going through a redundancy process may have a lot on their mind, but professionalism should remain consistent, especially in a workplace. Regardless of how well she knows me, basic courtesy—such as acknowledging greetings or responding to direct communication—is a standard expectation, not an extra effort.

As for her speaking to others, while it doesn’t automatically prove bias, the contrast in behavior is noticeable and worth questioning. You’re right that I’ve almost made up my mind—initially, I was about 60% certain, but that increased to 98% when I observed her willingly engaging in conversation with someone who joined the organization months after I did, while continuing to ignore every single simple greeting of ‘good morning’ or ‘good afternoon’ from me. That stark difference in behavior was what solidified my perspective. She is most probably racist.

Regarding my language, I used terms like ‘whites’ and ‘blacks’ to provide context and describe the dynamics as clearly as possible. It wasn’t meant to offend or imply hostility. The goal here is to address the behavior in question and its potential implications—not to jump to conclusions, but also not to dismiss valid concerns.

Appreciate your response @tothem . There could also be an element at play where her behaviour is part of the reason she's been selected for redundancy and she knows it. There could be history here. My work does an annual cull, dressed up as a reduction in headcount and behaviour is definitely a factor.

@Moonish

I completely understand. The difference in treatment between me and a white colleague who started after me was so obvious. She was chatting with her, while she wouldn’t even acknowledge a simple ‘good morning’ from me. It was at that point that I got the confirmation of what I had been second-guessing myself about.

I’m glad you raised it with HR and that it was all upheld.

Exactly what I’ve been thinking as well. & why I have considered raising it with HR, even though I know she’s leaving soon. It might just help validate their decision and ensure that the behavior is acknowledged, regardless of her departure.

You have evidence she is ignorant and probably a bully. You have no evidence she is racist and unfortunately if you make an allegation or suggest she is, you just add to belief of unfortunately many people that racism allegations are made on a whim just because for example, someone isn't nice, they are a bully, they are ignorant etc or you don't like them.

Please save what are grave allegations for when you have at least some more evidence that reaches a threshold of more likely than not, than you can't think of any other reason when there probably is one.

By the way, I worked in a council environment for several months and found it was full of Karen's, added to another layer of 30% of colleagues that frankly were incompetent which added to the awful atmosphere

I understand your point, but the behavior I’ve observed goes beyond just being ignorant or a bully. While I don’t have concrete proof of racism, the patterns of treatment—especially when compared to others—are concerning. I’m simply highlighting the possibility, not jumping to conclusions. I appreciate your perspective, though.

If she was stating that would be different but all she’s going I’d comment I’m not signing the card as she’s always been extremely rude to me. Then move on because even if she’s singling you out based on race (which I believe is absolutely possible and the amount of dismissal on this thread really shows a lack of understanding of the every day racism black people face) it’s not worth your energy. Found guilty she’d be sacked… well she is losing her job anyway.

Hold your head high and don’t give her any more headspace.

We could discuss all day whether the behaviour is racist, or some other reason for it.

Whether it is or not, if someone has been unpleasant to work with, or has just ignored me, I would feel a hypocrite to go to their leaving do. I would let them know I won't be there.

Thanks for your response and perspective. I really appreciate your understanding of the situation. You’re right—it’s not worth giving her more energy, especially when she’s losing her job anyway. I’ll focus on moving forward and not let it weigh on me.

Yes, I’ve observed the dismissive nature on this thread, (& that's why I have decided to try to respond to each post) and honestly, I’m not surprised by it based on my experiences here on Mumsnet in other posts of mine and others, and in everyday dealings with people. The way people jump to defend and stand firm in support of racist behavior just shows how much further society has to go in eradicating that ugly cankerworm eating deep into the fabric of the nation.

I think I'd have to call her out on the ignoring you thing every time in front of people so she knows people are witnessing it.
Good morning Karen.
GOOD MORNING KAREN.
KAREN, I think you may need to get your hearing checked, you don't seem to hear me greeting you every morning?

Sorry my message was full of auto correct typos. Glad you worked it out.

I completely agree with you. Whether the behavior is racist or not, if someone has been unpleasant to work with or ignored me, I wouldn’t feel right attending their leaving do either. There’s no force on earth that could make me attend or sign a card for her, and I’m not going to make excuses for it. I’ll speak the truth about why I won’t be there, and I won’t sugarcoat it. Giving another reason would feel like indirectly supporting the behavior, and racism (or any other form of bias and prejudice) is a topic that needs to be openly discussed and criticized, not covered up or dismissed.