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Original poster

in defence of working mothers

184 replies

edam · 29/09/2004 23:43

I've been shocked by a couple of threads recently where people have been vitriolic about working mothers. All the usual, lazy, stupid comments about 'why have children if you aren't going to bring them up yourself' etc. etc.
And you know what? It makes me very angry. I have to work to feed my son and keep a roof over his head. Anyone lucky enough to be in a position where they don't have to do that should be damn grateful, not smug and superior.
I really need my sleep after a tough couple of days at work but I'm so incensed about this I'm on here instead.

OP posts:
Thomcat · 30/09/2004 22:33

Actually millipede you have pissed me off a bit. You are entitled to your opinion and your post but it feels like you saying to me ' why did you bother to have a child and still have a life / go out and enjoy your career?' I have said that I feel like a better mum because I get to still be who I was befoire she came along, it suits me. I don't want to stay at home, but I wouldn't say I think that anyone who has a child then gives up their career, and that part of their life, is sad.

Your comment is inflammatory and your not living and let live with comments like that. You do redeem yourself a bit in my eyes by realising that if you have aDD and she has degrees, or not, but has a job she loves, earns good money, she'll have to give that all up just because she becomes a mum

Who says that mums should stay at home?

Why do you think I wouldn't get enough out of my relationship with my daughter by seeing her for 2 hours in the morning, 2 hours in the evening, all day Friday, Saturday and Sunday. The rest of the time she is with my dad or my mum, and btw is a really happy, socialble little girl.

I didn't want this to be about me defending the way I've chosen to live my life but yours was the first post to get to me, no real offence taken , just have to have my say back and hope you understand, what works for you doesn't work for me, no right or wrong, we should be respecting each other not saying 'ohh I don't see how you could'

Thomcat · 30/09/2004 22:38

"mmm really why bother having them" explain to me what's so wrong with having children, loving them as much as you love yours, yes that's right we love our kids just the same, and still having a life outside the home, a job, a creer, whatever. Why couldn't you just say that you prefer the SAH option why did you have to be all "mmmm why have kids", that's just so damn rude the more I think about it.

Bloody hell you've done to me what hasn't been done in ages on MN, dragged me in and me bloody annoyed and upset. I hope you realise what you've said and have the strength to apologise and pour water on this before it gets really heated and turns into a big row.

tamum · 30/09/2004 22:40

Hear hear Thomcat and edam. There have been several ignorant remarks of that nature made recently.

Try not to let it get to you, hun.

MTS · 30/09/2004 22:43

sigh. why can't us mums support each other in the choices we make, rather than insinuating people are unfit parents? There is far more to parenthood than being with a 3 - 9 month old 24/7(or whatever arbitrary limit millipede sets as to acceptability for returning to work) IMHO happy mum = happy family = happy baby.

Batters · 30/09/2004 22:49

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Tanzie · 30/09/2004 22:50

Edam, I'm with you all the way (and thank you for all your support on my thread about dropping off times the other week, by the way).

Millipede, you need a slap!

mummylove · 30/09/2004 22:51

im a sahm, i did work part time after having dd but missed her terribly and could not concentrate, i was made redundant and was so happy when everyone was saying they were sorry for me... i did look into other jobs but have not found the right one.

we do not have much money but we are getting by, i prefer to be with her - thats my choice and i am making sacrifices for it, you sacrifice either way so no way is right just whatever suits you and what you can handle. now that she is a bit older - 18 mths. i think i could handle being away from her 2-3 days max.

i dont think bad of you for working, i dont know you but im sure your a lovely mummy, most mums here are as why do they come to parent websites? But i could not imagine being away from my dd for the majority of the day/week.

but thats just my opinion and i hope it doesnt offend you, you could easily say to me that you could not imagine being at home all day doing baby talk but hey whats for you might not be for me!

Yorkiegirl · 30/09/2004 22:51

Message withdrawn

Thomcat · 30/09/2004 22:52

absolutley. Would Lottie be better of if I made myself miserable by forcing myself to stay at home, doing something that wasn't in my heart to really do, and being around her and being snappy and irritable.

Where does it say that as soon as you get pregnant and have a baby you should give up what makes you happy, ie going to work. Thw world would grind to a halt if every woman who had a kid didn't work.

And what if you can't afford to stay at home, and you have to work, should you not have kids becasue of that then?

nikkim · 30/09/2004 22:52

I found the comments before about working mothers getting a bad press really interesting as i have just finished reading a journal article which analysed media articles and found generallt the opposite to be true. Working mums are portrayed to be the backbone of society,cue the Labour advert the other night "Supporting hardworking families" Working mothers support the economy, they are truly liberated women!, they are a role model for future generations and are nota drain on society. (These are not my views but a summary of those found in the study) SAHM are portrayted as unstimulated, bored and boring spending their time dreaming of donning a pin stripe suitand dashing off into the rat race with a mobile in one hand and a latte to go in the other.

I am a sort of SAHM myself, my dd has a day with her dad ( we are divorced) so I work that afternoon and i work on a Thursady afternoon while she goes swimming with her granny. I used to get quite defensive about my position, stressing that I used to be a teacher and that i work full time as I felt people looked down on me for being a SAHM. I also used to stress all the hard work involved in being a SAHM and that under no circumstances would I watch Trisha! However I have to admit I find being a SAHM just a joy and most of the time bearing little resemblance to work. My time consists of playing with my dd, baking ( being a SAHM doesn't do wonders for your figure) going out for the day or chatting with other mums. ( I am lucky enought to have a partner who comes home from work and helps me do the housework).

nikkim · 30/09/2004 22:53

Absolutley not Lottie I work with many mothers who are miserable SAHM and they tend to ahve miserable kids!

