Transgender hate on mum's net

[Steph2002]

I'm just wondering, I see so much hate on here about transgender woman and not a lot about transgender men. Does everyone on mum's net hate Transgender women and if so why? I don't mind sharing a toilet space with a transgender woman in fact my best friend is a transgender woman and she is the nicest person you could ever wish to meet and will protect any woman no matter where they are. I would hate to be sharing a toilet with a hairy masculine transgender man, which seems the way people want to go why? Am I the only person on here that supports trans gender women, if so I need to leave. How many people that hate Transgender women have actually met one and had issues with one I'd love to know.

Cubicles are not safe spaces.

Well if you didn't see it then either you didn't notice - but I guarantee its happened to them. Other women know.

As for others saying you are a man and you don't look masculine - that makes zero sense. Why would that be done by transphobes?? if you don't even look masculine? Your point doesnt make sense.

People do wash moon cups by the sinks though.

also. I can cope with a man in that space due to trauma. Other women can’t for religious or cultural reasons.

I obey the law. Why can’t men?

It would be at least as useful if @Steph2002 defined 'transgender women'

Flat earther and unicorn is in there as well.

I agree, the 'transwomen have been using the women's loo for ages and nobody minded...' argument is very weak when used today, for the reason you've given: it was a rare occurrence in the past.

But what we have now is not the occasional transwoman who thinks she passes being tolerated because it happens so rarely, instead we have a noisy, aggressive and sometimes violent movement of trans identifying men [trans IDing women don't kick up such a fuss] demanding to be let into the women's toilets as a right, but also as a gesture of power, e.g. filming themselves, or writing graffiti to boast about having used the women's toilet.

It's a recent phenomenon, and nothing like the past when most men respected women's spaces and stayed out of them, bar the very occasional one who thought he 'passed' as a woman.

Oh my word. Please tell that to the hormone popping, 'designer vagina' having (his words not mine) transwoman of my acquaintance who does nothing but bang on and on and on about sex, how desperate they are to have sex, how good/bad the sex they have had was, what sex toys they are currently playing with, how frightfully awful their ex wife is for refusing to have sex with them an insisting on a divorce. They were an awful man for 50 years and are even more awful post transition because now they think its OK to drone on about sex to women whereas pre-transition they know there was no way they could get away with spiuting their serial fantasies to a group of the friends wives.

I'd rather they fought for their own spaces. I'm not giving mine up for men, which they are.

But surely you accept that other people have the other view. No matter how hard I try I always see a man whenever there is a trans women and vice versa. I used to work with a trans man and everyone kept using she pronouns and had to ‘correct’ ourselves with a wry a smile. It was instinctual. Maybe we all have different abilities to see the sex of the person we are with but mine is very strong. I can pick out sex characteristics very easily instinctually and so react accordingly. I can’t do anything about that even if I was to try and force myself to override it just doesn’t happen, no matter how nice they seem. I know lots of very nice men who I would feel comfortable in the female loos with because I know they wouldn’t harm a fly. Still wouldn’t suggest they use the female loos as no one else would have a clue they were harmless.

Funny how we are told how ‘lovely’ these men are on the one hand but also how we must have heavy policing in place to protect women because they do not following the law.

If the cubicles are a safe space, then why can't transwomen use the cubicles in the men's? They'll be perfectly fine, right?

This. Why is it my problem to accommodate men?

There is always so much talk of hate about this that and the other on MN. There is no hate around transgender people here - people not agreeing with it and feeling uncomfortable with it is not hate. Women not wanting men dressed as women who call themselves a woman in actual women's spaces is not hate.

It doesn't matter that you have a transgender friend who is nice. Why should the world have to pander to people who identify as the opposite gender, than to those who remain the same gender they were born as? The world has gone mad.

Its a simple concept to understand that, despite your friend being nice, women do not want them in womens spaces. You could have a 100 nice transgender friends, we dont want 100 men in the women's bathroom. Nice doesn't mean good. We dont want any men in women's spaces, and you as a woman should understand the basis of this. Its not hard to understand, nor is it hard to understand that this isnt hate. Its a personal preference that is done in the interest of the safety biological women. Why on earth this group of people think we should jeopardise the safety of women for the sake of not offending others is beyond me and barbaric.

It is mostly male to female transgender people that are discussed on MN, because this a forum intended for women - of course we discuss them moreso than female to male transgender people because they pose more of a threat to us in our spaces. Your point about you'd rather have a man dressed as a woman in a bathroom than a woman dressed as a man is also just preposterous - you miss the fundamental point that: women only want biological women in their bathrooms and spaces. A woman dressed as a man is still a woman, and does not have a penis that they can assault others with.

It is so easy for this group of people and their supporters to throw the word 'hate' around whenever someone has an opinion not in line with your beliefs. That is bigotry, and thats why people view this group so unfavourably. "Let me in your bathroom or im going to insult you and label you transphobic" isnt exactly the most inviting thing to say, is it?

I agree, the 'transwomen have been using the women's loo for ages and nobody minded...' argument is very weak when used today, for the reason you've given: it was a rare occurrence in the past.

They did mind.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC6626314/

This study has it at 5-10% of men who identify as trans have bottom surgery

Given you clearly have Internet access you could have done a website search yourself if you actually cared about facts.

Well toilets are toilets, personally I think do away with urinals, which are gross anyway, and let people pee where they like. So yes.

Funnily enough, men like my husband have said openly they dont care if these men came into the toilets and stayed the hell away form his wife and daughter. I’m guessing a lot of blokes feel the same.

The issue is, it breaks the illusion for the trans lobby that they can’t change sex. Women pretending they pass is part of the euphoria. They don’t care about how comfortable women are, only they come first.

And you know that how?

So you agree that if it doesn't matter, transwomen can use the men's?

Single sex toilet facilities are not required to have the same set up as unisex facilities. They can have gaps under and around doors rather than being an enclosed room and do not need to have sinks in the room. It is not a minority view to not want to deal with menstruation, etc. in a not-fully-enclosed cubicle next to a man or to be concerned about a man using a camera under the gap, as has frequently happened in leisure centre changing cubicles.

And some women do things like rinse mooncups, bloodied hands, clothes, etc. in the sink, yes.

Also: gullible

How common is gender reassignment surgery?
Gender reassignment (confirmation) surgery is more common in transgender men (42 to 54%) than transgender women (28%). Top (chest gender confirmation) surgery is performed approximately twice as often as bottom (genital) surgery. In studies that assessed transgender men and women as an aggregate, top surgery accounts for 8 to 25% and bottom surgery accounts for 4 to 13%. Review study details.

This is just one study

https://www.uvahealth.com/treatments/transgender-surgery-faqs#:~:text=Top%20(chest%20gender%20confirmation)%20surgery%20is%20performed,for%20

Why they are very efficient and a good use of space. Most men have no issues using them

Men’s toilets are disgusting. Why should women sit in piss stained seats, feel uncomfortable and have to worry about their safety for the sake of a minority of confused men?

There’s a lot of words in the dictionary that are objectionable.