Transgender hate on mum's net

[Steph2002]

I'm just wondering, I see so much hate on here about transgender woman and not a lot about transgender men. Does everyone on mum's net hate Transgender women and if so why? I don't mind sharing a toilet space with a transgender woman in fact my best friend is a transgender woman and she is the nicest person you could ever wish to meet and will protect any woman no matter where they are. I would hate to be sharing a toilet with a hairy masculine transgender man, which seems the way people want to go why? Am I the only person on here that supports trans gender women, if so I need to leave. How many people that hate Transgender women have actually met one and had issues with one I'd love to know.

I rarely stick my neb in to these discussions, but have been an avid reader for years.

I have never seen hatred of transwomen on here, however, transwomen are just that, TRANS women.
I am a biological woman, I am married, with a son, I have a brother, father, uncles, all of these people are wonderful men, however I would never advocate for them to be in female only spaces.
The loo issue is the usual bollocks TRAs come up with.. you are missing the point, how exactly are we supposed to know which people are 'genuine transwomen and which are a " guy in a dress with lippy who is gaining access to our spaces to harm us?
We NEED separate spaces for a multitude of reasons, that isn't hatred.
I personally know 2, lovely transwomen, who are no threat to me,however they are fully aware that they are and always will be biological males and would never force themselves into a female only space, thus they have my respect and love!
I am a short haired, larger lady, I have never worn a dress in my life, I have the delights of PCSO thus hairier than typical and yes, I have been asked once or twice If I should be in the ladies, a very quick conversation ( my voice / hands/ stance very quickly settles that unease, no offence has ever been taken by me, I usually chuckle and completely understand the reason Ive been asked.
Can hand on heart say I have never threatened anyone with rape or violence for asking!

I find it so very odd that arguing biological females deserve and require their own spaces is seen as hatred and bigotry.

Your body is your body. You can’t be born in a wrong body. It is not possible.

you can, however, not subscribe to stereotypes of your gender and present yourself either as a feminine man or a masculine women. Absolutely nothing wrong with that at all. Your body still remains your body- doesn’t require any modification at all.

For those who are saying that men shouldn't be able to self ID as women and there should be some kind of process before they can be treated as the opposite sex do you realise that a Gender Recognition Certificate doesn't require a trans person to have had surgery or take hormones.

A man who hasn't had any surgery or taken any hormones can get a GRC which would allow him to have a new birth certificate issued showing his sex as female.

and that’s where you’re going wrong. No human has ever changed sex, never ever ever.

@MrsMe1978 let’s say you are right, that “people can be born in the wrong body”.

How do we tell the genuine men-born-in-the-wrong-body from the liars who pretend so they can get access to women? How do we keep women safe in that scenario?

The GRA should be repealed. However the Supreme Court made clear that a GRC doesn’t change sex for the purposes of single sex spaces.

What does ‘born in the wrong body’ mean? Is it gendered souls floating down from heaven and some not arriving at the correct destination? Does that mean for every incorrect body there is another counter-part for the right one?

Or have you not just thought about the ridiculousness of that statement?

People on here will claim blatant transphobia is about feminism and ‘men being in women’s spaces’.

however there are also an extremely large number of posts which defend and excuse shitty behaviour from cis males (“he is a good dad, even though he…”), denigrate women if they express any disappointment in others (see any thread on grandparent childcare) and frequently resort to victim blaming (“tell me why you chose to have a child with this man”).

Remember many people here have never met nor spoken to anyone who’s trans, never mind tried to understand the perspective of someone who at their core have felt born into the wrong gender and have struggled throughout their life.

its a way of safely being right wing without admitting so.

Disabled toilets are single use, one person at a time you don't share them unless it's with your carer if you need assistance. Women's toilets are multiple cubicles with shared sink area that you share with all the other users. It's about a valid an argument as I share my loo at home with DH so I can't require single set spaces when I'm out and about.

Yes, all these trans women are certain they have been assaulted by ‘cis’ men despite never talking to them about their gender. Or that we are all ‘cis women’ on mumsnet despite most posters not identifying with typical female stereotypical behaviours. It’s like it’s whatever’s convenient for them…

And it's never changed a person's sex for the purpose of inherited peerages.

I believe that each one of these threads results in at least one “peaking” so do crack on, the more the merrier.

Yes, all men, whether they identify as women or not, can be shitty. Though men who identify as women are several times more likely to be sex offenders than other men.

Don’t pretend not to understand the point.

however there are also an extremely large number of posts which defend and excuse shitty behaviour from cis males (“he is a good dad, even though he…”), denigrate women if they express any disappointment in others (see any thread on grandparent childcare) and frequently resort to victim blaming (“tell me why you chose to have a child with this man”).

Perhaps yes, but I doubt you’d find them on this particular board. I mean for you know the people saying those things could be huge trans-allies.

After all, women, even the millions of ones that are Mumsnet users, aren’t a hive mind.

its a way of safely being right wing without admitting so.

Is that right wing like the communist party?

That's funny because I'm left wing, and I think the majority of regular posters on FWR are too, and I don't excuse shitty male behaviour of any kind, whether it's from a transwoman or a regular man. Oh, and as I've said many times before, my best friend is a transwoman. But apart from that, spot on.

@Steph2002 regarding men being on oestrogen or testosterone-reducing drugs:

Oestrogen in particular is not thought to have the effect of reducing sex drive in men. In fact many studies show the opposite, i.e. increased libido.

Androgen-reducing drugs do reduce libido in most cases. Although this is rarely complete loss.

But this is a complex topic for psychological as well as pharmacological reasons. It is important to understand that rape is not due to sexual attraction, it is an act of power and dominance. Rapists don't have to be sexually attracted to a woman (or anyone) to rape them. Libido may play a role but it is by no means the only factor in play. And in men who are AGP the strength of that paraphilia could feasibly override the decrease in libido in some of them anyway.

In any case, many many men who are pretending to be women and trying to get into female spaces, for whatever reason, are not on these kinds of drugs at all. And how would we know which ones are? We should not have to be making these kinds of judgments when we go into a space which has been designated, for whatever reason, as a female-only space.

I can see at least 3 for the bingo card! We’ve all met nice men and bad men. If they’re trans or not is neither here nor there, they shouldn’t be in a women’s space. End of.

And as I mentioned earlier, there are studies that show men who are chemically castrated often become more violent, and still carry out sex attacks, often using objects to penetrate their victims if they can't use their penis.

🤣

I have to laugh at the ‘right wing’ accusations. My mum was very much of the ‘trans people are lovely’ but also a Brexit leaver and Reform voter. Take that as you will.

But as I say, having an opinion on one topic doesn’t make you part of a hive mind on other topics. That’s very weak and simplistic thinking.

Very few of them have so-called “bottom” surgery.

I have only skimmed the thread so this might have already been mentioned sorry!

I don’t think it’s totally transgender hate. I personally couldn’t care less what you do/wear etc but the social media trans (lily tino, Dylan mulvaney) with there over the top look at me. How dare you disrespect me even though i am disrespectful towards women cause all transgender women to be clubed together (unfairly). But the fake outrage when they are misgendered: the filming themselves in the women’s toilets to prove a point, to be taking women’s roles etc it’s a bitter pill to swollen
and then the sports is another issue girls working really hard to be top of their choosen sport for someone who was a mediocre competitor when they were competing as male to come and be top!!

I said up thread that only 10,000 UK people have had this surgery.