Yorkiegirl · 30/09/2004 22:53

Message withdrawn

Thomcat · 30/09/2004 22:54

See, mummylove can say she prefers her way of life without being offensive millipede, why couldn't you?

nikkim · 30/09/2004 22:54

Sorry meant Thomcat, was distracted by thinking what a lovely name Lottie was!

Thomcat · 30/09/2004 22:58

nikkim - bless you!

millipede · 30/09/2004 22:58

Just for the record, millipede is a working mum. She put both kids in day care when they were six months. Kids were first in, last out every day. She loves her job, but decided 2 years ago that the cost, the running about, the commuting, and waking 2 small children every day to get them to day care, (the same day care that she subsequently found out at had a member of staff that was so vile to her daughter (unbeknown to her) that when her daughter met her again a year later had nightmares for the next few nights), simply was not worth it.
She went on a 2 year career break, worked some crappy job til midnight 3 nights a week after the kids were in bed, and is now back at work job-share. The kids go to her friends house after school one day, and to an after school club the other 2 days.
I'm not ignorant. I'm speaking from my own experience. And that is precisely why I'm on the fence. However, if anyone didn't pick up on my original apology, I apologise again for any offence.

cuppy · 30/09/2004 23:02

I work 3 days a week as a nanny and am lucky enough to take my dd with me , so I am both a SAHM and a WM. I know I am not in the same situation as many of you as I dont have to leave my child.
However, the most important thing is not contributing to the economy , or staying at home baking and cleaning all day, it is the happiness of your child. Which is better - a SAHM who plonks her child in front of tv all day and gives no interaction, or a WM who spend the 4 hours a day she has with her child doing things togehter?
All I'm trying to say is that it is a personal choice and one that can sometimes be very hard to make. I think careless comments can make some people feel very infuriated , as going to work is something mums have often agonised over and in some cases feel anxious - even guilty about.

Who are we to judge????

mummylove · 30/09/2004 23:02

but i would like to just say without offending anyone..ahem - thank you thomcat...

that sahm mothers are not all boring - im not!

im 26, i dont go out much but i go to bars/clubs/parties with friends, i dj now and then

my day involves waking yes waking my daughter (great sleeper) at 8.30am, breakfast then music time and we dance to her or my cds, play some games, she has a sleep whilst i get showered and have my lunch (she sleeps 2-3hours) feed her and then we go to the playground were she plays and i chat to other mums, we go to libraries, museums ic tate modern, swimming, meet up in other mums houses for tea and chat blah blah blah.... i find it all much more fun than work but a big BUT i have not bought a pair of jeans for two years so money is a problem but you cany have everything

i have narrowed all the mums i met down to a few people who before having a baby i probably would have had nothing in common but we have been brough together and they are a lovely group of people who i look on as my best friends - i love them!

and my boss always told me off for going on mumsnet

marthamoo · 30/09/2004 23:04

I find this so sad. I have been a regular on parenting sites (Babyworld, initially, and then MN for the last year or so) for about three years and this is one of the topics that crops up with alarming regularity and always ends acrimoniously.

Why can't we just respect other peoples' decisions and let live? Surely we are all doing the best for our children, and we all put enough guilt on ourselves when we think we're not getting it right - without other people heaping more on top?

It's the 21st century, FGS. Can't we move on? No-one has the right to dictate how much time you should spend with your children, what you should do in that time, how many hours you should or shouldn't work. We ALL work bloody hard and we are ALL doing the best we can. Enough already!

Tanzie · 30/09/2004 23:05

Millipede, now I am even more confused!

Thomcat · 30/09/2004 23:09

So if you're on the fence perhaps you shouldn't have said :

I can't really see the point of having kids then putting them in full time day care from 3 months or whatever. A couple of hours in the evening when they're tired and grumpy and the weekends? Mmm..really, why bother having them?

It's all very well saying 'ohh sorry if I've offened you' , of course that's offensive and on a thread edam started feeling like she had to defend her right to be a working mum and all the other positive, supportive comments that since been posted, your negative, inflammatory, insulting comment above had no place on here to be honest. It was unnesecerry and not at all on the fence.

millipede · 30/09/2004 23:09

Why are you confused, Tanzie?

mummylove · 30/09/2004 23:09

i could never plonk my dd infront of tv all day, i cam constantly thinking of the next, creative and educational activity i can do with her plus she gets bored and gives me her shoes to go out, today she spent over 30 minutes splashing in a puddle with her wellies on - she loved it!

i know she benefits more being with me as i am an active mother, i weigh less now than before pregnancy thanks to my dd she keeps me moving all day, i feel more full filled being with her... maybe if my career had been more creative i would of wanted to go back but i enjoy my life much more and i feel such achievment teaching my child. If i could afford it I would prefer her to be in nursery 1-2 days as it sounds such fun. From next week I am going to take her to playgroups three times a week for more child interaction - i know the importance of that.

Thomcat · 30/09/2004 23:11

I don't think anyone thinks SAHM are boring people the same as I don't think anyone thinks that mothers who go out to work are cruella de ville!

Tanzie · 30/09/2004 23:12

Think I am confused because you have now admitted to doing exactly what you have been slating others for doing. How much did you see of your children for the first two years if they spent so long in day care?

Lucky you, being able to job share. I'd love to work part time but a) the option is not open to me and b) I couldn't afford to do so.